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   Undertoad  Wednesday Apr 12 10:47 AM

4/12/2006: Ellsworth AFB foam test

Quick note... if you are linking to this very popular thread, please link to the blog view version instead. It saves resources for the rest of the cellar.org community. Thanks!



How do you figure out whether a foam firefighting system in an air force hangar is set up correctly and works? Well you turn it on for a few seconds, to make sure it's got pressure and everything. First you set up a scaffolding so you can record the event and show the flow coming out of all nozzles.



And then you let 'er rip. After 15 seconds you can see foam is covering all areas it has to, so the test is successful. Shut 'er off.



Uh, guys? Shut 'er off?



Aw crap. Whatever was meant to shut off the system after 15 seconds, did NOT shut it off and the foam continued to flow. After a few minutes...



The foam is a story high and still flowing!



Uh, Joe? you can climb the scaffolding ladder now...



Two stories high.



This is the guy standing on top of the scaffolding.



So they just let it go.





Thanks to xoxoxoBruce for the initial set of photos and then I googled and found a great gallery at Strategypage.



Kitsune  Wednesday Apr 12 10:53 AM

It doesn't show signs of stopping, and I've bought some corn for popping...



barefoot serpent  Wednesday Apr 12 11:35 AM

I'm gonna throw this firecracker under the ol' man's bunk and... WHAM!



sniglet  Wednesday Apr 12 12:04 PM

That's what happens when you put too much soap in the washing machine.



wolf  Wednesday Apr 12 12:16 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by barefoot serpent
I'm gonna throw this firecracker under the ol' man's bunk and... WHAM!
And I'm going to have to put a movie I haven't seen in a few years into my netflix queue.


glatt  Wednesday Apr 12 12:20 PM

Awesome!!

I LOVE the bandwidth the Cellar has now. This is a great series of pictures.



dar512  Wednesday Apr 12 12:31 PM

Wouldn't you think there would be a manual shutoff valve somewhere? How long before this finally got shut down?



Beestie  Wednesday Apr 12 12:50 PM

LLLLLLUUUUUUUCCCCCYYYYY!!!!



Skunks  Wednesday Apr 12 12:55 PM

I wonder what sort of suffocation risk that foam poses. Foam + smoke/CO/CO2?



barefoot serpent  Wednesday Apr 12 01:06 PM

Next time they should have a DJ and some raver chix



ashke  Wednesday Apr 12 01:34 PM

Haaaahhahah... that's hilarious. I wonder how they'd clean it up though.



Elspode  Wednesday Apr 12 02:28 PM

I'm seeing a new-millenium remake of "The Thrill of It All" with Doris Day and James Garner.

If you write the screenplay, be sure to give me credit for the original idea when you pick up your Oscar, m'kay?



NoBarkDawg  Wednesday Apr 12 03:38 PM

mm, neat.. I bet if they jumped in it, it wouldn't make hitting the ground any softer.



milkfish  Wednesday Apr 12 04:36 PM

"You said 15 SECONDS? Not minutes? Sorry, my bad."



Pancake Man  Wednesday Apr 12 06:38 PM

It seems that they just ruined millions in B-1s.
By the way dar, from my days playing Half Life, I have learned that there most definitely is. You just have to battle aliens to get to it.



capnhowdy  Wednesday Apr 12 06:45 PM

Cool.
Reminds me of soaping the fountains in my hometown. We only wished for this much foam.

Also: AMEN ON THE BANDWIDTH. I love it!



marichiko  Wednesday Apr 12 06:51 PM

Kind of made me think of Lawrence Welk. "An a wun an a two an a tree..."

Wonder how they managed to clean up the mess?



Wombat  Wednesday Apr 12 07:06 PM

They're lucky they didn't drown.

Very cool pics.



xoxoxoBruce  Wednesday Apr 12 08:09 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by dar512
Wouldn't you think there would be a manual shutoff valve somewhere? How long before this finally got shut down?
It ran out after about 18 minutes of bubbly goodness.


Pancake Man  Wednesday Apr 12 10:11 PM

Quote:
It ran out after about 18 minutes of bubbly goodness.
You mean bubbly hell on earth.


shiv  Thursday Apr 13 04:17 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kitsune
It doesn't show signs of stopping, and I've bought some corn for popping...
Yes...it DOES look like snow !!!


canuck49  Thursday Apr 13 05:09 PM

Reminds me of an old Rolling Stones video where the band disappears in foam.



capnhowdy  Thursday Apr 13 05:39 PM

You would prolly be very uncomfortable but I really don't think you'd drown. Although if you are like me and are claustrophobic, you could die from a panic attack.



xoxoxoBruce  Thursday Apr 13 07:55 PM

shiv, you sound like you're familiar with snow, and I'm sure canuck49 is.
Welcome to the Cellar, both of you.



Undertoad  Sunday Apr 16 06:16 AM

Guess what folks? I was watching the referrers on this one, and someone had the full story.

http://www.af.mil/news/story.asp?id=123019117

Quote:
Did a glacier melt? Did some kind of ultra-secret government underground lab have a freak accident? Most importantly, which maintenance troop’s head rolled for this one?

Actually, it’s none of the above. Those who have seen the e-mail that seems to be burning up the communication lines across the Department of Defense need to brace themselves: That hangar at Ellsworth Air Force Base, S.D., was filled with foam on purpose.

That misleading e-mail with an attached slide presentation showing photos of the test has caused considerable work in correcting wrong information.
...
The test of the new foam system was conducted Aug. 23. Required coverage occurred within one minute of the system being activated. The test was so successful, the foam reached the observation platform where officials were documenting the procedure.
The Air Force required a minimum of one meter of foam to be achieved in four minutes or less. For testing purposes, the foam was allowed to disperse for the full four minutes.

The observers were surprised at how quickly the system generated the fire suppressing foam, Colonel Singh said.

The system worked so well the exterior door of the hangar had to be opened before the test was fully completed. These events account for the photos of the amount of foam inside and outside of the hangar.

So, did someone have a gross miscue? No. On the contrary, a fire suppression system responsible for helping protect vital mission-essential assets and, most importantly, for helping safeguard Airmen’s lives, worked extremely well. The foam system exceeded Air Force standards, Colonel Singh said.
The article goes on to say that the images testing the ability of systems to handle overload as the images are emailed around.

I guess we learned that as well!

Sorry for anyone who was misled, although that number includes B and myself. The original images that were sent around had some misleading text on them that indicated that everything was unexpected. At least the record is corrected now!


jaguar  Sunday Apr 16 07:01 AM

Is this stuff non-toxic/environmentally friendly/naturally dissipiates?



