The doom of the rich, the blessing of the poor

Gannet495 · 07-30-2007, 07:48 AM

James 5:1-6 Go to now, ye rich men, weep and howl for your miseries that shall come upon you. (2) Your riches are corrupted, and your garments are motheaten. (3) Your gold and silver is cankered; and the rust of them shall be a witness against you, and shall eat your flesh as it were fire. Ye have heaped treasure together for the last days. (4) Behold, the hire of the laborers who have reaped down your fields, which is of you kept back by fraud, crieth: and the cries of them which have reaped are entered into the ears of the Lord of Sabaoth. (5) Ye have lived in pleasure on the earth, and been wanton; ye have nourished your hearts, as in a day of slaughter. (6) Ye have condemned and killed the just; and he doth not resist you.

Luke 16:19-31 There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day: (20) And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores, (21) And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores. (22) And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried; (23) And in hell he lifted up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. (24) And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame. (25) But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented. (26) And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence. (27) Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house: (28) For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment. (29) Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them. (30) And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent. (31) And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

1 John 3:16-18 Hereby perceive we the love of God, because he laid down his life for us: and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren. (17) But whoso hath this world's good, and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels of compassion from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him? (18) My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth.

Luke 6:24-26 But woe unto you that are rich! for ye have received your consolation. (25) Woe unto you that are full for ye shall hunger. Woe unto you that laugh now! for ye shall mourn and weep. (26) Woe unto you, when all men shall speak well of you! for so did their fathers to the false prophets.

Luk 6:20 And he lifted up his eyes on his disciples, and said, Blessed be ye poor: for yours is the kingdom of God.
Luk 6:21 Blessed are ye that hunger now: for ye shall be filled. Blessed are ye that weep now: for ye shall laugh.

Are any of you rich? Sell all you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then follow Lord Jesus. He is risen.

DanaC · 07-30-2007, 08:34 AM

mmm k

glatt · 07-30-2007, 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gannet495

Are any of you rich? Sell all you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then follow Lord Jesus. He is risen.

I see you have access to a computer, Gannet. That puts you in the wealthiest 10% of the world population. I'd be worried if I were you.

There's a test around here somewhere that shows just how wealthy you are, comparatively. Lets see if I can find it.

DanaC · 07-30-2007, 09:04 AM

......but the thing I don't get is.....if the wealthy sell 'all that [they] have' to give to the poor.....then they'll have nothing left and they'll be the poor....the poor meanwhile, have done quite nicely out of the deal (the ones who were near enough to the crazy rich people to benefit that is).

I'm not really sure that solves the problem.....Gannet, have you considered the relative benefits of a responsible social security network, coupled with ethical trading laws and standards as a less drastic solution? Requires rather more political engagement, and rather less personal disavowal of wealth and the adoption of hair shirts (optional) than the other idea, but it might be more sustainable.

Shawnee123 · 07-30-2007, 09:11 AM

Vote DanaC for Lord and Savior!

You're right, if I give my meager belongings to the poor then I become the poor and the poor become, well, me. More than poor but less then wealthy. Where do we fit into the scenario? Is there like a heaven holding tank where we'll go on the day of reckonin'?

glatt · 07-30-2007, 09:15 AM

Well, I couldn't find the Cellar thread on how rich we all are, but here's a test to put it in perspective. I'm in the 99th percentile, according to this. Where are you Gannet?

yesman065 · 07-30-2007, 09:37 AM

Its the priciple of communism - just give everything to everyone else - all can share what some of us worked for. Never works. I give to charity and always do random acts of kindness, but I cannot accept that principle - seems to dysfunctional to me.

I really hope I don't burn in hell for saying that.

yesman065 · 07-30-2007, 09:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by glatt

I'm in the 99th percentile, according to this.

Ok, then give me all your stuff glatt

glatt · 07-30-2007, 09:42 AM

but then you'll have to give it right back, because I'll be poor.

theotherguy · 07-30-2007, 09:52 AM

I am in the 99th percentile!

WoooHooo! I think I will quit my job and relax in my riches! I can even get one of those poodles as big as my Bentley as shown on the website.

DanaC · 07-30-2007, 11:00 AM

Quote:

Its the priciple of communism - just give everything to everyone else - all can share what some of us worked for.

That really isn't the principle of communism.

yesman065 · 07-30-2007, 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DanaC

That really isn't the principle of communism.

I know Dana, it was, just, well, seemed right at the time

- sorry to offend.

DanaC · 07-30-2007, 11:22 AM

*chuckles* not remotely offended m'dear:P

xoxoxoBruce · 07-30-2007, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gannet495

Are any of you rich? Sell all you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then follow Lord Jesus. He is risen.

God & Jesus give me choices.... you give me orders.
God & Jesus go to heaven... you can go to hell.

07-31-2007, 12:44 PM

Joel Osteen says da' lard wants me to be rich so I can be extra happy, God loves me and wants me to have a big house and pool & gives him mo money.
He seems pretty smart and has shiny teefus...
I'm confused.

