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Old 10-07-2013, 08:55 PM   #1
Adak
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Free Energy Produced!

First time ever - fusion energy generation exceeded the amount of energy needed to make it happen.

We've been trying to mimic the way the sun makes energy, for over 50 years. This is the very first time it's happened!

Congrats to everyone involved at Livermore Labs!
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Old 10-07-2013, 09:10 PM   #2
glatt
 
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I missed this. Details?
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Old 10-07-2013, 09:28 PM   #3
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-24429621
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Old 10-07-2013, 09:39 PM   #4
xoxoxoBruce
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I think we better hold off on the Champaign for a bit.
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Old 10-07-2013, 10:08 PM   #5
lumberjim
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Hopefully, this is a date that my grand kids will have to memorize for a test.

Share this on your face books. Spread the word. This is where research dollars need to go.

There's no point in making "better" nuclear weapons. That's like polishing your sledge hammer.

I read something when I was in my late teens, and my Sci Fi muscle was strong, that we would invent cold fusion in 2050. ...Assuming the then current technological advancement arc, as exponential as it seems. ....
So, I thought. ...
I'll be 80 in 2050. I can live that long. I wanna see that. And I thought. ..I bet we beat that date. Still, I do want to be 80 one day. And how different everything would be if energy were free. It would be like magic were real.

And I bet advancements in other things, like wireless energy delivery, and miniaturization of technology will make things appear to BE magic.

I really hope we don't fuck this up.
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Old 10-07-2013, 10:37 PM   #6
xoxoxoBruce
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Free energy? Not for you, Bunkie.
For the electric companies which have to recoup their investment, maintain infrastructure, shut down supply to widows and orphans, and protect shareholders from not getting richer.




I wish I was kidding.
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Old 10-07-2013, 11:08 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce View Post
I think we better hold off on the Champaign for a bit.
You're just bitter because the cold fusion out of Utah lost all it's bubbles.
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Old 10-08-2013, 09:07 AM   #8
glatt
 
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Well, I think in the here and now, Bloom Energy Boxes are very interesting. Imagine having a box the size of a cinder block that hooks up to your natural gas service and powers your house with electricity for a portion of the cost that the electric company charges you to generate the same power and send it to you over the wires.

Already the boxes are powering large corporate facilities. And it may only be a couple of years before they get scaled down to residential size. I'm not sure what will happen to the price of natural gas if they really catch on. Gas is cheap now, will there be increased demand with Bloom Boxes? Or will it be offset by reduced demand from the power companies?
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Old 10-08-2013, 09:17 AM   #9
tw
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lumberjim View Post
I really hope we don't fuck this up.
For the experiment to have credibility, it must be reproducible. Cold fusion was also reported in other labs. But it would not work in most labs. And so it did not meet a requirement for a useful conclusion. Something was creating that energy. But the whys and hows, necessary to have a fact, have not yet been provided.

This laboratory was hyped to budget cutters as a solution to controlled fusion for energy. In reality, that was only cover. Never understood was how fusion ignition starts. Fusion based bombs worked when somehow a fission reaction ignited a fusion reaction. That crude solution was never understood. By compressing a supercooled pellet of deuterium and tritium, then lasers hit that target via holes in a container called a hohlraum. This creates x-rays to ignite those hydrogen isotopes by compressing it to 40,000 times less volume. Yes, X-rays somehow compress super cooled hydrogen.

The 30 September date was an arbitrary date created to keep budget people satisfied. Previous attempts did not create a smooth confined compression. Laser configurations were adjusted to fix that containment.

This system is only about ignition. Lasers can fire only once every 12 hours. Fusion requires a laser hit maybe 15 times a second. This was never about creating energy from fusion. This has always been about understanding how a fusion reaction is ignited - also for weapons research. To create controlled fusion so as to learn how it works. In particular, to learn how X-rays from the primary, fission-dominated component of the nuclear warhead are carried to the fusion-dominated secondary. To even understand the life expectancy of existing nuclear weapons.

Last edited by tw; 10-08-2013 at 09:38 AM.
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Old 03-04-2019, 12:43 AM   #10
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Yes, this is old (Apr-09). It's still a topic of discussion for it's potential. Maybe.