WabUfvot5  Sunday Apr 16 07:22 AM

Misled? That's what they want you to believe



xoxoxoBruce  Sunday Apr 16 10:43 AM

Quote:
The test was so successful, the foam reached the observation platform where officials were documenting the procedure.
The Air Force required a minimum of one meter of foam to be achieved in four minutes or less. For testing purposes, the foam was allowed to disperse for the full four minutes.

The observers were surprised at how quickly the system generated the fire suppressing foam, Colonel Singh said.

The system worked so well the exterior door of the hangar had to be opened before the test was fully completed. These events account for the photos of the amount of foam inside and outside of the hangar.
OK, so the timeline was wrong and the system did not fail to shut off when it should. That's good news.
BUT;
1- It did not perform as expected.
2- The fact it performed better than expected still means they were wrong.
3- It caught everyone involved, off guard.
4- To fill the hangar and coat the countryside was not planned
5- It's funny as hell.

Of course, as Master Sgt. Dana Rogers said, all that emailing does more damage than the excess foam so, no harm, no foul.
Just Easter egg on their faces.


mtspace  Sunday Apr 16 07:48 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by ashke
Haaaahhahah... that's hilarious. I wonder how they'd clean it up though.
Soap and water?


xoxoxoBruce  Sunday Apr 16 10:01 PM

Welcome to the Cellar, mtspace.
Is that true?



tangent  Monday Apr 17 12:41 AM

> I wonder how they'd clean it up though.

Greetings Private! - Meet Mr toothbrush...

-t



Kagen4o4  Monday Apr 17 06:15 AM

mama mia!



xoxoxoBruce  Monday Apr 17 08:27 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by tangent
> I wonder how they'd clean it up though.

Greetings Private! - Meet Mr toothbrush...

-t
Welcome to the Cellar, tangent.
Sounds like you've been there/done that.


gen131  Thursday Apr 20 11:07 AM

Airmen

Quote:
Originally Posted by tangent
> I wonder how they'd clean it up though.

Greetings Private! - Meet Mr toothbrush...

-t

Actually the Airforce doesnt have Privates, they have Airmen...

And they dont work, that's what civilian contractors are for.




Dirk  Thursday Apr 20 11:26 AM

In response to the cleanup - My Dad was a career Crash and Rescue firefighter for the Airforce and I was a volunteer for a number of years. What is typically used in the foam systems is a form of dish soap labeled AFFF (Aqueous Film Forming Foam or "A Triple F") (there are other additives based on the location or known combustibles in the building, but typically just a non-toxic bubbly stuff to cool down the combustible and slow down the amount of oxygen that can get to the fire. Foam sits on top of liquids like jet fuel and other stuff and doesn't splash it around like just plain water would - think of spraying cold water in a hot deep fryer - not good). All it takes is removing the fluff via fans or snow shovels and then a lot of power washing. You noticed a firetruck in one of the photos? The water cannon on those are a pretty effective power washer. Final thought - the B2's at Ellsworth are spendy. At least with a foam system like this you just wash off the planes and it doesn't damage the special paint and coatings on the aircraft. Also, if you're surrounded in AFFF foam, just swim your arms around infront of your face and you create an air pocket that you can breathe. Unless it's Baricade Foam, but that's a different story and not something they'd use in a location like this.



glatt  Thursday Apr 20 11:33 AM

Thanks, Dirk. Welcome to the Cellar.



comphappy  Thursday Apr 20 11:48 AM

Don't beleive everything you here.
I am an Airmen at Ellsworth and if you want to actually know what happened don't float around blindsided site like this and go read something with believability......

http://www.af.mil/news/story.asp?id=123019117

it was 4 minutes, it did not cost millions in damage to b-1's, and overall the test was incredibly succesful compared to what they wanted. and they opened the doors for the sake of those people standing on the scaffolding.
now grow some brain cells and quit being qullable.



comphappy  Thursday Apr 20 11:53 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce
OK, so the timeline was wrong and the system did not fail to shut off when it should. That's good news.
BUT;
1- It did not perform as expected.
2- The fact it performed better than expected still means they were wrong.
3- It caught everyone involved, off guard.
4- To fill the hangar and coat the countryside was not planned
5- It's funny as hell.

Of course, as Master Sgt. Dana Rogers said, all that emailing does more damage than the excess foam so, no harm, no foul.
Just Easter egg on their faces.
1-NO it performed better then expected.
2-It's a test they didn't know how it was going to perform, that's why they were TESTING IT.
3-true
4-no harm no foul
5-so is the intelligence level of this thread.

Dirk: we don't have b2's that would be a base elsewhere in the midwest, we have b-1's not quite as expensive but still very costly.
The B2 cost rougly 7 times that of the b1.


glatt  Thursday Apr 20 12:06 PM

Hey comphappy, welcome to the Cellar.

You're basically just arguing semantics. If there are expectations before a test, and then the results are different than those expectations, then those expectations were wrong. You're right. It's just a test, so it's no big deal. And it's just a bunch of harmless foam. No harm, no foul, as you say.

Nobody is saying that the fine men and women at Ellsworth are idiots. This thread is just a great picture story. It's funny. Look at all that foam! It's received a lot of attention, which is further proof that it's a great sequence of images.



gen131  Thursday Apr 20 12:08 PM

cost

Quote:
Originally Posted by comphappy
we have b-1's not quite as expensive but still very costly.
The B2 cost rougly 7 times that of the b1.
Speaking of Cost. I just recently read a blurb that says that the B-2's are worth (or cost) more than their weight in gold. I dont know the exact specs on the weight of a B-2, but I know they are pretty darn heavy. That's a lot of gold!


Ahh... Military bluntness permeates the post's of comphappy. One thing about being in the military, is that soldiers are usually not slow to express their opinions or feelings about topics or other people. Unless of course that other person significantly outranks you, in which case you might hold off on your opinions of his character, and stick to opinions of the topic at hand. Except perhaps if you have a good working relationship with him, and you do not take it to the point of disrespect or disregard for his authority.


comphappy  Thursday Apr 20 03:38 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by gen131
Speaking of Cost. I just recently read a blurb that says that the B-2's are worth (or cost) more than their weight in gold. I dont know the exact specs on the weight of a B-2, but I know they are pretty darn heavy. That's a lot of gold!


