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Quote:
Originally posted by dave
I never went to being hurt. The only thing I posted that in any way resembled that was the frownie, which I did because I thought it was funny. (Come on. Dave, He Who Hardly Ever Backs Down And Never Shuts Up, posting a single frownie. I thought it was funny.)
I didn't say anything until lumberjim said "no fair picking on a physical malady", where I then explained that while it wasn't my favorite thing in the world, I wasn't bawling over it either.
I went from happily taunting to... happily taunting while explaining my reaction to certain happy taunting. I even made it clear that there really isn't anything someone could say here that would hurt my feelings.
Now you say "Either you have to drop the practice of insulting people as a way of being close to them, or you have to accept *anything* they hand back to you." -- which is exactly what I've done. I didn't ask him to stop, I didn't explode at him. He's done it a number of times, and his creativity in it at times is quite funny. So I let it slide, 'cause it's not a big deal. When I said it was "out of line", maybe those weren't the best words. What I meant to convey was that it seemed abnormal for the sycamore. Not that I was distressed by it.
For future reference, I know you don't play that particular game, which is why there are threads in my weblog dedicated only to kissing your ass and making you feel rosy. You're a cool dude, so is sycamore. I'm not mad at him, though I am kind of bewildered that this has turned into such a big deal. I just thought it was appropriate that lumberjim's comment was addressed, and as the night went on, I realized that I hadn't done a proper job of offering my whole view (bwahaha, NBN).
You know, I'm just going to put it here again, so there's no question about it:
sycamore cracking eye jokes is not my favorite thing in the world, because if I could change it, I would, and yeah, it's kind of a shitty thing that happened. It's sort of like making rape jokes to a rape victim - one of those things you normally don't do. So when he first did it (it doesn't really phase me any more, because I expect it), I was taken aback. Now, it's kinda like "oh well". Like I said before, I'm not losing any sleep over it. I think about it for probably about two or three seconds, and then I'm over it. sycamore is a pretty cool dude, and I like him. He's made eye jokes for a while now, and I haven't stopped liking him. No one need get upset at people taking cracks at me (I can handle them), especially playful ones.
If you don't want something discussed on the Cellar, <b>don't mention it on the Cellar</b>. It's not like I started a fucking thread "sycamore picks on me unfairly about my eye". He made a number of cracks about it, jim said something, and I offered my thoughts - 'cause, you know, it's <b>my fucking eye</b>.
Tony, I respect your opinion, but I do not agree. I hope this has clarified my position, and I will email you about some further issues so as not to "air dirty laundry" in front of the crowd.
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I then followed up with an email, the contents of which are posted below:
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In and email dated 11/26/2003 at 10:15 AM Dave wrote:
I'm sorry, but this is fucking bullshit. sycamore makes numerous cracks
about the eye, I don't say anything. lumberjim makes a comment, I address
it (perhaps poorly), sycamore gets bent out of shape. I try to apologize
to him last night, he is unreceptive. I *know* he talked to you, because
there's no fucking way that you misread the thread that bad. Then you post
in the Cellar. The issue is no longer my eye but sycamore's hurt feelings.
Me posting about topic in Cellar that directly relates to me but was
brought up by someone else: Bad (apparently)
You posting about topic in Cellar that indirectly relates to you (you own
the medium) but was not brought up in the Cellar (therefore you are making
the first post about it): OK
How the fuck? If sycamore has a problem, he can write about it himself or
send me a fucking email. I tried to talk to him last night and he didn't
want to fucking hear it. If you want to talk about it, you can write me a
fucking email. You're entitled to an opinion, but posting it in the Cellar
where I can't openly respond to it (because - hey - I don't air issues in
there unless they've been brought up there) pretty well fucking sucked. I
didn't bring up my eye, dude. I didn't go "Oh, look at me, I only have one
eye." He started fucking joking about it, and he posted what, three or
four of those on the Cellar? And it gets discussed there and it's some
fucking taboo? No, I'm sorry. It's not. He brought it up, I didn't say
shit. I saw lumberjim's comment and basically wanted to say "It's not a
big deal, dude." At the same time, I didn't want everyone to think "hey,
it's cool to pick on disabled people!" so I tried to make it clear that
normally it is *not cool*, but between sycamore and I, we're good enough
buddies that it's not a problem.
I don't know why the fuck he's so bent out of shape about it ('cause he,
uh, won't fucking tell me, 'cause he, uh, apparently doesn't like
resolving issues?) so I'm really left to sit here and wonder how the fuck
something so stupid evolved into this.
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Tony responded as follows, in an email at 10:41 AM:
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Syc did call me, but I was previously taken aback by your frowny face.
If this whole thing is an Issue, I am happy to butt out and not try to moderate it. I'm agree that Terry should address it directly. I'm extremely sorry I got involved. I'm not good at human relations anyway.
The fact I own the place has no bearing.
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Right off the bat, the last thing he says, "The fact that I own the place has no bearing." removes <b>any</b> relation he has to the issue. So essentially he's admitting "It's none of my fucking business", which is backed up by what he says above that.
I responded with the following two emails, to which I received no response:
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Well, that's the thing, it wasn't an issue to me until he was acting like
a fucking woman last night in not wanting to talk about it. I got the
feeling, after reading his "Talk about being disappointed" post, that he
was actually upset about this and maybe about the "job" comment, which was
all I really had to hit back with (he doesn't have a physical disability
to make fun of). So I message him and I'm like "Dude, I was just screwing
around. You're not actually upset, are you?" His response was "I'm glad
you think it's funny." Well, yeah, we were joking around, so I did think
it was funny. So I'm like "Man, I'm not really upset, I was just trying to
address lumberjim, blah blah blah." He says "I think it was kind of shitty
to bring it up on the Cellar". ??????? I tried to talk more and he got
offline without saying anything else. I'm trying to talk to him about it
and he's unreceptive. I didn't mean to fucking upset him. As far as I can
tell, the job thing didn't upset him, just the eye thing (but like I said,
I don't know, 'cause he isn't fucking talking). Well. What do you expect?
If you say something on the Cellar, yeah, someone might talk about it.
I don't mean to be shitty with you, but it was like "Okay, don't read
Dave's posts at all or try to understand exactly what's going on." He
doesn't want it on the Cellar. He PUT it on the Cellar. And I still didn't
take issue with it!
If your whole direction was steered by the frownie, then I'm sorry that
wasn't more obvious. To me, it was obvious. I thought sycamore would get
it too 'cause yes, I *have* laughed with him about it in the past, and to
me, the thought of Dave posting a single frownie is fucking absurd. Which
is why I did it. I laughed at it. I'm sorry not everyone got it.
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And by the way, I don't mind that you're trying to help, because even when
I disagree with you, I know that your intentions are good. I might doubt
your words, but I believe in the Tone. But I just felt like... what the
fuck am I explaining this for if no one is going to read it?
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At this point in time, I thought that things between Tony and I are okay, and he had given me no outward indication that would lead me to believe anything else.
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