The Cellar - View Single Post

mbpark · 08-27-2010, 03:14 PM

UT,

I know and respect your history with Linux. You were hosting downloads of it in 1992.

However, the iPad is not a point of comparison because unless you jailbreak it, it isn't a computer, rather a companion device that needs iTunes on a PC or Mac, and it is sold/marketed as such. Jailbreaking it does make it much more useful, however, and turns it into one IMHO. One of the first app ports over from Android to it was Flash, and the rest of the compatibility needs can be met with Citrix or LogMeIn, which are two of the most popular apps out there for it.

We have an iPad at work we're using to test with Citrix. It runs our ER app under XenApp faster than the $4K Panasonic Toughbook handhelds with Intel Atom chips. And, I may add, the screen is awesome. Installing the XenApp client under Linux was an exercise in pain for me. I did get it to work, but after 2 hours and googling of multiple different sites (Citrix doesn't use the unified keystore for digital certificates in their Linux client like the Windows or Mac versions do, and manually installing certificates is not my idea of fun).

My point of comparison from my POV was getting someone like myself to switch over. At no point did I say that it could not be done, because it can be. However, it is not easy, and should not be painted as such.

All users are dependent upon applications for their primary computers so that they can use them. Unfortunately, there are many applications that can prevent users that do not want to spend a lot of time researching solutions from switching. I only gave the examples that I use during my day at work. If I were to ask the same question of other users, I would get different answers.

Presenting Linux as a "cure-all" from Evil Windows, and using loaded words to talk about Microsoft et al as a cartel only out to screw users over is the quickest way to turn average people off. People only want to use their computers. The magic use case of having Grandma check her e-mail is a simple one. Having someone do home banking is not.

Presenting Linux as something that is a magic bullet when in reality, they'll even have trouble with online banking with some banks, using remote access to work, using Blackboard for taking classes (the POS that it is, I still have to use it!), Facebook games (Zynga games run like crap under Linux), or even downloading/running a game from the Internet is not the way to go. I really tried to use OpenOffice for class, but the Powerpoints in it just wouldn't display right.

Also, all the apps don't automatically update

.

Presenting Linux as an alternative that requires some work, however, is the way to go. It's not OS X or Windows. You're going to have a steep adoption curve, even if you use Ubuntu. You still will have security issues that screw with your data, only its a different set (there are enough Linux Kernel, Firefox, Thunderbird, glibc, and application vulnerabilities out there. People in glass houses should not throw stones, and I mean you, every Linux user that crows about this "achievement" without looking at Secunia and seeing the real story that shows how vulnerable you still are). Wine will not work 100%, and will make your PC run really slow on some trivial Windows apps. People need to have the expectation that not everything will work, much the way it is with an iPod, iPad, or cell phone. However, there are communities which are geared toward using it, such as the engineering, software development, and embedded design ones. These are not your average users, and these are users that will work around those issues.

To your average user, a PC is an appliance, and you can buy parts, programs, and accessories for it at Target, Best Buy, Wal-Mart, or around the corner. With Linux, that isn't there anymore, and the expectation has to be set that the Linux programs that you pay for (Crossover Office is highly recommended) have to be purchased online, as your local computer store (unless you're in California) probably will not have them. At least Apple has their own stores, and Best Buy carries their SW too (at least the one near me in Plymouth Meeting dows).

Like any other change, be it from PC to Mac, or Mac to PC, there are trade-offs. However, in this case, it's a chasm that requires a lot of work, and the expectations for converting users need to be tempered with pragmatism.

08-27-2010, 03:14 PM	#32
mbpark Lecturer Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Carmel, Indiana Posts: 761	The iPad is not a computer UT, I know and respect your history with Linux. You were hosting downloads of it in 1992. However, the iPad is not a point of comparison because unless you jailbreak it, it isn't a computer, rather a companion device that needs iTunes on a PC or Mac, and it is sold/marketed as such. Jailbreaking it does make it much more useful, however, and turns it into one IMHO. One of the first app ports over from Android to it was Flash, and the rest of the compatibility needs can be met with Citrix or LogMeIn, which are two of the most popular apps out there for it. We have an iPad at work we're using to test with Citrix. It runs our ER app under XenApp faster than the $4K Panasonic Toughbook handhelds with Intel Atom chips. And, I may add, the screen is awesome. Installing the XenApp client under Linux was an exercise in pain for me. I did get it to work, but after 2 hours and googling of multiple different sites (Citrix doesn't use the unified keystore for digital certificates in their Linux client like the Windows or Mac versions do, and manually installing certificates is not my idea of fun). My point of comparison from my POV was getting someone like myself to switch over. At no point did I say that it could not be done, because it can be. However, it is not easy, and should not be painted as such. All users are dependent upon applications for their primary computers so that they can use them. Unfortunately, there are many applications that can prevent users that do not want to spend a lot of time researching solutions from switching. I only gave the examples that I use during my day at work. If I were to ask the same question of other users, I would get different answers. Presenting Linux as a "cure-all" from Evil Windows, and using loaded words to talk about Microsoft et al as a cartel only out to screw users over is the quickest way to turn average people off. People only want to use their computers. The magic use case of having Grandma check her e-mail is a simple one. Having someone do home banking is not. Presenting Linux as something that is a magic bullet when in reality, they'll even have trouble with online banking with some banks, using remote access to work, using Blackboard for taking classes (the POS that it is, I still have to use it!), Facebook games (Zynga games run like crap under Linux), or even downloading/running a game from the Internet is not the way to go. I really tried to use OpenOffice for class, but the Powerpoints in it just wouldn't display right. Also, all the apps don't automatically update . Presenting Linux as an alternative that requires some work, however, is the way to go. It's not OS X or Windows. You're going to have a steep adoption curve, even if you use Ubuntu. You still will have security issues that screw with your data, only its a different set (there are enough Linux Kernel, Firefox, Thunderbird, glibc, and application vulnerabilities out there. People in glass houses should not throw stones, and I mean you, every Linux user that crows about this "achievement" without looking at Secunia and seeing the real story that shows how vulnerable you still are). Wine will not work 100%, and will make your PC run really slow on some trivial Windows apps. People need to have the expectation that not everything will work, much the way it is with an iPod, iPad, or cell phone. However, there are communities which are geared toward using it, such as the engineering, software development, and embedded design ones. These are not your average users, and these are users that will work around those issues. To your average user, a PC is an appliance, and you can buy parts, programs, and accessories for it at Target, Best Buy, Wal-Mart, or around the corner. With Linux, that isn't there anymore, and the expectation has to be set that the Linux programs that you pay for (Crossover Office is highly recommended) have to be purchased online, as your local computer store (unless you're in California) probably will not have them. At least Apple has their own stores, and Best Buy carries their SW too (at least the one near me in Plymouth Meeting dows). Like any other change, be it from PC to Mac, or Mac to PC, there are trade-offs. However, in this case, it's a chasm that requires a lot of work, and the expectations for converting users need to be tempered with pragmatism.