Ahh... Military bluntness permeates the post's of comphappy. One thing about being in the military, is that soldiers are usually not slow to express their opinions or feelings about topics or other people. Unless of course that other person significantly outranks you, in which case you might hold off on your opinions of his character, and stick to opinions of the topic at hand. Except perhaps if you have a good working relationship with him, and you do not take it to the point of disrespect or disregard for his authority.
Your correct about the weight/cost thing. an empty B2 weighs 154000 rounded up, in gold that's 1.6 billion rounded up, a B2 cost more then 2 billion.

as far as bluntness goes, I got it from my mother but then she was an army brat.

And arn't you the one that said the Air Force doesn't have soldiers it has Airmen. I know you were just trying to make a point, but you could use miltary personnel instead it's more of a generalization as not to offend anyone.
And are you military? you seem to think you know abunch about it. it really has nothing to do with rank but more of relationship between between two people. I have two e-5's above me and I might jokingly call one of them an A**hole or an idiot but then the other one I wouldn't because the one is more relaxed like that, and the other one is all high and mighty disciplined like.


Ernster  Thursday Apr 20 04:52 PM

Haha, those pictures are awesome, regardless of the spin the military tries to put on what happened. Two stories of foam is two stories of foam.

Quote:
Originally Posted by comphappy
And are you military? you seem to think you know abunch about it. it really has nothing to do with rank but more of relationship between between two people. I have two e-5's above me and I might jokingly call one of them an A**hole or an idiot but then the other one I wouldn't because the one is more relaxed like that, and the other one is all high and mighty disciplined like.
I believe gen131 was referring to your insinuations that the posters here, and xoxoxoBruce in particular, have less than average intelligence. Seeing as how you don't have a relaxed relationship with Bruce, who seems to be one of the authority figures on the board, gen131 suggested you should keep your disrespectful "opinions of his character" to yourself.

Just sayin'.


comphappy  Thursday Apr 20 05:11 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ernster
Haha, those pictures are awesome, regardless of the spin the military tries to put on what happened. Two stories of foam is two stories of foam.



I believe gen131 was referring to your insinuations that the posters here, and xoxoxoBruce in particular, have less than average intelligence. Seeing as how you don't have a relaxed relationship with Bruce, who seems to be one of the authority figures on the board, gen131 suggested you should keep your disrespectful "opinions of his character" to yourself.

Just sayin'.
okay, just for the hell of it remark of idiocy removed.

and the comment was in no particular way directed toward Bruce more then any one else that had previously posted in this thread.

as far as authority figure on a web forum?? ROFL-I didn't think this existed. and even if it did, the way in which I speak to my boss who can influence my job security and the guy that polices my web postings have absolutly no bearing on each other.


xoxoxoBruce  Thursday Apr 20 08:47 PM

Hello comphappy, glad you stopped by.
The "Air Force Link" you posted had been already posted by Undertoad in post #25.
If you follow the thread, yes, the original posting had the wrong facts. I was misled and I misled Undertoad. After post #25 the real story was known and that's what I was saying in my post you quoted, that even with the true circumstances known, it was still funny. If anyone is to "blame", it's the overzealous contractor, that supplied the system, for not knowing it's capabilities.

What I found as funny as the pictures is the tightassed tap dancing by Tech. Sgt. Steven D. Wilson, Lt. Col. Navnit Singh and Master Sgt. Dana Rogers, trying to be all serious and military.

If you poke around the Cellar a bit, you'll find we're pretty split on what the military is doing, under orders, these days. But that said, I think you'll find we (99% at least) have nothing but respect and admiration for the men and women that have to carry out those orders.

If you feel personally offended by this thread and the comments in it, you shouldn't.



xoxoxoBruce  Thursday Apr 20 08:59 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ernster
I believe gen131 was referring to your insinuations that the posters here, and xoxoxoBruce in particular, have less than average intelligence. Seeing as how you don't have a relaxed relationship with Bruce, who seems to be one of the authority figures on the board, gen131 suggested you should keep your disrespectful "opinions of his character" to yourself.
Welcome to the Cellar, Ernster.
"Authority figure"? Moi? Naw, just another opinionated bastard that likes to throw my 2 cents into the mix.


Kagen4o4  Thursday Apr 20 09:17 PM

all that hanger needs is some hard nrg rave music and some strobes and lasers.



capnhowdy  Thursday Apr 20 10:08 PM

damn Fly Boys........



KrazFD  Friday Apr 21 12:33 AM

hmm?

I must say comphappy, you came here pretty hostile.

I found the pictures hilarious, and even after finding out the real story, it was still hilarious.



Kagen4o4  Friday Apr 21 03:33 AM

and i keep saying you fly boys crack me up!!



gen131  Friday Apr 21 11:42 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ernster
I believe gen131 was referring to your insinuations that the posters here, and xoxoxoBruce in particular, have less than average intelligence. Seeing as how you don't have a relaxed relationship with Bruce, who seems to be one of the authority figures on the board, gen131 suggested you should keep your disrespectful "opinions of his character" to yourself.

Just sayin'.

Yeah thats pretty much correct.

hmm.. I feel led to explain some military practice and courtesy at the moment. Think of it as my advice, instruction or biased opinion.

Knowing when one can be blunt or not is based on relationship, rank and personal character. That is a part of tact.

Rank does have a lot to do with it, because without tact, your bluntness becomes disregard for authority. In truth, crossing the barriers between enlisted and NCO, you can have a good working relationship, but you are not meant to be buddies on the job. If you think you are buddies with an E-5, then he is either not professional enough to serve as an NCO and should have remained an Airman, or you have not learned proper respect and courtesy or protocol. Just by your description of your relationships you have with your E-5's and your opinions of them, would give serious doubt in the mind of any good NCO as to your ability to perform without question in a situation that calls for imediate action and following of orders from leadership, where lives could be lost due to a moment of hesitation on your part caused by an over relaxed relationship and lack of professionality.

With a good working and yet professional relationship it becomes a jest of fun.

With a person who has a "high and mighty disciplined like" character it could be something to be cautious about. Speaking of which if you think someone has a "high and mighty disciplined like" character, is it the person who has the issue, or a lack of responsibility and personal discipline which causes you to think that disciplined people think they are high and mighty?

