Can ya spare some change mister? - Page 3

kerosene · 12-11-2007, 02:46 PM

I got the quarter!

lookout123 · 12-11-2007, 02:49 PM

i kind of feel bad about only pledging $2.50 though. i think we should aim higher. this should work:

Merc: $1000
HLJ: $100
L123: $10
Case: $1

still seems a bit low. would you be comfortable giving $5 case?

Undertoad · 12-11-2007, 03:04 PM

I really think that continuing donations are more important. This is only the third month of the Tip Mug filling and although it does so impressively, I do wonder what will happen when this initial burst of interest in it passes.

Until something breaks...

lookout123 · 12-11-2007, 03:33 PM

i think you have the right idea there UT. but in all honesty i would like to see you handle any monthly overages differently. rather than starting the next month with a credit already in the tip mug, just put it off to the side for future needs.

if you need $250 for the month and December produces $300 - then take that extra $50, set it aside for future needs and start on January 1st with the tip mug on $0. everyone here knows you aren't making a profit or running a scam, so i don't think anyone would have a problem with that. It's just that if you keep rolling the overage over, then the urgent reminder to tip becomes much less urgent.

IMO

Aliantha · 12-11-2007, 04:16 PM

I agree with lookout here. I don't think it's asking too much to fill it completely each month.

Realistically, even if the top 25 posters only contributed, that's only $10/month. I don't think that's too much is it?

kerosene · 12-11-2007, 04:18 PM

I agree...I think this should be something that we bring back into the open every month to be sure your costs are covered, UT. If someone bumps this thread every month, I am sure to see it and I will donate whatever I can swing. After all, I get to post my paintings in the creativity thread and to do that anywhere else, I would have to pay (as I do, some places.)

Yes, put away the extra for months that maybe aren't so lucrative.

And what would be wrong with UT making a little profit? I mean, he puts a lot of time and effort toward this, anyway...more than some of us put toward working *looking towards self*.

Undertoad · 12-11-2007, 05:18 PM

If I tried to make it a money-making thing, it wouldn't make any money. I don't think this thing works if it's not community first. Plus, I would hate it if somebody accused me of operating in some way just to make more money from it.

lookout123 · 12-11-2007, 05:46 PM

personally i wouldn't have a problem with you receiving income for time spent working on the cellar or anything of the sort. that being said, i really respect that you do what you do because you enjoy the community. i think anyone who actually matters would agree that we all trust you not to skim from the register for lack of a better term. that is why i think it would be acceptable, even preferable for you to start each month at zero in the tip mug and pull any overages off the table so that you don't have to hit your personal checking account if one of your fancy dancy computer thingamabobs (technical jargon alert) needs to be replaced.

i said it before that i will personally bump this thread or place a reminder about the tip mug every month until i am told to stop by you or a moderator. who knows? maybe i'll think of some way to actually have fun with it. maybe i'll issue some challenges or figure out a way to turn it into a game. in fact, i hear LJ is going to donate a new nissan as a prize for a fund raising game we are having next month. *shhh, jinx doesn't know*

Aliantha · 12-11-2007, 05:59 PM

will it be right or left hand drive?

BigV · 12-11-2007, 06:22 PM

"Making money", "covering known expenses", "being able to cover unexpecteded but appropriate expenses by drawing on a reserve, built up by saving the suplus of the tips that exceed the monthly expenses"--these phrases are different how?

lookout123 · 12-12-2007, 10:30 AM

i'm sorry V, my brain isn't running at full speed so I don't really understand which direction your post is taking us. I'd like your view on this though. Do you agree that it would be a good idea to put extra tips into reserve for future repairs/needs, or do you see a downside to the idea that I missed?

Here is how I've processed this in my brain. UT in addition to being an allaround good guy is a bitchin bassist(and John Favreau impersonator, but i digress). IIRC he has been involved in several bands who play gigs and get paid for it. I think he is past the point in life of dreaming about landing a highly lucrative record deal and being a fixture on TRL... but making enough $$$ to break even and put a little off to the side for future equipment needs would seem to be a good goal. A self sustaining hobby.

