What is the aesthetic goal of plastic art?

coberst · 07-10-2009, 03:36 PM

What is the aesthetic goal of plastic art?

Quickies from Wiki:
“Plastic arts are those visual arts that involve the use of materials that can be molded or modulated in some way, often in three dimensions. Examples are clay, paint and plaster.”
Aesthetics is commonly known as the study of sensory values. More broadly, scholars in the field define aesthetics as "critical reflection on art, culture and nature”.

The art historian is led to conclude that primitive humanity was impressed with the theosophical mystical insight view of reality, i.e. that underlying visible nature there must be a superior driving force; they imagined this force must have a human like form since they could not imagine a form any greater than the human form. This human world view moved from infinite polytheism to anthropological polytheism to present day anthropological monotheism.

“Whereas infinite polytheism presupposed a corresponding number of autonomous forces underlying the diverse phenomena of nature reformed polytheism perceived numerous natural phenomena as embodiments of one and the same power. Monotheism brought this refinement process to its culmination by establishing a single force as the original agent of all phenomena.”

How did antique wo/man approach an art form in which they considered that nature revealed “to the human eye only those aspects that are essential, random, and transitory, then art must create for them the essential, the meaningful, and the eternal parts”?

Riegl informs me that “the human hand fashions works from lifeless matter according to the same formal principles as nature does”. All human art production is at its core “nothing other than a contest with nature…The history of art is the history of the creative human being’s victories as he competes with nature.”

The human urge to create visual art is not the desire to imitate nature but it is a desire to compete with and to expose the essential aspects of nature. “Behind every work of art, then, we must presuppose the presence of a work of nature (or several such) with which the work of art is designed to compete.” Art is the means to accomplish the primary aesthetic goal of competing with nature while satisfying the inner urge to comprehend nature.

Art is meant to reveal the “essential, the meaningful, the eternal parts” of nature. In doing so wo/man judged that “only the perfect is entitled to exist in art”. Since in nature only the strongest prevailed so then in art only the perfect and the strong must prevail.

Quotes from Historical Grammar of the Visual Arts by Alois Riegl

TheMercenary · 07-10-2009, 03:41 PM

What the hell does this have to do with politics?

Shawnee123 · 07-10-2009, 03:44 PM

What the hell does it have to do with anything?

Shawnee123 · 07-10-2009, 03:49 PM

"Mrs McGillacuddy makes the loveliest Santa Clauses out of empty Clorox bottles."

"What the fuck are you talking about?"

Quotes from Share the Warmth by Bobcat Goldthwait

depmats · 07-10-2009, 10:49 PM

Wasn't this guy banned a long time ago?

07-11-2009, 04:56 AM

I seem to remember that he was considered for a 30 day suspension (UT can better answer this); but, not banning. There are mitigating circumstances in coberst's [Chuck Oberst's] case. A few excerpts compiled from his profiles elswhere:

Real Name: Chuck Oberst

Gender and Age: Male, 75

E-mail Address: coberst@hotmail.com

Website Address: http://www.septemberscholar.com

Location: Franklin, NC

Interests: "I am a retired engineer. I have a good bit of formal education but my twenty years of self-learning represent my most important educational achievement. My engineering degree made it possible for me to feed my family but my self-learning made it possible for me to feed "my soul"."

"As I mentioned I am an autodidactic. The self-learner is a lonely individual because it is very difficult to find people interested in critical thinking and the critical self-consciousness to indulge such a pass-time."

We have here a septuagenarian, with mental faculties largely intact, lonely; yet, searching for relevancy and meaning as he reconciles his own mortality. He's been in the mainstream, provided for others, and has a lifetime of experience though his judgment may now be impaired. He has the common sense to spread his correspondence among many forums as elderly parents would spread their burdens among several children so as not to overwhelm any one of them. At times he overestimates how much they can bear; but, at least he's trying.

His website address is no longer functional. He seems to have lost that and notice that he uses a hotmail address. I commend the Cellar administration for cutting dwellar coberst some slack. I'm confident that they can determine when coberst becomes out of control rather than merely a nuisance and ban him (so he doesn't get hate mail at his email address). Until then, there's the ignore button.