One has to question the trueness of one who asks for political correctness so as "not to offend anyone" in refering to Airmen as "miltary personnel" when he himself calls his mother an "Army brat"


Am I military? I'm not the whole military, but I understand your somewhat gramatically incorrect question. I am serving in the military. And I'd wager that my experience is a little higher than yours, and I may have a little more of an inkling of military protocol and behavior, having come into an older military than the soft and easy politically correct military you are used to. I've been where you were, although not so brash and tactless, starting from an E-1, spent a good proud number of years as an NCO and now currently enjoy the esteem of the commissioned status. Listening to an Airmen's explain how the Military works, stemming from his limited military experience and some work relationships with a couple of E-5s, is like listening to a highschooler expound upon the wisdom he has aquired in life. Now if someone comes on to post and can correct or further expound on my theories, and has over 10 years of military service, I would then be willing to concede my opinion over to his wisdom.

I dont consider myself high and mighty, although you might think of me as such, and that would be your perogative. Should you call me an idiot in jest as we work in the field, (Not that you Airmen ever get in the dirt), I would probably return such a compliment in a like manner. If you were to show a tone of aggression or disrespect, you would quickly find yourself crunching out pushups with your feet up on the side of one of those fancy B-1 tires at least 4 feet off the ground until I get tired. If you were to call me an A**hole or anything of the such using a vulgar and unprofessional language, you would definately find yourself with a nice round of consructive and corrective activity.

So to break it down, I think you need to gain some experience before you can tell anyone how the military truly works, and you need to learn and practice a little tact, respect, and keep such unwarranted and discourteous opinions out of your posts.

Any way, those are my thoughts, and opinions. But I could just be an overly conservative, opinionated, and "high and mighty" Officer with 10 years enlisted experience, who has once been there, done that, been in the dirt with the guys, and had too much fun burning things, shooting telephone pole sized rockets with the potential to destroy 1 grid square (1 square kilometer) in one volley, driving track vehicles at high speed, shooting stuff up, sleeping in cramped vehicles for weeks, taking care of soldiers, and wishing the military of today wouldnt be so politically sensitive, soft, stress-free, and allow young people to come into service with no sense of respect, personal discipline, and who think anyone who offers professional correction is merely out to get them and hates them. Not to say I disrespect these types of people. I just dont think they are suited for the military, and the world has better places for such free-willed and possibly free-thinking people.

sorry didnt mean to post so long.

--

Soo.... Back to the image of the day.

I still think a certain level of control was absent and someone wasnt thinking all the way through for it to get so out of hand.


gen131  Friday Apr 21 11:47 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by gen131
I still think a certain level of control was absent and someone wasnt thinking all the way through for it to get so out of hand.
And you have to admit. Those pics are pretty darn funny.

Kagen4o4 is right:
rave music, strobes and lasers, would be pretty cool in a hanger that size.



comphappy  Friday Apr 21 03:22 PM

well Gen,
That was a bit much for a response to anything I said, considering we are on a web forum. but anywho as far as 'army brat' goes isn't that the proper slang term for the child of a Soldier in the army? I suppose proper slang would just kind of be an oxymoron.

I don't think there's anything wrong with an E-4 and an E-5 being friends with each other. As long as he can be my boss when he needs to be (i.e. I'm in trouble). I've even shared a few jokes with my LT and Capt. Are you telling me you never share a joke with the guys even if there a couple pay grades higher or lower then yourself? I've been inside a few officers lounges I know what there doing on friday afternoon.

and since everyone is assured of the truth that this was in no way a fluke and actually great success as far as testing goes.
picture courtesy of a fellow member of 3c0x1.net



gen131  Friday Apr 21 04:25 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by comphappy
I suppose proper slang would just kind of be an oxymoron.

I don't think there's anything wrong with an E-4 and an E-5 being friends with each other. As long as he can be my boss when he needs to be

and since everyone is assured of the truth that this was in no way a fluke and actually great success as far as testing goes.
picture courtesy of a fellow member of 3c0x1.net
Heh, proper slang, or perhaps slang-proper would be ebonics wouldnt it?

Professionally and Personally are two seperate things. Personally I think there is room for good friendship as long as when you walk into the work place it reamins outside, and you only carry in a good work relationship. A good friendship should never get in the way of professionality. Once you reach the NCO ranks you begin to see this more, and it becomes a balance act. This is hard thing in church environments, where regardless of rank from COL to Private, we are all equal in church or in fellowship. But in the work place it is put aside. I pulled my evaluation based off your personal opinion of the two E-5's which seemed to go above professionality. Friendship across ranks can sometimes cause an inadvertant sense of equality or ability to judge those of rank similar to your higher ranking friends. When I was an E-5 my best friend was (still me best friend) was a promotable 1st Lietenant in the Airforce, but we were kinda able to get away with it because we did not work together, and I am in the Army. Our friendship didnt get in the way of profession because we didnt work together.

--

Heh. I imagine it was a great success. With that much foam how could it NOT be a success? All you need is one spout in the middle of base, and if there is a fire on post just let her rip and you put the fire out and everyone has clean dishes!


Kagen4o4  Friday Apr 21 06:51 PM

hahaha nice one comp. its just what i imagined



xoxoxoBruce  Friday Apr 21 10:30 PM

Damn, gen131. I hope you don't give orders that long......everyone would have to learn shorthand.

Comphappy was a little testy, but I assumed this wasn't his first stop. UT said something like 8,000 sites were linking those pictures, so there's a good chance he'd been reading plenty of derogatory remarks about the Air Force and the military in general, before he got here.
I'd give him the benefit of the doubt, anyway.



zippyt  Friday Apr 21 11:10 PM

Gen131 said "If you were to show a tone of aggression or disrespect, you would quickly find yourself crunching out pushups with your feet up on the side of one of those fancy B-1 tires at least 4 feet off the ground until I get tired.
If you were to call me an A**hole or anything of the such using a vulgar and unprofessional language, you would definately find yourself with a nice round of consructive and corrective activity."

MOUNTIN CLIMBERS MOTHER FUCKER , GO !!!!!!!

Try saying that shit to a GUNNERY SGT in the USMC , See how far it goes .
I DON'T think you would like the out come , AT ALL !!!!!!!

Oh and comphappy DON'T be going off on Bruce ( YA Byotch!!!!! ) ,
In the cellar he is an E8-9 !!! (in my hummble opinion )



Weasel Keeper  Monday Apr 24 01:11 AM

RESPECT

To gen131: This is a good scene. It reminds me of my old days in the USAF. This link was forwarded to me from a guy who is a retired US Navy Finance Officer.

Well, now that I am a little bit older and have some bugs on my teeth traveling through life, I have to agree with your take on discipline.