Transcript of the video.


My favorite lines of the entire video are from Dr. Rob Duncan;

Asked what he thought when he left the Israeli lab, Duncan told Pelley, "I thought, 'Wow. They've done something very interesting here.'"

He crunched the numbers himself and searched for an explanation other than a nuclear effect. "I found that the work done was carefully done, and that the excess heat, as I see it now, is quite real," Duncan said.


"If you ask me, is this going to have any impact on our energy policy, it's impossible to say, because we don't fundamentally understand the process yet. But to say, because we don't fundamentally understand the process and that's why we're not going to study it, is like saying, 'I'm too sick to go to the doctor,'" Duncan argued.

[looks at wristwatch] Doesn't appear to have any impact on energy policy yet.

Not for the little people anyway.


Looks like Rob Duncan has moved on to high tech weapons research and development.

Michael Kubre wiki - another scientist from the video above

"The 2004 review concluded that "while significant progress has been made in the sophistication of calorimeters since the review of this subject in 1989, the conclusions reached by the reviewers today are similar to those found in the 1989 review."

Here's something a bit more recent on Michael Kubre

"Several labs are regularly able to produce between 6-20 Watts excess thermal power and are now experimenting with the various parameters in order to determine how to scale that output up."

If all the experimentation and data has gone into black projects and the materials for these experiments are not terribly expensive AND no one seems to want to disclose even the working theory MAYBE some hillwilliam(TM Griff) dumbass can "oops wow" it into something usable in their garage. Or barn.
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Old 03-04-2019, 05:02 AM   #11
xoxoxoBruce
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These cells driving cars... horseshit.
His little magic cells don't make electricity, they make heat. That heat turns water to steam used to drive turbines, which turn the generator to make electricity most of which gets fed to the little magic cells to produce extra heat. It's got to be done on a huge scale, not in a car.
Try to convert the nuclear plants that are left and you'll run in a huge decontamination project because they are mostly those damn GE BWRs, plus the inevitable NIMBY protests.
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Old 03-04-2019, 06:58 AM   #12
slang
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Oh, Kubre and the cells. Yes. I agree.

Like flying cars we were told would be available now. Not so much.

And the heat to make electricity through turbines. Again, yes.

I suppose that I'm drawn to the reaction generating more than is input. That some pretty established chem-elec scientists don't understand what is happening but are convinced that SOMETHING is happening.

sketchy source link

David J. Nagel, an electrical and computer engineering professor at George Washington University told the Scientific American, “LENR is real experimentally, and not understood theoretically. There are results that you just can’t explain away. Whether it’s cold fusion, low-energy nuclear reactions, or something else—the names are all over the place—we still don’t know. But there’s no doubt that you can trigger nuclear reactions using chemical energy.”

David J. Nagel


Scientific American - Cold Fusion


"Cold fusion and making hydrinos both hold the holy-grail promise of generating endless amounts of cheap, pollution-free energy. Scientists were frustrated by cold fusion. They wanted to believe it, but their collective wisdom told them it was all wrong. Part of the problem was they had no generally accepted theory to guide them and explain the proposed phenomenon—as physicists like to say, no experiment should be believed until it has been confirmed by theory."


My thinking is basically simple as this, I don't know how the light is created, don't understand the power station that supplies the power, but I do know that if I flip the switch, the light comes on.

But I suppose it's just not going to happen.

It's my fantasy.
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Old 03-28-2019, 10:44 PM   #13
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See if you can get hold of a copy of Yes, We Have No Neutrons. While the cold-fusion chapter of the book could use some expatiation of just what the source of trillions of neutrons per cold-fusion jar should be -- which will require one to read up on neutron flux in hydrogen or deuterium fusion someplace -- it does show how the entire construct crashed down through lack of scientific method.
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Old 03-28-2019, 11:08 PM   #14
xoxoxoBruce
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They produce hydrinos from a H2O based solid fuel? H2O based solid fuel?
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Old 03-29-2019, 02:58 PM   #15
Gravdigr
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Ice?

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