I think the cellar is much like that. It is obvious UT gets great enjoyment from the cellar - as do we all. Having enough income generated to break even and pay for the necessary dodads seems like an admireable goal to me.

Anyway, that is how my brain works.

Oh, and i think it is important to remind anyone reading this that the cellar is not a pay for play environment. those that don't have the extra cash to tip really shouldn't - and shouldn't feel pressured or guilty if they are not able to do so. those that have the ability to tip and are so inclined, will.

Undertoad · 12-12-2007, 10:46 AM

You've nailed it sir. Self-sustaining hobby, that's what I think of both these endeavors...

And also, if I had to pay the whole Cellar bill myself, at this point in my life I would have to let it die. It's too much money for a hobby, and too much providing a free ride to folks, no matter how cool it really is.

Undertoad · 12-12-2007, 10:49 AM

Oh and there are no more lucrative record deals, the record industry is on life support and it looks like it is not going to pull through.

lookout123 · 12-12-2007, 10:53 AM

well, i don't know about anyone else since pretty much all my ties tot he industry at large and underground are cut, but the dudes in Fall Out Boy are doing quite well I can assure you.

Undertoad · 12-12-2007, 11:03 AM

The top 20 acts are in a somewhat different space, and will make more money from royalties, though even they do 5-6% fewer album sales every year since 2000.

12-11-2007, 02:49 PM	#32
lookout123 changed his status to single Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Right behind you. No, the other side. Posts: 10,308	i kind of feel bad about only pledging $2.50 though. i think we should aim higher. this should work: Merc: $1000 HLJ: $100 L123: $10 Case: $1 still seems a bit low. would you be comfortable giving $5 case? __________________ Getting knocked down is no sin, it's not getting back up that's the sin

12-11-2007, 03:33 PM	#34
lookout123 changed his status to single Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Right behind you. No, the other side. Posts: 10,308	i think you have the right idea there UT. but in all honesty i would like to see you handle any monthly overages differently. rather than starting the next month with a credit already in the tip mug, just put it off to the side for future needs. if you need $250 for the month and December produces $300 - then take that extra $50, set it aside for future needs and start on January 1st with the tip mug on $0. everyone here knows you aren't making a profit or running a scam, so i don't think anyone would have a problem with that. It's just that if you keep rolling the overage over, then the urgent reminder to tip becomes much less urgent. IMO __________________ Getting knocked down is no sin, it's not getting back up that's the sin

12-11-2007, 04:16 PM	#35
Aliantha trying hard to be a better person Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 16,493	I agree with lookout here. I don't think it's asking too much to fill it completely each month. Realistically, even if the top 25 posters only contributed, that's only $10/month. I don't think that's too much is it? __________________ Kind words are the music of the world. F. W. Faber

12-11-2007, 05:46 PM	#38
lookout123 changed his status to single Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Right behind you. No, the other side. Posts: 10,308	personally i wouldn't have a problem with you receiving income for time spent working on the cellar or anything of the sort. that being said, i really respect that you do what you do because you enjoy the community. i think anyone who actually matters would agree that we all trust you not to skim from the register for lack of a better term. that is why i think it would be acceptable, even preferable for you to start each month at zero in the tip mug and pull any overages off the table so that you don't have to hit your personal checking account if one of your fancy dancy computer thingamabobs (technical jargon alert) needs to be replaced. i said it before that i will personally bump this thread or place a reminder about the tip mug every month until i am told to stop by you or a moderator. who knows? maybe i'll think of some way to actually have fun with it. maybe i'll issue some challenges or figure out a way to turn it into a game. in fact, i hear LJ is going to donate a new nissan as a prize for a fund raising game we are having next month. shhh, jinx doesn't know __________________ Getting knocked down is no sin, it's not getting back up that's the sin

12-11-2007, 05:59 PM	#39
Aliantha trying hard to be a better person Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 16,493	will it be right or left hand drive? __________________ Kind words are the music of the world. F. W. Faber

12-11-2007, 02:46 PM	#31
kerosene Touring the facilities Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: The plains of Colorado Posts: 3,476	I got the quarter!