When I was young and a skull full of mush, I did not have much of a clue. As time has passed and I can look back on my time in service, I would not trade it for anything in the world. At the time, it seemed to not be the case, but it is true. There is nothing like comradery and team spirit/cohesion. I have never ever have found it since with any place I have worked. So my hats off to the folks who are willing to stick it out and put up with the juveniles.

Dispite the comments to one another, this is stuff that you will take with you for the rest of your life. I can not tell you how many great people who I have met that have served in different branches from WWII forward and the stories they have shared. NOTHING HAS CHANGED! Just the people and the calendar on the wall.

I have a friend who was volunteer SS from Deutschland. He was a volunteer at 15, yes Hitler youth, the whole nine yards. I have had the opportunity to even hold and read his files and some of specialty ceremonial daggers, etc.

He was a prisoner of war in the English Occupation. He told me stories of reality, showed me pictures of the truth of it over there, you youngsters should befriend some of these old guys, you could learn a lot more than the crap that they force feed you on TV or at school.

One really profound thing he told me was "All living creatures need three things, Food, Companionship & Shelter, and it is not always in that order either, nothing else, everything else is extra, in the regards to living and dying". VERY POWERFULL AND TRUE WORDS.

THINK ABOUT THEM.

His reply about WWII, "What a waste, brother against brother". He has a tremendous respect for life despite what folks want to think of the word "SS".

He was a soldier just like you and he was doing his job. He told me about the unit cohesion with the Officers and the Enlisted. They were tight, yet with discipline and respect for their grade. They ate, slept and died together. TEAM WORK.

He was in a group of youth that came out of basic at the end of the war. They asked for 300 volunteers for SS duty. His job was to destroy tanks. He was sent to Denmark. All of the rest went to the battle of Berlin. He knows of no survivors of that event in history.

He tells me stories of starvation after the war. There was the time he was crawling along in the gravel road bed of the railroad tracks looking for corn kernels in the full moonlight that fell off the cars just so he had something to eat. Eating anything that moved, cats, etc. Finding dead horses, etc and having to butcher them. You have no clue until you've been there. I know I haven't, but I can sure imagine. Things are a lot more fragile than you can know.

So, yes, when the crap is flyin' you better make sure you know whos got your back. It is better to be friends with mutual respect than to be something else. TEAM WORK, it is what it is all about and that is what makes the USAF great!

Thanks for reading my post. And for the folks who don't get it and want to respond with little thought, well, I am sorry that you can't be reached.

Weasel Keeper of GAFB - Ghosts of the Cold War



Kagen4o4  Monday Apr 24 01:50 AM

this thread has been ruined. it started off as a funny situation and has turned in something serious.

SHAME SHAME SHAME



xoxoxoBruce  Monday Apr 24 05:01 AM

Welcome to the Cellar, Weasel Keeper. Interesting insight into the military and humanity.
Your SS buddy's story shows exactly what's wrong with the blind, gung ho attitude, the military builds. By the time this kid (15?) got into action, the war was lost. His friends died in Berlin, needlessly. What a waste, indeed.



Kagen4o4  Tuesday Apr 25 01:19 AM

well... over 350,000 views and only 60 replies. thats more than the "what the fuck" thread. if you google "ellsworth foam test" you get the Cellar as the number one site.

good shit



USAvetUSAFspouse  Tuesday May 2 03:13 PM

Why can't some people just see that the pictures are funny, the thread was funny, and nobody was bashing the military? Apparently there are some out there that have never heard the phrase, "If you can't say something good, don't say anything at all"!!! If I were to make a comment such as "I bet if a certain someone shoved a lump of coal up his butt he would shit a diamond", would that fall under not saying something good? Oh well, one can't always stick to saying the nicest things.
Can someone please end this thread with a good joke somehow involving large quantities of foam? Oh yeah, gen131 thanks for well put lessons on tact and military bearing. Too bad that seemed to have zero impact on it's intended target!



FireFightingMan  Tuesday May 2 05:01 PM

Funny and Serious

Ok, to get the obvious out of the way, this is really funny, especially the images of the foam releasing out of the hangar.

Now for the serious part: I've been a firefighter for...a while, and I joined the Cellar just so I could reply to some of the crap on this post. As somebody else pointed out, the foam is AFFF, typically used to suppress ignition of combustible fluids (more on that in a moment), especially JP and gasoline, where the vapors are explosive and heavier than air (thus they can obtain a vapor density sufficient to be combustible). The goal of AFFF is NOT to combine with (i.e. emulsify) the fluid but to sit on top of it and smother the fire by dispersing the vapors and limiting atmospheric esposure to the liquid, which limits evaporation, which means it can't burn (I'm skipping the Junior Chemistry on exothermic oxidation reactions ). The surface tension of the bubbles further suppresses other chemical reactions which can allow spontaneous oxidation and combustion (in other words, some emulsification is a good thing). Of course, the mass of the foam and the relative temperature differential also plays a significant part in limiting oxidation as well. So, for those of you who just had the lightbulb go off in your head, yes AFFF is also effective at suppressing class "A" fires. The reason it isn't more widely used for class "A" fires (structure fires, in particular) is a complicated issue, although apparatus manufacturers (most notably Pierce) has been trying to convince more fire companies of the significant advantages of fighting all class A and B fires with AFFF. My recollection (although someone else can correct me on this) is that AFFF is NOT electrically conductive and therefore can also be used on class "C" fires. Again, I don't know that for sure. Class "D" fires (combustible metals) are not candidates for suppression with AFFF.

Anyway, AFFF is typically fractioned at 1-4%, depending on the situation and application, although some fractioners only disperse AFFF at one concentration for ease of use. Can you suffocate in this stuff? Hell yes. You are in soap suds, but dense soap suds, not like the stuff on the top of your bubble bath. As you can see from the runoff from the hangar, and the dispersal pattern from the nozzles, there is a significant density to the solution, which means significant air displacement, and thus significant fire suppression and cooling. I have never been in AFFF of a depth even approaching 1m (espcially in a confined space), so I can't tell you what the differential is between the top and bottom. At the depth of the solution in the hangar it would be impossible to carve out a significant air pocket to ensure survival. The good news is that you are a lot more likely to survive an AFFF near-drowning than you are a flashover.

This system was surely modified after this test to limit the total flow to ensure that a situation like the one illustrated for the test ever occurred, in case it was impossible for personnel to evacuate the hangar, or to release the foam.

Oh, and one other thing: yes, AFFF is essntially dish soap, although I believe it also contains a surfactant to ensure consistent bubble size. Being cheap by nature (AFFF is expensive), most of us in our department have acquired old Class "A" fire extinguishers (water cans) and have filled them with homemade AFFF (check the net for a recipe that suits you - I use a general purpose one because I don't know if I'll be first-on-scene at a car fire with entrapment or a brush fire).

