[sugarpop]

Originally Posted by classicman

... and therefore, the doctors income - no real incentive for them in that regard.

If we do it right, doctor's income could actually go up.

Just kill them sooner?

I didn't say that.

BS

He is asking everyone to the table. Since the AMA and insurance companies have been the biggest opponents of health care reform over the past century, what could they possibly have to offer this time? They don't want a public option, but without a public option, there is no true reform.

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/Politic...7838800&page=1

Hmmm, really?

Yes. REALLY. If republicans wanted to do it, they were just in power for years. They had their chance. All they are doing is trying to block true reform. Same with AMA and insurers. They have all had time to do it. Plenty of time. They haven't done it, because they aren't interested in true reform. They like the status quo.

What makes you think that won't happen even more if/with Gov't oversight?

I suppose it could, but the government isn't trying to make a profit, and that is the difference. insurance companies HAVE to make a HUGE profit in order to pay all the bloated executive salaries.

yeh - France -

France does have the best health care system in the world, according to the WHO.
http://www.photius.com/rankings/healthranks.html

Well if we don't know what it'll look like nor who it will cover nor IF it will cover everyone or just some or IF it will save money .... what exactly are we for?

I must say it was nice to hear in Obama say in his speech yesterday that if you are happy with your plan, or your doctor or your company ....you may keep them. Thats great, but at what cost? I just cannot see how this is not going to cost more than it already does and that means that I, as a productive employed citizen will be paying more. How much more is a major issue to me.

It should cover everyone. If it doesn't, Obama shouldn't sign it.

And you have to look at the cost if we DON'T reform health care. If we don't, it will take over, and the costs will continue escalating at an astronomical rate.

I really think it's a shame we aren't even debating a single payer system. I think a majority of people really want that.

One thing no one has brought up, is this is tied to wages. Wages have been stagnant for most people for decades, while rising for those at the top. Health care costs have risen dramatically more than wages. If wages had kept up, the problem wouldn't be as bad as it is. (It would still be a problem though.) No one wants to raise wages though. No one wants to do health care. So we have this problem, and we will continue to have it if nothing gets done, only it continue to get worse. It's the same with energy.

And gee, I'm sorry if you will have to pay more. I don't see how, unless you are above a certain income. There are plenty of productive citizens who are without insurance, through no fault of their own. It's just too damn expensive for some people. And some people had insurance, and still got screwed by their provider. So?