I likes Luke too, my favorite is 14:26.

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/ar...533448,00.html

http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/.../137-41.0.html

07-30-2007, 07:48 AM	#1
Gannet495 Disciple of the Lord Jesus Christ of Nazareth, God's Son Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 22	The doom of the rich, the blessing of the poor James 5:1-6 Go to now, ye rich men, weep and howl for your miseries that shall come upon you. (2) Your riches are corrupted, and your garments are motheaten. (3) Your gold and silver is cankered; and the rust of them shall be a witness against you, and shall eat your flesh as it were fire. Ye have heaped treasure together for the last days. (4) Behold, the hire of the laborers who have reaped down your fields, which is of you kept back by fraud, crieth: and the cries of them which have reaped are entered into the ears of the Lord of Sabaoth. (5) Ye have lived in pleasure on the earth, and been wanton; ye have nourished your hearts, as in a day of slaughter. (6) Ye have condemned and killed the just; and he doth not resist you. Luke 16:19-31 There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day: (20) And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores, (21) And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores. (22) And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried; (23) And in hell he lifted up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. (24) And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame. (25) But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented. (26) And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence. (27) Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house: (28) For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment. (29) Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them. (30) And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent. (31) And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead. 1 John 3:16-18 Hereby perceive we the love of God, because he laid down his life for us: and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren. (17) But whoso hath this world's good, and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels of compassion from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him? (18) My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth. Luke 6:24-26 But woe unto you that are rich! for ye have received your consolation. (25) Woe unto you that are full for ye shall hunger. Woe unto you that laugh now! for ye shall mourn and weep. (26) Woe unto you, when all men shall speak well of you! for so did their fathers to the false prophets. Luk 6:20 And he lifted up his eyes on his disciples, and said, Blessed be ye poor: for yours is the kingdom of God. Luk 6:21 Blessed are ye that hunger now: for ye shall be filled. Blessed are ye that weep now: for ye shall laugh. Are any of you rich? Sell all you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then follow Lord Jesus. He is risen.

07-30-2007, 09:11 AM	#5
Shawnee123 Why, you're a regular Alfred E Einstein, ain't ya? Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 21,206	Vote DanaC for Lord and Savior! You're right, if I give my meager belongings to the poor then I become the poor and the poor become, well, me. More than poor but less then wealthy. Where do we fit into the scenario? Is there like a heaven holding tank where we'll go on the day of reckonin'? __________________ A word to the wise ain't necessary - it's the stupid ones who need the advice. --Bill Cosby

07-30-2007, 09:52 AM	#10
theotherguy no not that other guy, the other one Join Date: May 2007 Location: TN Posts: 640	I am in the 99th percentile! WoooHooo! I think I will quit my job and relax in my riches! I can even get one of those poodles as big as my Bentley as shown on the website. __________________ I should be working.

07-31-2007, 12:44 PM	#15
rkzenrage Guest Posts: n/a	Joel Osteen says da' lard wants me to be rich so I can be extra happy, God loves me and wants me to have a big house and pool & gives him mo money. He seems pretty smart and has shiny teefus... I'm confused. I likes Luke too, my favorite is 14:26. http://www.time.com/time/magazine/ar...533448,00.html http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/.../137-41.0.html Last edited by rkzenrage; 07-31-2007 at 12:54 PM.

07-30-2007, 08:34 AM	#2
DanaC We have to go back, Kate! Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Yorkshire Posts: 25,964	mmm k

07-30-2007, 09:04 AM	#4
DanaC We have to go back, Kate! Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Yorkshire Posts: 25,964	......but the thing I don't get is.....if the wealthy sell 'all that [they] have' to give to the poor.....then they'll have nothing left and they'll be the poor....the poor meanwhile, have done quite nicely out of the deal (the ones who were near enough to the crazy rich people to benefit that is). I'm not really sure that solves the problem.....Gannet, have you considered the relative benefits of a responsible social security network, coupled with ethical trading laws and standards as a less drastic solution? Requires rather more political engagement, and rather less personal disavowal of wealth and the adoption of hair shirts (optional) than the other idea, but it might be more sustainable.

07-30-2007, 09:15 AM	#6
glatt ™ Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Arlington, VA Posts: 27,717	Well, I couldn't find the Cellar thread on how rich we all are, but here's a test to put it in perspective. I'm in the 99th percentile, according to this. Where are you Gannet?

07-30-2007, 09:37 AM	#7
yesman065 Banned - Self Imposed Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 1,847	Its the priciple of communism - just give everything to everyone else - all can share what some of us worked for. Never works. I give to charity and always do random acts of kindness, but I cannot accept that principle - seems to dysfunctional to me. I really hope I don't burn in hell for saying that.

07-30-2007, 09:42 AM	#9
glatt ™ Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Arlington, VA Posts: 27,717	but then you'll have to give it right back, because I'll be poor.

07-30-2007, 11:22 AM	#13
DanaC We have to go back, Kate! Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Yorkshire Posts: 25,964	chuckles not remotely offended m'dear:P

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