Anyway, to repeat, the pictures are damn funny.



xoxoxoBruce  Tuesday May 2 06:03 PM

Hey thanks, FireFightingMan.
If I do the net recipe and stick it in my water extinguisher, what makes it foam when it comes out, just being forced through the nozzle at speed?

Welcome to USAvetUSAFspouse, too.



FireFightingMan  Wednesday May 3 09:15 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce
If I do the net recipe and stick it in my water extinguisher, what makes it foam when it comes out, just being forced through the nozzle at speed?
Hey, Bruce. You will get some foaming action on contact just by the force of the straight stream. However, I prefer to shake my can several times (usually while running to whatever I'm trying to put out) to ensure that I have some bubbles already in the mix.

Two things on this point: 1) You don't have an aerating nozzle on a water can. You have a straight-tip nozzle. Therefore you are not going to get the same quality foam you would if you were able to introduce air to the system as you go (the system that Pierce recommends, called CAFS introduces compressed air to the mix in your truck as it comes out of your pump, meaning that you already have foam started in the hand line, even though you might have a conventional straight-tip or combination nozzle instead of a foam nozzle). You can improve your foam by modifying your straight tip on your can to be a venturi, although I don't recommend that. 2) Just for illustration on how effective just adding soap and/or surfactant can be without modifying the nozzle, most Essentials classes (the first firefighting class someone takes) include a session where a class B fire is started in a large pan (about 6x6), and the firefighter is given a water can and ordered to extinguish the fire. Most people can extinguish the fire with one or two cans with just water (although keeping the fire from flaring up is difficult, and some trainees take three or four cans to keep the fire out). HOWEVER, with the addition of a foaming agent (AFFF, or insert your home brew here), almost all trainees are able to extinguish the fire with ONE can, AND the mix becomes extremely difficult to reignite for the next trainee.

So the REALLY long answer to your question is...you might not get "good" foam, but it appears to be good enough, and considering how cheap it is to obtain an "old" can from a fire extinguisher dealer (everyone who I know that has asked has been given one for free), fill and pressurize it (you can do it yourself since you have all the ingredients and a water can is charged with an average air hose), and the volume of agent that you can put in a can compared to your average dry chem extinguisher it's a great way to go, at least for the people I know who have seen a fire or two.


xoxoxoBruce  Wednesday May 3 07:31 PM

I'll leave the image of you shaking your can, to the ladies.

Class B fires, flammable liquids and gases, solvents, oils, greases (excluding cooking oils/greases in depth) tars, oil-based paints and lacquers, (yeah, I had to check) keep flaring up because the fumes are reignited by what's still burning? Do they stop flaring once the flames are completely extinguished?
I guess the AFFF would suppress the flammable vapors from reforming while you get the flames beaten down.



FireFightingMan  Thursday May 4 02:47 PM

...and the like

Quote:
Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce
Class B fires keep flaring up because the fumes are reignited by what's still burning? Do they stop flaring once the flames are completely extinguished?
I guess the AFFF would suppress the flammable vapors from reforming while you get the flames beaten down.
First a CORRECTION: AFFF is NOT appropriate for Class C (which makes sense).

On to the question: Please understand that I am not 100% certain on the physics, only about 70% certain. Once you get ANY combustible burning, regardless of its class, there is a certain period of time where the surrounding environment is still hot enough to vaporize the material, which can then oxidize and thus reignite - remember, if it ain't evaporating, it ain't burning...unless it's a class D, but I'm not going to go there. This situation is especially problematic for volatile liquids because they are constantly evaporating, even at room temperature, and typically have flashpoints that are close to their evaporation point. So, once you get a diesel/gas mix burning, you are in deep crap. The gas gets the diesel hot enough to ignite. Then when you put it out, you are still at just below the flash point of the diesel...which is well above the flashpoint of the gasoline. So, it is common for the pan fire to be extinguished, only to reignite two seconds later.

The students who are successful in putting the pan fire out quickly start in the middle, then force the fire into a corner while spraying back and forth across the surface that they have already extinguished. After the fire is "out", they continue to spray back and forth across the entire surface for several seconds longer. This continued spraying 1) displaces the gasoline vapors that are continuing to evaporate so that they cannot reach a density sufficient to combust and 2) cools the surface so that less vapor is released.

In the real world this type of thing does not always happen. If the fire is in an area where the liquid is in a low spot and the sides are raised, without significant air disturbance, then the danger is real. A hangar is a great example of a setup where such reignition would be expected.


xoxoxoBruce  Thursday May 4 03:33 PM

Thank you, Sir.
Now all the Cellar members are qualified for Jr. Firefighter Badges. But remember folks, if you work the siren, you can't ring the bell on the same run.



mitheral  Friday May 5 03:04 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kagen4o4
all that hanger needs is some hard nrg rave music and some strobes and lasers.
I'm sad to say that I'm so uncool I wouldn't even know where to find someone whoe could direct me to someone who knew where such an event was taking place but it sure sounds like fun.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kagen4o4
well... over 350,000 views and only 60 replies. thats more than the "what the fuck" thread. if you google "ellsworth foam test" you get the Cellar as the number one site.
I posted it to metachat.org and I think someone picked it up from there and slapped it up on MetaFilter. A MetaFiltering isn't quite as bad as a /.ing but it isn't insignificant either.


Kagen4o4  Friday May 5 06:45 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by mitheral
I'm sad to say that I'm so uncool I wouldn't even know where to find someone whoe could direct me to someone who knew where such an event was taking place but it sure sounds like fun.
just keep your eyes and ears open for a foam party




xoxoxoBruce  Friday May 5 06:52 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by mitheral
I posted it to metachat.org and I think someone picked it up from there and slapped it up on MetaFilter. A MetaFiltering isn't quite as bad as a /.ing but it isn't insignificant either.
At one point there were over 8,000 sites linking to it.


FireFightingMan  Saturday May 6 12:08 PM

OK, not to nitpick, but...

Quote:
Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce
if you work the siren, you can't ring the bell on the same run.
Actually, the "Siren" is called a "Cue".


xoxoxoBruce  Saturday May 6 12:53 PM

A Cue? What do they call the bell and the different types of lights?



rkzenrage  Saturday May 6 01:18 PM

Another inexpensive way to get a good foam stream is to use a pesticide sprayer with a RoundUp foaming tip.
We used that to get foam to put out small fires when we were burning groves here in FL. Worked great.