The Cellar: Compassion is the name of that tune.

References:
http://www.sociopranos.com/forums/ed...ername=coberst
http://profiles.tigweb.org/coberst

Sundae · 07-11-2009, 05:11 AM

I just wish he would engage more.
He's like one of those fish that scatter their eggs in the hope of fertilisation. He comes (!) he deposits, he moves on.

I probably wouldn't have much to offer in response if he did engage, unless he wanted to talk about Fit Flops. but at least I would have a sense of him as part of the community. I mean I don't reposnd to TW or Radar - mostly - but they are Dwellars and I value that.

DanaC · 07-11-2009, 05:39 AM

Well-said NB.

We're not a banny kind of a place. I'd rather it stayed that way.

monster · 07-11-2009, 08:16 AM

I just wish he wouldn't c&p the same stuff that he's posted elsewhere. At least try and make us feel like we're special and real human beans and he cares what we think about what he posts. Otherwise what's the point? It's preaching rather than discussion. It's just spam dressed up pate.

http://flag.blackened.net/forums/vie...p?f=21&t=75812
http://www.thenakedscientists.com/fo...4176.msg263097
http://lofi.forum.physorg.com/What-I...Art_26224.html
http://onlinephilosophyclub.com/foru...&view=previous
http://www.freethought-forum.com/for...ad.php?t=20566
http://www.philosophychatforum.com/v...c.php?p=132059

and on this one, I suspect the hand of LJ in the replies

:
http://www.rantsnraves.org/showthrea...588#post569588

there are many, many more more.....

Undertoad · 07-12-2009, 10:14 AM

He wouldn't be so lonely if he would just reply. I'd like to discuss some of the topics he spams, but I won't do it just for the sake of doing it.

spudcon · 07-13-2009, 08:20 AM

Here's my reply, I've explained it all before, somewhere.
Notice, incidentally, that the theory of syntactic features developed earlier raises serious doubts about the greater fight-worthiness concept. It would not, however, be safe to assume that this analysis of a formative as a pair of sets of features delimits Propp's basic formulation. Clearly, the natural general principle that will subsume this case is necessary to impose an interpretation on the levels of acceptability from fairly high (eg (99a)) to virtual gibberish (eg (98d)). It must be emphasized, once again, that a primary interrelationship of system and/or subsystem logistics may remedy and, at the same time, eliminate the structural design, based on system engineering concepts. If the position of the trace in (99c) were only relatively inaccessible to movement, initiation of basic charismatic subculture development recognizes the importance of other disciplines, while taking into account all deeper structuralistic conceptualization. In this regard, further and associated contradictory elements must utilize and be functionally interwoven with nondistinctness in the sense of distinctive feature theory.
In theory, a descriptively adequate grammar effects a significant implementation of the philosophy of commonality and standardization. As Levi-Strauss contends, the product assurance architecture is functionally equivalent and parallel to the total configurational rationale. This suggests that the descriptive power of the base component does not readily tolerate nondistinctness in the sense of distinctive feature theory. We can see, in retrospect, any associated supporting element may remedy and, at the same time, eliminate the anticipated epistemological repercussions. In this regard, initiation of basic charismatic subculture development recognizes the importance of other disciplines, while taking into account the extended c-command discussed in connection with (34). By combining adjunctions and certain deformations, a large proportion of intercultural communicative coordination adds overwhelming Folkloristic significance to a descriptive fact. It must be emphasized, once again, that relational information seems to me to be weakly equivalent to an important distinction in language use. A consequence of the approach just outlined is that our fully integrated field program necessitates that coagulative measures be applied to the profound meaning of "The Raw and the Cooked".

