The Cellar

The Cellar (http://cellar.org/index.php)
-   Relationships (http://cellar.org/forumdisplay.php?f=34)
-   -   Health and Safety of Friends, Family comes FIRST (http://cellar.org/showthread.php?t=35390)

Flint 10-11-2020 03:15 AM

Health and Safety of Friends, Family comes FIRST
 
There are clear and present dangers to the health and well-being of my friends, family and loved ones. Nothing about this is a political issue, it's an issue of physical safety. Because the perpetrators may be politically motivated does not make the victims reciprocally "political" unless you are prepared to blame rape victims for the actions of the rapist.

Right-wing extremist groups are meeting, recruiting and organizing, openly and with no secrecy whatsoever. They skirt the community guidelines of social media outlets, and even when making direct threats to specific people, are not held accountable-- despite the high volume of concerned, targeted citizens sounding the alarm to authorities.

My gay friends and allies are scared to fly a Pride flag at their home or place of business. My friends in the service industry, and business owners, are scared of the heavily-armed mobs congregating outside their doors. Angry redneck "militia members" are literally knocking on people's doors to harass them, at the very least communicating a "we know where you live" message simply by showing up. These victims of harassment are not BEING POLITICAL while fearing for their safety. It is not "political" to be aware that malicious actors are organizing online.

AND THAT'S NOT THE WORST PART. The WORST part is the societal conditions that are driving and empowering this situation. It is not harmless, or blameless to spread anti-science, anti-mask propaganda. You may not personally kidnap the Governor, you may not personally infect someone who results in the loss of life, but the harm is done regardless of malicious intent. And the responsibility of all of us is to reach out and engage in dialogue with those who may be reached. That is to say, PEOPLE who can be reached. If you literally FAIL THE TURING TEST while inserting harmful, "yelling fire in a crowded theater" propaganda into a string of NPC dialogue, social networks will have a dutiful and well-meaning "immune system" response to eliminate the threat.

Sometimes we make mistakes, and take the wrong approach in a given situation. Which is regrettable, on a personal level, but at the same time— you act on what your heart tells you, and if you miss the mark, you should face the repercussions that you knew you were opening yourself up to, e.g. being banned, etc. ... Punishing the WHOLE COMMUNITY for it is, frankly, ludicrous. I wish the powers that be would consider taking a deep breath and letting the situation dissipate before taking actions that will affect a long list of uninvolved people.

And perhaps consider easing off the prolific new account, which simply failed the Turing Test by posting 90% platitudes and 10% dangerous propoganda. If they are an actual person, fine. Politely remind them to wear a ƒucking goddamn mask, because only psychopaths don't care about other people's lives.

Griff 10-11-2020 07:29 AM

I totally get where you're coming from about where we are as a society and I also jumped to the conclusion that the account was spam.

xoxoxoBruce 10-11-2020 07:50 AM

Drilling teeth, fingernails on the blackboard, and "thoughts & prayers" sent in forum posts. I belong to a forum that's primarily old farts so there's a pretty steady flow of hospitalizations and a high attrition rate. Anytime somebody mentions one of the members being down there's always a slew of thoughts and prayers posts like it's going to change things.

Undertoad 10-11-2020 11:07 AM

Quote:

Punishing the WHOLE COMMUNITY for it is, frankly, ludicrous. I wish the powers that be would consider taking a deep breath and letting the situation dissipate before taking actions that will affect a long list of uninvolved people.
Ah, you are blaming me for this! Once again I kindly invite you to go fuck yourself.

You don't get to blame society or the right wing for being an asshole. You were already an asshole. Most of your post is you defending the fact that you get to be an asshole.

Being on a forum with you on it has been a horrible pain in my ass. It didn't start that way this week. Hint, I left the place for three months this year.

I didn't do this to you. YOU did this to you. Stop trying to fix others when you desperately need to fix yourself. Paranoid, bitter and angry is no way to go through life.