FireFightingMan  Tuesday May 9 09:45 AM

OMG You're Such an Idiot

Quote:
Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce
What do they call the bell and the different types of lights?
The bell is called...a bell. Not all trucks have a bell (I'd say that most don't . However, all apparatus that want to move traffic come with an airhorn, typically mounted in the front bumper on the opposite side from the cue).

There are various lights on a truck. There are warning flashers, scene lights, alley lights, panel lights, light towers, etc. Flashing headlights are called wig-wags. There are also headlights that "bounce" back and forth and up and down. We call those "vomit lights" because if you look at them long enough they make you want to vomit. Essentially vomit lights are on a cam that follows an "M" or "W" shape, so the light looks like it's bouncing up and down as it travels from side to side and back again.

Strobes flash without roatating. Beacons stay lit all the time, but typically "flash" through the use of rotating mirrors and possibly stationary mirrors (so that when the rotating mirror is pointed backward it is reflecting off the stationary mirrors to the forward direction).

Is there anything else I can answer for you, Bruce?


barefoot serpent  Tuesday May 9 10:26 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by rkzenrage
We used that to get foam to put out small fires when we were burning groves here in FL. Worked great.
a lost technology


FireFightingMan  Tuesday May 9 04:09 PM

The Operative Word Here Is...

SMALL.

Here's the skinny on brush fires. 1) Brush fires are relatively hard to extinguish because the are relatively hard to contain, and it's relatively difficult to do overhaul on them because of the magnitude of the task. The reason for that is that since the fire is out in the open with lots of fuel all around, it's difficult to ensure that an area that is burning doesn't continue to burn. Brush fires burn grass, brush, and trees for the most part. Early-ish in the Spring (or at any time in Spring when there is little rainfall) all of the deadfall from the previous Winter is just sitting there waiting to go up. That is one of the reasons why there tend to be more brush fires in the Spring in more places than later in the season, even though the ones later get most of the attention. Trees are just like the studs, joists, etc. in your house, except they're usually farther from the firefighting apparatus, which means that when we're trying to put them out we have to hand-carry the water/foam/whatever, along with the other tools necessary some distance from the rig. The other tools are typically axes and maybe saws. We have to break the wood apart to get at all the fire burning inside the tree, especially in old deadfall trees.

Now some of you might be asking yourself "Why not just let the stuff in the middle burn?" To a large degree we do. However, fire isn't an exact or an absolute thing. Not all of an area that is "burning" is actually burning. Some of it (usually most of it) won't burn at all. There will be swatches through the landscape where there is fire. The problem is that if you just let everything in the interior of the fireground burn, then the ajacent, unburned land is also at risk (since it hasn't burned...yet.

Structure fires are pretty easy - the structure contains the fire for the most part, and if it gets completely out of hand, we just "surround and drown". End of problem. We can park apparatus near the fire. We can overwhelm the fire with water (the usual approach). You can't do any of that with a brush fire.

2) Brush fires don't just burn down houses. Stupid people get thier houses burned down. There was a study done by I believe it was the US Fire Commission or the Forestry Service that stated that of houses lost to brush fires, the most obvious factors are shake roofs or a large combustible load in contact with the house, i.e. bushes that haven't been trimmed so that they don't touch the home. Mulch does not appear to be a significant contributing factor. If you are worried about your house making it through a firestorm, TRIM YOUR BUSHES. Get them off your house. The further away they are, the better. Bushes burning allow the contact time to get your house burning. The further away they are from your house the better. Obviously in the case of a fire approaching the first priority for you and your family is your personal safety, so don't be an idiot and die trying to cut the foliage down. Get the hell out so you dont.

3) If you want your house to still be standing when you get back, make it easy to defend. We aren't driving through neighborhoods looking to save every house. We are looking for the place where we're going to make a stand. Swimming pool with easy access: good. Clearing around the home: good. Not on a hillside: good. Brick or other non-combustible construction: good. Well-manicured property without lots of brush or other crap near the house: good. However, I have to tell you that there is one way to put your house on the "MUST SAVE" list: VOLUNTEER AT YOUR LOCAL FIRE DEPARTMENT. You will learn how to save your own house, and you will get an "in" with the people who have to decide who's house they're going to save.



xoxoxoBruce  Tuesday May 9 06:48 PM

Quote:
Is there anything else I can answer for you, Bruce?
No, that's plenty, thanks for the info.

And thanks for doing what you do.


rkzenrage  Tuesday May 9 10:50 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by barefoot serpent
You don't hear about citrus growers starting large fires no matter how much we burn, and we burn a lot.
We are careful and watch our fires full-time.


SammyThor  Tuesday Jul 31 04:29 PM

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Shawnee123  Tuesday Jul 31 04:34 PM

HUH? Holi Pet, Batman.



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fredengle  Wednesday May 7 11:14 PM

well what if instead of the nozzle i made the hose into a venturi?????



fredengle  Wednesday May 7 11:18 PM

you can get an aerating nozzle at fireade source .com



xoxoxoBruce  Wednesday May 7 11:36 PM

Holy crap, 523,000 views on this thread!

Welcome to the Cellar, fredengle.
Fireman?



Sundae  Thursday May 8 04:55 AM

We seem to have lost all but the first photo though.



bevoer  Friday May 8 04:58 AM

good thanks!!:p

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kitsune View Post
[i]It doesn't show signs of stopping, and I've bought some corn for popping...



capnhowdy  Friday May 8 08:13 AM

Welcome to the Cellar, bevoer. Looks like you're off to a nice start.



KrisiaMae  Thursday Jun 18 01:41 PM

Hahaha. Off to a nice start? Are you sure?



classicman  Thursday Jun 18 11:00 PM

Caution - Hidden link in above post!



xoxoxoBruce  Thursday Jun 18 11:14 PM

Not anymore.



classicman  Thursday Jun 18 11:29 PM

Thanks Bruce - I looked up the link but couldn't really tell what it was or if it was malicious.



xoxoxoBruce  Thursday Jun 18 11:31 PM

All hidden links are malicious.



classicman  Thursday Jun 18 11:33 PM

oh in that case I'm glad I found it and you killed it.



ZenGum  Thursday Jun 18 11:34 PM

That is a pretty safe assumption.



SPUCK  Friday Jun 19 04:50 AM

What's a hidden link?



DanaC  Friday Jun 19 06:06 AM

It didnt by any chance link to a board called AKK did it?



capnhowdy  Friday Jun 19 08:03 AM

I saw it but didn't click the link. It was in yellow under the post. Damn...I reckon folks think we're stoopid, huh?

