The Cellar  

Go Back   The Cellar > Main > Philosophy

Philosophy Religions, schools of thought, matters of importance and navel-gazing

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-22-2012, 04:10 PM   #1
henry quirk
maskless: yesterday, today, tomorrow
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,162
"She", not "he", guys

If he has a penis, is genetically male, then -- despite *self-definition -- he is 'he'.

Yes?

No?

Opinions?









*that Ibram self-defines as 'girl' is fine by me; that he believes any one else is obligated to address him as a girl (for no other reason than because he wants it that way) is absurd.
__________________
like the other guy sez: 'not really back, blah-blah-blah...'
henry quirk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2012, 04:18 PM   #2
Ibby
erika
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: "the high up north"
Posts: 6,127
My gender is not open for "philosophical" discussion, and i'm reporting this post.
__________________
not really back, you didn't see me, i was never here shhhhhh
Ibby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2012, 04:19 PM   #3
Ibby
erika
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: "the high up north"
Posts: 6,127
report: "harassment, rude, just not fucking acceptable. you wanna start a thread about how you hate tranny fucks thats fine; you don't get to start a thread attacking me PERSONALLY for it."
__________________
not really back, you didn't see me, i was never here shhhhhh
Ibby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2012, 04:20 PM   #4
BigV
Goon Squad Leader
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Seattle
Posts: 27,063
define "...guys..."
__________________
Be Just and Fear Not.
BigV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2012, 04:57 PM   #5
infinite monkey
Person who doesn't update the user title
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 13,002
Define 'cunt.'

If gender is so fluid, then what I may view as man or woman, my perception, is mine. Right? I may think henry a fine woman. He may think otherwise.

For someone who preaches understanding and acceptance of all things, ibs, you were awfully quick to call out jbk in that other thread.

And that's why you're mad. You got called out on your intolerance and you look hypocritical.
infinite monkey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2012, 05:40 PM   #6
BigV
Goon Squad Leader
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Seattle
Posts: 27,063
Quote:
Originally Posted by infinite monkey View Post
snip--

And that's why you're mad. You got called out on your intolerance and you look hypocritical.
... I don't see it that way. hq named Ibram specifcally. hq started the thread with Ibram specifically in mind. Then, Ibram complained about hq's remarks about Ibram specifically. That's not being a cunt. That's not being a hypocrite. That's objecting to being called something or another. hq can say and think what he likes, and Ibram can respond as he likes.

Quote:
*that Ibram self-defines as 'girl' is fine by me; that he believes any one else is obligated to address him as a girl (for no other reason than because he wants it that way) is absurd.
What if I called you "stupid"? I could say the same thing as the above quote:

Quote:
"*that infinite monkey self-defines as 'smart' is fine by me; that she believes anyone else is obligated to her as smart (for no other reason than because she wants it that way) is absurd."
You may well object, and strenuously, to being referred to like that, but that wouldn't make it hypocrisy, even if you'd had made a dumb mistakes in the past. It's just objecting to someone else's statements about you.

For the record, I don't remember anything from Ibram indicating he
Quote:
preaches understanding and acceptance of all things
. Also for the record, I don't think you're stupid. Quite the opposite, I think you're whip-smart. But I still don't agree with your analysis of Ibram's reaction.
__________________
Be Just and Fear Not.
BigV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2012, 05:06 PM   #7
Ibby
erika
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: "the high up north"
Posts: 6,127
nope. i don't accept intolerance. comparing bullshit to the holocaust is intolerance of the highest degree. you don't have to agree, but that's not be being quick to not-accept. some things are just fucking wrong.
__________________
not really back, you didn't see me, i was never here shhhhhh
Ibby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2012, 05:35 PM   #8
orthodoc
Not Suspicious, Merely Canadian
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 3,774
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ibram View Post
some things are just fucking wrong.
Are you saying that objective 'right' and 'wrong' exist? Or are you just expressing an opinion?