I don't believe that the threats you speak of are existential threats to your friends and family. An old woman on a forum immediately morphs into an existential threat to your friends and family that must be dealt with using tremendous force!

And you think you are being scientific so you get to be righteous. LOL. You are only following a public perception of what the science might wind up being. The science changes. And there are hundreds of variables involved in COVID transmission. You've focused on ONE. That's not science at all!

Here, take a look at the recent COVID new case graphs for several countries that are already on board with your idea of correct civil behavior:

http://cellar.org/img/francecovid.jpg

http://cellar.org/img/germanycovid.jpg

http://cellar.org/img/italycovid.jpg

http://cellar.org/img/belgiumcovid.jpg

But, if you do want to convince people to wear masks, a good start is being on their side. If they know you are not on their side, you will never ever convince them.

That also applies to electoral politics. We will soon have a measure of who feels comfortable stating their opinion publicly. Polls have Biden up by 12-17 points. If the election winds up closer, that will reflect the people who are unwilling to give their Trump opinion to anonymous pollsters on the phone. Never mind flying a flag.

Gravdigr 10-11-2020 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Undertoad (Post 1059976)
Paranoid, bitter and angry is no way to go through life.

Damn straight!

Also:

Quote:

Fat, drunk, and stupid is no way to go through life, son.
~Dean Wormer

Dude111 10-11-2020 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Undertoad
Ah, you are blaming me for this! Once again I kindly invite you to go fuck yourself.

Just ignore him buddy!!!

This tantrum wouldnt be tolerated anywhere else,he would be gone after the first reply..... Why are you making yourself more and more upset??

I care about you Undertoad...... Just block Flint..... Its obvious he is in a very vile state and is gonna continue to hurt people..... (It wont make things better though really for him)

jaminhealth 10-11-2020 06:06 PM

Taking care of oneself comes first, and then one can help others...We all NEED to take responsibility for ourselves...

Flint 10-11-2020 07:08 PM

I’m sorry you dislike me that much. It’s difficult to disentangle personal feelings from the subject at hand, so I’ll just say your reasons for not liking me are justified and I totally understand where you’re coming from, re: me being an asshole and a pain in the ass to deal with.

“I don't believe that the threats you speak of are existential threats to your friends and family.” -Sorry, but you don’t get to decide that. Every single item I mention are actual IRL events that are unfolding in my “60% Blue, 40% Red” rural/tourist community. A place that’s so small and close-knit that we all know each other by name.

“Right-wing extremist groups are meeting, recruiting and organizing” –at a specific church that’s a 5-minute drive from my house, they post pictures of their meetings online.

“They skirt the community guidelines of social media outlets, and even when making direct threats to specific people, are not held accountable” –myself and a growing list of my IRL friends and neighbors have been doxxed and identified as targets, wherein the public version of these posts contain weasel language that the police say “could mean something else” when you file a report about it.

“My gay friends and allies are scared to fly a Pride flag at their home or place of business.” –during Pride week, the right-wing terrorists posted a public event, “Bring me the ashes of Pride flags”. These people are friends and allies of Jeremy Christian—the Portland throat slasher. Portland is two hours away, the throat-slashers come here in their spare time (or live here). Random machete attacks have just recently started. I invite you to come here and take a walk at night, holding hands with someone of the same sex. When a lifted truck revs its engine and swerves towards you, stay calm they’re just having a bit of fun.

And about the trucks… people are being followed to their homes by trucks full of rednecks—this is real, it doesn’t need you to believe in it. Loud trucks and gunshots outside your house at night are the new normal. People are collaborating on a list of truck descriptions and license plates. Community organizers are compiling a list of threats which is used to keep law enforcement updated. Local government, law enforcement, even the Mayor are in a position to continuously post statements re: their position and what they are doing/ not doing. All of this is real. One day, the right-wingers are in my town yelling in people’s faces, the next day the same guy is arrested in Portland for shooting at protestors.

