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Old 05-05-2005, 12:16 PM   #31
jaguar
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I'm well aware of that but you're not going to get 100% peformance on early flights, until testing and calibration is over it's speculation. In terms of testing priorities, last I checked one of the upcoming tests was taking off so late the tail made sparks, I think that stuff comes before you tweak the engines to maximise mileage.
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Old 05-05-2005, 12:26 PM   #32
wolf
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Jag, while you are a lovely, bright, young man, you're arguing with someone who works for a company that builds airplanes.

Big airplanes.

Big American airplanes.
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Old 05-05-2005, 12:34 PM   #33
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So what you're saying is that Bruce has an ulterior motive for casting doubt on Airbus?
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Old 05-05-2005, 12:43 PM   #34
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I'm saying he's in a position to have accurate information about the industry. Particularly the competition ... versus what the advertising wants you to believe about the competition.
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Old 05-05-2005, 03:05 PM   #35
russotto
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No amount of tweaking the software is going to eliminate 10% of the weight...
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Old 05-05-2005, 03:39 PM   #36
tw
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Quote:
Originally Posted by russotto
No amount of tweaking the software is going to eliminate 10% of the weight...
What were the problems that resulted in that 10% increase?
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Old 05-05-2005, 03:42 PM   #37
tw
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Quote:
Originally Posted by russotto
Given that the A380 is intended to be more fuel-efficient (per passenger mile) than the planes it replaces, it isn't ironic at all.
The 747 was also designed to be significantly more efficient. That did not stop an unexpected energy crisis from almost driving Boeing under. Do to the increase price of oil, 747 sales were nearly impossible even though 747 were so much more fuel efficient.
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Old 05-05-2005, 11:21 PM   #38
xoxoxoBruce
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wolf
Jag, while you are a lovely, bright, young man, you're arguing with someone who works for a company that builds airplanes.

Big airplanes.

Big American airplanes.
Naw, I have nothing to do with airplanes.
The Boeing intranet news/announcement/notice website subscribes to a news service. It's called Lone Buffalo and I think it's owned by Dow Jones Reuters Business Interactive, or some such.
Anyway, Lone Buffalo posts any news story, no matter how big or small the publication, that has anything to do with the airplane business, commercial or military. Part of the deal is Boeing can't change or edit anything that LB posts.
So I've been following this story and some others pretty closely. Some of the best information, the things that are really telling, come from obscure trade publications. The little tid bits that put the major news stories in perspective and sometimes make the stories make sense.

When an airline says, "We'll buy 35 model 7xx planes," they have to chose which engines they'll use from Rolls Royce, General Electric or Pratt & Whitney. Each engine has plus and minus points the airline has to balance.

When he upcoming Boeing 787 was in the feasability planning stage, they went to the engine boys and said we need xxxthrust, yyy efficiency, with zzz reliability and no bleed. They came back with proposals(promises) and the rest of the plane was designed around those parameters. If the engine boys fail to deliver on their promises, Boeing is majorly screwed. That's why the slightest shortcoming of the engines carries major financial penalties.

Part of the 787 deal is Boeing chose one engine supplier only, rather than one or sometimes two from each supplier and let the airline decide the tradeoffs. I think the engine supplier is eating some of the development costs in return.

Damn, I've gotten long winded in my old age! Anyway, there's a lot of things that come into play when shooting for a desired(or promised) performance. With aircraft, weight is a major, major player. Engine performance is another biggie and usually the contracts with the plane's buyers have big penalties for missing efficiency marks.
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Last edited by xoxoxoBruce; 05-05-2005 at 11:24 PM.
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Old 11-14-2017, 05:36 PM   #39
Undertoad
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We may have just witnessed the end of the Airbus A380 superjumbo

Interesting article, good old thread. It turns out xoB was right.
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Old 11-14-2017, 06:01 PM   #40
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Egads, the broken clock has struck again.

That only happens, like, twice a day... which isn't that bad really.
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Old 11-17-2017, 09:34 AM   #41
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747 program is also ending.
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