12-11-2007, 03:04 PM	#33
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	I really think that continuing donations are more important. This is only the third month of the Tip Mug filling and although it does so impressively, I do wonder what will happen when this initial burst of interest in it passes. Until something breaks...

12-11-2007, 04:18 PM	#36
kerosene Touring the facilities Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: The plains of Colorado Posts: 3,476	I agree...I think this should be something that we bring back into the open every month to be sure your costs are covered, UT. If someone bumps this thread every month, I am sure to see it and I will donate whatever I can swing. After all, I get to post my paintings in the creativity thread and to do that anywhere else, I would have to pay (as I do, some places.) Yes, put away the extra for months that maybe aren't so lucrative. And what would be wrong with UT making a little profit? I mean, he puts a lot of time and effort toward this, anyway...more than some of us put toward working looking towards self.

12-11-2007, 05:18 PM	#37
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	If I tried to make it a money-making thing, it wouldn't make any money. I don't think this thing works if it's not community first. Plus, I would hate it if somebody accused me of operating in some way just to make more money from it.

12-11-2007, 06:22 PM	#40
BigV Goon Squad Leader Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Seattle Posts: 27,063	"Making money", "covering known expenses", "being able to cover unexpecteded but appropriate expenses by drawing on a reserve, built up by saving the suplus of the tips that exceed the monthly expenses"--these phrases are different how? __________________ Be Just and Fear Not.

12-12-2007, 10:30 AM	#41
lookout123 changed his status to single Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Right behind you. No, the other side. Posts: 10,308	i'm sorry V, my brain isn't running at full speed so I don't really understand which direction your post is taking us. I'd like your view on this though. Do you agree that it would be a good idea to put extra tips into reserve for future repairs/needs, or do you see a downside to the idea that I missed? Here is how I've processed this in my brain. UT in addition to being an allaround good guy is a bitchin bassist(and John Favreau impersonator, but i digress). IIRC he has been involved in several bands who play gigs and get paid for it. I think he is past the point in life of dreaming about landing a highly lucrative record deal and being a fixture on TRL... but making enough $$$ to break even and put a little off to the side for future equipment needs would seem to be a good goal. A self sustaining hobby. I think the cellar is much like that. It is obvious UT gets great enjoyment from the cellar - as do we all. Having enough income generated to break even and pay for the necessary dodads seems like an admireable goal to me. Anyway, that is how my brain works. Oh, and i think it is important to remind anyone reading this that the cellar is not a pay for play environment. those that don't have the extra cash to tip really shouldn't - and shouldn't feel pressured or guilty if they are not able to do so. those that have the ability to tip and are so inclined, will. __________________ Getting knocked down is no sin, it's not getting back up that's the sin

12-12-2007, 10:46 AM	#42
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	You've nailed it sir. Self-sustaining hobby, that's what I think of both these endeavors... And also, if I had to pay the whole Cellar bill myself, at this point in my life I would have to let it die. It's too much money for a hobby, and too much providing a free ride to folks, no matter how cool it really is.

12-12-2007, 10:49 AM	#43
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	Oh and there are no more lucrative record deals, the record industry is on life support and it looks like it is not going to pull through.

12-12-2007, 10:53 AM	#44
lookout123 changed his status to single Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Right behind you. No, the other side. Posts: 10,308	well, i don't know about anyone else since pretty much all my ties tot he industry at large and underground are cut, but the dudes in Fall Out Boy are doing quite well I can assure you. __________________ Getting knocked down is no sin, it's not getting back up that's the sin

12-12-2007, 11:03 AM	#45
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	The top 20 acts are in a somewhat different space, and will make more money from royalties, though even they do 5-6% fewer album sales every year since 2000.

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