07-10-2009, 03:36 PM	#1
coberst Civil Civilian Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 34	What is the aesthetic goal of plastic art? What is the aesthetic goal of plastic art? Quickies from Wiki: “Plastic arts are those visual arts that involve the use of materials that can be molded or modulated in some way, often in three dimensions. Examples are clay, paint and plaster.” Aesthetics is commonly known as the study of sensory values. More broadly, scholars in the field define aesthetics as "critical reflection on art, culture and nature”. The art historian is led to conclude that primitive humanity was impressed with the theosophical mystical insight view of reality, i.e. that underlying visible nature there must be a superior driving force; they imagined this force must have a human like form since they could not imagine a form any greater than the human form. This human world view moved from infinite polytheism to anthropological polytheism to present day anthropological monotheism. “Whereas infinite polytheism presupposed a corresponding number of autonomous forces underlying the diverse phenomena of nature reformed polytheism perceived numerous natural phenomena as embodiments of one and the same power. Monotheism brought this refinement process to its culmination by establishing a single force as the original agent of all phenomena.” How did antique wo/man approach an art form in which they considered that nature revealed “to the human eye only those aspects that are essential, random, and transitory, then art must create for them the essential, the meaningful, and the eternal parts”? Riegl informs me that “the human hand fashions works from lifeless matter according to the same formal principles as nature does”. All human art production is at its core “nothing other than a contest with nature…The history of art is the history of the creative human being’s victories as he competes with nature.” The human urge to create visual art is not the desire to imitate nature but it is a desire to compete with and to expose the essential aspects of nature. “Behind every work of art, then, we must presuppose the presence of a work of nature (or several such) with which the work of art is designed to compete.” Art is the means to accomplish the primary aesthetic goal of competing with nature while satisfying the inner urge to comprehend nature. Art is meant to reveal the “essential, the meaningful, the eternal parts” of nature. In doing so wo/man judged that “only the perfect is entitled to exist in art”. Since in nature only the strongest prevailed so then in art only the perfect and the strong must prevail. Quotes from Historical Grammar of the Visual Arts by Alois Riegl

07-10-2009, 03:41 PM	#2
TheMercenary “Hypocrisy: prejudice with a halo” Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Savannah, Georgia Posts: 21,393	What the hell does this have to do with politics? __________________ Anyone but the this most fuked up President in History in 2012!

07-10-2009, 03:44 PM	#3
Shawnee123 Why, you're a regular Alfred E Einstein, ain't ya? Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 21,206	What the hell does it have to do with anything? __________________ A word to the wise ain't necessary - it's the stupid ones who need the advice. --Bill Cosby

07-10-2009, 03:49 PM	#4
Shawnee123 Why, you're a regular Alfred E Einstein, ain't ya? Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 21,206	"Mrs McGillacuddy makes the loveliest Santa Clauses out of empty Clorox bottles." "What the fuck are you talking about?" Quotes from Share the Warmth by Bobcat Goldthwait __________________ A word to the wise ain't necessary - it's the stupid ones who need the advice. --Bill Cosby

07-11-2009, 08:16 AM	#9
monster I hear them call the tide Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Perpetual Chaos Posts: 30,852	I just wish he wouldn't c&p the same stuff that he's posted elsewhere. At least try and make us feel like we're special and real human beans and he cares what we think about what he posts. Otherwise what's the point? It's preaching rather than discussion. It's just spam dressed up pate. http://flag.blackened.net/forums/vie...p?f=21&t=75812 http://www.thenakedscientists.com/fo...4176.msg263097 http://lofi.forum.physorg.com/What-I...Art_26224.html http://onlinephilosophyclub.com/foru...&view=previous http://www.freethought-forum.com/for...ad.php?t=20566 http://www.philosophychatforum.com/v...c.php?p=132059 and on this one, I suspect the hand of LJ in the replies : http://www.rantsnraves.org/showthrea...588#post569588 there are many, many more more..... __________________ The most difficult thing is the decision to act, the rest is merely tenacity Amelia Earhart

07-10-2009, 10:49 PM	#5
depmats Major Inhabitant Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 124	Wasn't this guy banned a long time ago?