Not up for a fight tonight ... just throwing the philosophical question out there.
__________________
The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated. - Ghandi

Last edited by orthodoc; 06-22-2012 at 06:21 PM. Reason: typo
orthodoc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2012, 03:16 PM   #9
footfootfoot
To shreds, you say?
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: in the house and on the street-how many, many feet we meet!
Posts: 18,449
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ibram View Post
nope. i don't accept intolerance.
I so get that. I can't stand intolerance either.


__________________
The internet is a hateful stew of vomit you can never take completely seriously. - Her Fobs
footfootfoot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2012, 05:51 PM   #10
DanaC
We have to go back, Kate!
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Yorkshire
Posts: 25,964
Quote:
Originally Posted by henry quirk View Post
If he has a penis, is genetically male, then -- despite *self-definition -- he is 'he'.

Yes?

No?

Opinions?
According to the usual western gender constructions yes. But it isn't really that simple. Nor has it ever been. Lots of cultures recognise broader understandings of gender (as well as narrower in other cultures) than ours currently does. Some cultures accept a 'third gender'. Some grudgingly, some with hallowed respect. Some cultures with highly regulated gender roles will nontheless allow a widow or single woman to adopt a masculine identity in order to lead their household. Referred to as 'he' and 'him' from that point on.

The more we learn about gender the more it seems that neither biological gender, nor psycho-sexual gender( or indeed cultural understandings of gender) are anywhere near as black and white as we once understood them to be.


All that aside: why not accept someone else's self-definition? They're the only ones who know what life is like on the inside of their own heads.
__________________
Quote:
There's only so much punishment a man can take in pursuit of punani. - Sundae
http://sites.google.com/site/danispoetry/
DanaC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2012, 06:00 PM   #11
Ibby
erika
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: "the high up north"
Posts: 6,127
cause dana, basic human decency and courtesy is way too hard for fucked up people like him. duh.
__________________
not really back, you didn't see me, i was never here shhhhhh
Ibby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2012, 06:07 PM   #12
infinite monkey
Person who doesn't update the user title
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 13,002
For the record, bigv, I was referring to ibs calling henry a cunt, in that other thread.

But I get it. We must all be tolerant but ibs doesn't have to be tolerant. Because he's different and special? We're all different and special.

Id like a manual, because I'm unsure of the rules here: who gets to go off on whom, and about what? Is there a decider?
infinite monkey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2012, 06:09 PM   #13
infinite monkey
Person who doesn't update the user title
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 13,002
Basic human decency and courtesy = 'you sick twisted fuck'

To someone who has admitted to mental illness. Nice.
infinite monkey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2012, 06:11 PM   #14
DanaC
We have to go back, Kate!
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Yorkshire
Posts: 25,964
So, because he has admitted to mental illness he gets a free pass on whatever nasty, bigoted or misogynistic bullshit he decides to post?

And whilst we're all lecturing each other on who has to tolerate whom, how bout sparing a thought for the fact that Ibs has pretty good reason to expect bigotted bullshit from Klyde.

That's the problem with human interaction. We form views of each other and respond as much to that as to what the other person actually says. So, Klyde has done a bang up job of making sure that in the event of any doubt it's a pretty safe bet that his words probably are bigotted and anti-gay.

And yeah, maybe his mental state has something to do with that, or maybe he's just a racist, homophobic, anti-woman prick, who also happens to be mentally ill.

Who the fuck knows. I certainly don't.
__________________
Quote:
There's only so much punishment a man can take in pursuit of punani. - Sundae
http://sites.google.com/site/danispoetry/

Last edited by DanaC; 06-22-2012 at 06:17 PM.
DanaC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2012, 06:24 PM   #15
DanaC
We have to go back, Kate!
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Yorkshire
Posts: 25,964
Ah. I just realised what you meant. Yeah. Unfortunate choice of words in the circumstances.
__________________
Quote:
There's only so much punishment a man can take in pursuit of punani. - Sundae
http://sites.google.com/site/danispoetry/
DanaC is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:45 AM.


Powered by: vBulletin Version 3.8.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.