Nice work, Bruce. I nominate UT gives you an extra bonus this year.



classicman  Friday Jun 19 08:50 AM

If you see a hidden link Cap'n or anyone else, let a mod now via the contact us link at the bottom of the page.



glatt  Friday Jun 19 09:05 AM

Doesn't anyone else get a pop-up when they open this thread? I keep getting one from an image link in Kaken's post #69. A foam image he linked to from "Nick's Blog" keeps asking for a password every time this thread loads.
"A username and password are being requested by http://www.nickwelchbolen.com. The site says: "Nick's Blog""

Weird.



classicman  Friday Jun 19 09:07 AM

I just got a pop up when I tried to open page 5. same one as you - that is weird!



glatt  Friday Jun 19 09:19 AM

I probably display more posts on a page than you. So post 69 appears when I view most recent posts.

It's just the image kagen linked to that's doing it.



classicman  Friday Jun 19 09:40 AM

I see - so what you are saying is that I'm getting the popup when the page that post #69 is on, loads. Gotcha. If I may ask - How did you determine it was that image?



glatt  Friday Jun 19 09:50 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by classicman View Post
I see - so what you are saying is that I'm getting the popup when the page that post #69 is on, loads. Gotcha. If I may ask - How did you determine it was that image?
I right clicked on the page, and selected "view page source" then I searched for "nickwelchbolen." It's hard when viewing page source to see where one post stops and another begins, but it looked like it was coming from Kagen's post, so I went to Kagen's post and tried quoting it. When I quoted it, it showed that he had three images posted, even though I could only see one. One of the ones that wasn't showing up was being hosted by http://www.nickwelchbolen.com. So I figure that's what's generating the pop-up.


xoxoxoBruce  Friday Jun 19 11:21 AM

Got it. It was a link to a picture in Kagen4o4's post.



classicman  Friday Jun 19 11:52 AM

Excellent - now that we have that settled... what were we talking about



Stormieweather  Friday Jun 19 12:33 PM

This is the IotD that brought me to the cellar . Someone linked to it on another site I belong to.

Good stuffs!



Ibby  Saturday Jun 20 12:51 AM

stormie - me too, but it was the wtf thread that made me stay.



spudcon  Saturday Jun 20 08:17 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by classicman View Post
I just got a pop up when I tried to open page 5. same one as you - that is weird!
I get a pop up every morning when I wake up.


tsnany115  Friday Sep 4 11:33 PM

Such a very amazing link!

simulation credit auto comparatif voiture taux pret automobile financiers ont mis à la disposition des particuliers la simulation crédit auto simulation credit auto comparatif voiture taux pret automobile



briantomhson  Tuesday Nov 17 11:49 AM

Very nice post with a ton of informative information. I really appreciate the fact that you approach these topics from a stand point of knowledge and information
instead of the typical “I think” mentality that you see so much on the internet these days.



glatt  Tuesday Nov 17 11:59 AM

I'm fond of being informed with informative foam information.



Shawnee123  Tuesday Nov 17 12:12 PM

No, you just think you are fond of being informed, foam-wise.






capnhowdy  Tuesday Nov 17 12:31 PM

In order to truly be fond of foam, one must be informed.



Glinda  Tuesday Nov 17 01:13 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by capnhowdy View Post
In order to truly be fond of foam, one must be informed.
Wouldn't that make one infoamed?


dar512  Tuesday Nov 17 01:42 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by briantomhson View Post
Very nice post with a ton of informative information. I really appreciate the fact that you approach these topics from a stand point of knowledge and information
instead of the typical “I think” mentality that you see so much on the internet these days.
Sniff. Sniff.

Zombie thread. Generic post. First post.

Do I smell spam on the way?


Clodfobble  Tuesday Nov 17 04:08 PM

Oh, no way. His name is Brian Tomhson. He and Bruce Smith are true red-blooded Americans, can't you tell?



Flint  Tuesday Nov 17 04:15 PM

Very nice post with a ton of knowledge and informative internet that you
see so much on the typical “I think” mentality that you see so much on
these days. Very nice post with a ton of information instead of information.
I really approach the internet that you approach the information. I really
appreciate these topics from a stand informative informative internet the
typical “I think” mentality that you approach these days. Very nice post
with a ton of information instead of knowledge and point of information.



capnhowdy  Tuesday Nov 17 04:50 PM

You gotta lurve informative information.



xoxoxoBruce  Wednesday Nov 18 01:44 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by dar512 View Post
Do I smell spam on the way?
No.


ZenGum  Wednesday Nov 18 05:21 AM

Wait, was that a metric ton?



Shawnee123  Wednesday Nov 18 09:08 AM

This new guy, is he friend or foam?



ZenGum  Sunday Nov 22 02:22 AM

His posts are all froth and bubble, at any rate.



FreeRoy  Tuesday Apr 12 12:33 AM

VIDEO LINKS

It's been quite a while since I first saw this thread, and I see that the video that had been posted is now reduced to a single still. Here are several different videos of the same event -- though I don't see a single B-1 among them.

The rules say that I shouldn't post links on my first post, but I'm disregarding them under the "exigencies of the situation". I trust that the moderator will allow this to be posted.

If anyone ever looks at this (the Internet isn't REALLY forever), here are links to various videos of this, These were each valid as of 11:00 pm EST on 11 APR 2011.
-- Roy B. Scherer
-- Formerly of 95th FIS, ADC, USAF
================================
2:42 video at:
<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1OfLthj7nc>
Completely different video, edited, 1:07 at:
<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ILYWJ0O__C0>
Yet a third different video, this one 5:39 and from a wider perspective, at:
<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TpOwkchy9Bw>
And a fourth, handheld, w/audio, 2:26:
<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3w8zORFPRfw>

And last, a fifth video shot AFTER the foam stopped, 1:29, with audio:
<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fxNGokWXZaY>
=================================

Thanks all for your service, be you groundpounder, flyboy, jarhead, squie, or even feathermerchant . . . or a "mere" taxpayer!



SPUCK  Tuesday Apr 12 06:37 AM

Welcome to the Cellar FreeRoy.



Happy Monkey  Sunday Aug 5 11:00 AM




BigV  Sunday Aug 5 07:50 PM

Some people will do anything for a bucket of suds, eh?



Delphine  Wednesday Jan 22 10:43 PM

Your article is professional and i learn the important knowledge which i'm searching for online.You really do a good job!


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