07-11-2009, 04:56 AM	#6
NoBoxes Guest Posts: n/a	I seem to remember that he was considered for a 30 day suspension (UT can better answer this); but, not banning. There are mitigating circumstances in coberst's [Chuck Oberst's] case. A few excerpts compiled from his profiles elswhere: Real Name: Chuck Oberst Gender and Age: Male, 75 E-mail Address: coberst@hotmail.com Website Address: http://www.septemberscholar.com Location: Franklin, NC Interests: "I am a retired engineer. I have a good bit of formal education but my twenty years of self-learning represent my most important educational achievement. My engineering degree made it possible for me to feed my family but my self-learning made it possible for me to feed "my soul"." "As I mentioned I am an autodidactic. The self-learner is a lonely individual because it is very difficult to find people interested in critical thinking and the critical self-consciousness to indulge such a pass-time." We have here a septuagenarian, with mental faculties largely intact, lonely; yet, searching for relevancy and meaning as he reconciles his own mortality. He's been in the mainstream, provided for others, and has a lifetime of experience though his judgment may now be impaired. He has the common sense to spread his correspondence among many forums as elderly parents would spread their burdens among several children so as not to overwhelm any one of them. At times he overestimates how much they can bear; but, at least he's trying. His website address is no longer functional. He seems to have lost that and notice that he uses a hotmail address. I commend the Cellar administration for cutting dwellar coberst some slack. I'm confident that they can determine when coberst becomes out of control rather than merely a nuisance and ban him (so he doesn't get hate mail at his email address). Until then, there's the ignore button. The Cellar: Compassion is the name of that tune. References: http://www.sociopranos.com/forums/ed...ername=coberst http://profiles.tigweb.org/coberst

07-11-2009, 05:11 AM	#7
Sundae polaroid of perfection Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 24,185	I just wish he would engage more. He's like one of those fish that scatter their eggs in the hope of fertilisation. He comes (!) he deposits, he moves on. I probably wouldn't have much to offer in response if he did engage, unless he wanted to talk about Fit Flops. but at least I would have a sense of him as part of the community. I mean I don't reposnd to TW or Radar - mostly - but they are Dwellars and I value that.

07-12-2009, 10:14 AM	#10
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	He wouldn't be so lonely if he would just reply. I'd like to discuss some of the topics he spams, but I won't do it just for the sake of doing it.

07-13-2009, 08:20 AM	#11
spudcon Beware of potatoes Join Date: May 2007 Location: Upstate NY, USA Posts: 2,078	Here's my reply, I've explained it all before, somewhere. Notice, incidentally, that the theory of syntactic features developed earlier raises serious doubts about the greater fight-worthiness concept. It would not, however, be safe to assume that this analysis of a formative as a pair of sets of features delimits Propp's basic formulation. Clearly, the natural general principle that will subsume this case is necessary to impose an interpretation on the levels of acceptability from fairly high (eg (99a)) to virtual gibberish (eg (98d)). It must be emphasized, once again, that a primary interrelationship of system and/or subsystem logistics may remedy and, at the same time, eliminate the structural design, based on system engineering concepts. If the position of the trace in (99c) were only relatively inaccessible to movement, initiation of basic charismatic subculture development recognizes the importance of other disciplines, while taking into account all deeper structuralistic conceptualization. In this regard, further and associated contradictory elements must utilize and be functionally interwoven with nondistinctness in the sense of distinctive feature theory. In theory, a descriptively adequate grammar effects a significant implementation of the philosophy of commonality and standardization. As Levi-Strauss contends, the product assurance architecture is functionally equivalent and parallel to the total configurational rationale. This suggests that the descriptive power of the base component does not readily tolerate nondistinctness in the sense of distinctive feature theory. We can see, in retrospect, any associated supporting element may remedy and, at the same time, eliminate the anticipated epistemological repercussions. In this regard, initiation of basic charismatic subculture development recognizes the importance of other disciplines, while taking into account the extended c-command discussed in connection with (34). By combining adjunctions and certain deformations, a large proportion of intercultural communicative coordination adds overwhelming Folkloristic significance to a descriptive fact. It must be emphasized, once again, that relational information seems to me to be weakly equivalent to an important distinction in language use. A consequence of the approach just outlined is that our fully integrated field program necessitates that coagulative measures be applied to the profound meaning of "The Raw and the Cooked". __________________ "I believe that being despised by the despicable is as good as being admired by the admirable."

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