The right-wingers are not making empty threats—ask Governor Whitmer. We have a Lesbian Governor here, who has faced violent extremist opposition to cap-and-trade legislation, and of course for taking action on the pandemic. How easy do you think she sleeps at night? What about those of us who don’t have 24/7 security details? The threats to my friends and family are what they are, regardless of how they fit into your world view.

When my friends go to work and get yelled at by mask protestors, it’s 1) the immediate threat that they are getting infected, and that leads back via me to my son’s best friend who is immune compromised, or to my elderly mother whom I live with, 2) the immediate threat that they are about to get their throat slashed, and 3) the result of a society that downplays terrorist threats and disinformation campaigns.

When a new/unknown user account starts immediately posting extremist talking points, “I don’t own a mask,” “New World Order,” “Bill Gates is the Antichrist,” [muddying the waters about vaccines], it’s a HUGE FUCKING RED FLAG. Posting long-winded platitudes with zero context or reading comprehension is a failed Captcha. We’ll assume someone is spam for trying to advertise 35% off Golden Bus Tours, but “I hope your friends and family die” doesn’t meet that threshold of scrutiny. Jesus Fucking Christ, what was the harm in selling bus tickets? Nobody literally DIES. Unless the bus crashes— but that never happens with Golden Bus Tours, because each one of our trucks undergoes a rigorous safety check before each trip. In closing, just remember that I’m a real person and I’m not selling Golden Bus Tours, the very best way to travel, at a price that’s easy on the pocketbook! Call 1-800-GOLDEN for the Ride of Your Life™ --now 35% off!* **

...

...

...

*masks are required for all passengers
**please don't slash anyone's throat

BigV 10-11-2020 07:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaminhealth (Post 1060068)
Taking care of oneself comes first, and then one can help others...We all NEED to take responsibility for ourselves...

You're so, so right!

AMERICA!

Just look right there on the money! E PLURIBUS UNUM!

Dude111 10-11-2020 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flint
I’m sorry you dislike me that much.

Flint we dont hate ya buddy!!!!!

Arent we like a family here??

If you have a problem please tell us,dont be cutting people down because your upset!!!

Please tell us whats wrong and we might be able to help you http://img.techpowerup.org/200606/72tuzr.gif

Flint 10-12-2020 12:02 AM

I wasn't talking to you.

monster 10-12-2020 12:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dude111 (Post 1060172)
Flint we dont hate ya buddy!!!!!

Arent we like a family here??

If you have a problem please tell us,dont be cutting people down because your upset!!!

Please tell us whats wrong and we might be able to help you http://img.techpowerup.org/200606/72tuzr.gif

Is that the Royal We?

:borg:

:eek:

Flint 10-12-2020 12:13 AM

idk did he/she(?) read the part about my son's best friend dying, my friends getting their throat slashed, and all the gay people in my town getting gunned down or run over by patriotic pickup trucks? I feel like I posted like TEN PARAGRAPHS about what's bothering me, and it was mostly a recap of things I've been posting about in real time for the last few months. Am I taking ƒucking crazy pills here or ??? how the absolute ƒuck is some no-reading motherƒucker going to "HELP ME" with any of that? F U C K YO U

Dude111 10-12-2020 01:55 AM

Im sorry buddy I didnt closely read that... Seems you have alot on your mind :(

Im sorry about your Sons best friend and your friend....... Thats horrible,im sure you and him are very upset...... and im sorry about the gay people being treated so badly,its a shame..... Nothing wrong with being gay/lesbian....... Its the love that matters!


Ill say a prayer for you honey,im so sorry your going thru this and Im sorry I didnt see this before http://img.techpowerup.org/200606/72tuzr.gif

jaminhealth 10-12-2020 02:10 PM

Bottom line, many many go thru a lot of SHIT in life but most I don't go around Fing everything in life and other people....good lord there is so much help and to just go on Fing and Fing.....hard for me to grasp this as I've never heard anything like this before....many have losses and health issues and it goes on and on....


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:11 AM.

Powered by: vBulletin Version 3.8.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.