The Race Card

[it]

interesting...

i thought i was going to enjoy a little rant about using the race card, and the joy of being a middle eastern in north america...

but this is far more interesting.

at first glance, my instinct is to deny that they can have any kind of legitimacy, but then i look at my own country, and... well, i am not sure to what extent our current ruling party - the Likud lead by binyamin - is that different from them.

he has instated the death penalty - not for pedo's or even murderers, but specifically for threatening the life of the PM (himself).
he has provided a partial 1 year government payment for the higher education of army veterans (otherwise known as almost everyone "local"), which is way better then housing.
he has increased the government support the religious right's control over the immigration process (which is racial by nature).
and to say he is islamophobic would be the understatement of the day...

if you'd ask me a decade ago, the idea of him coming into power again would seem incredibly unlikely... but with the left loosing its voting base since the fall of the peace treaties, and the right loosing its leadership, the vacuum was there for him to fill.

[Rhianne]

In case anyone is interested, 95 people gave our National Front candidate, Mr. McIvor, their 1st preference votes (we use a form of PR in Scotland). This put him seventh out of the eight candidates in the first round with only the Liberal Democrat (68 votes) behind him - yes, the LibDems really are that unpopular around here!

[DanaC]

We officially lost our last BNP Councillor a couple of years ago when he went independant. Now he's been voted out in favour of a Labour councillor. We are now fascist free :p

[GunMaster357]

They sing the same song as the French "Front National". Unfortunately, it's not very funny.

In the first round of elections for the Presidence (2 weeks ago), they were credited with over 17% of votes. In 2002, they arrived in second position in the first round and went onto the second that they lost.

Yet, while I cannot say that I like them, they have some proposals that aren't just bullshit. Some might even be workable.

If they can get 17% of votes on a major election, they're not a marginal party. Yet, that's how they're seen by the whole French left wing.

My late father used to say that you should never give power to extremists but, should you begin to hear them growing louder, it's the sure sign you have to do something.

[Sundae]

Originally Posted by GunMaster357

My late father used to say that you should never give power to extremists but, should you begin to hear them growing louder, it's the sure sign you have to do something.

Did he live in Vichy?
(sorry, not a serious question)

We were all quite concerned about Marine Le Pen's popularity over here.
Well, when I say "we" I obviously don't include the sort of people that put a flyer through Rhianne's letterbox, or who presumably would like to send her "home".

I perceive France as having more racial trouble than Great Britain. But you're more flammable than we are. Of you ignore the riots last year, we don't set fire to things all that often. It must come from the culture of having flambe dishes at the table

[DanaC]

Originally Posted by Sundae

I perceive France as having more racial trouble than Great Britain. But you're more flammable than we are. Of you ignore the riots last year, we don't set fire to things all that often. It must come from the culture of having flambe dishes at the table

I kind of want to agree with you, inasmuch as the French are far more likely to move to organised action and civil disobedience than Brits. But, the flipside to that is that british protests are very, very likely to turn into disorganised rioting, and we have a greater tendency to to focus anger on 'wealthy' individuals and their property during such unrest. The looting and burning of shops and small businesses was absolutely consistent with British civil unrest pretty much throughout the modern era.

[Sundae]

The French set fire to anything that stays still. A "protest" isn't a protest without some burning cars. And I'm talking old crates, not just flash Mercedes.

But I admit I admire the French for the way they protest. I wouldn't want to live there, but I wouldn't want to live anywhere apart from here. Their political zeal (check out the voting turnout!) and their desire to stay French appeal to me. The way that clashes with immigrants from their former colonies does not.

Then again I can't think of any country that has it right - European or otherwise. Japan and America have similar problems.

[DanaC]

That's the point though really. the french know how to protest. And how to maintain protest. Granted it generally does involve setting fire to things.

We don't seem to be able to maintain protest in the same way. It devolves quickly into unfocused rioting and that generally turns into looting.

The french organise benefits claimants into hit squads and raid a supermarket for food. The British randomly loot trainers and vodka, and trash shops in a rage with nowhere to go.

[Sundae]

The first time I was impressed with French activism was 20+ years ago.
The banks decided to charge for paying cheques into bank accounts.
Pardonnez moi? said their customers. I don't think so.

They ran magnets or scribbled over the barcodes on the paying in slips.
I might have the exact way of protesting wrong, but the bottom line was that every single cheque had to be entered manually.

The banks backed down. Vive la France.

[DanaC]

It's the supermarket dashes that always impressed me the most.

[DanaC]

And y'know...that whole Bastille thing...

[GunMaster357]

Originally Posted by Sundae

The way that clashes with immigrants from their former colonies does not.

One of our growing problems is that more and more of these people don't want to be French, they want to recreate their own place.

And also:

Someone in my family had a need for social services. And the person he met told him that unfortunately he wasn't of the right color...

[classicman]

The people of one Edinburgh district would rather have a penguin represent them on city council than a Liberal Democrat.

At least, that's what the results of the Scottish capital's latest election would suggest.

Mike Ferrigan, an independent candidate and climate activist who campaigned for Edinburgh City Council dressed as a penguin,
got more votes than the rival Liberal Democrat and Green Party candidates.

[Sundae]

Originally Posted by DanaC

And y'know...that whole Bastille thing...

They only rescued four prisoners you know.
But one of them wasn't the Marquis de Sade - he'd been moved to Charenton only 10 days before. He is suspected of inciting the storming by shouting that they were murdering prisoners though.

[DanaC]

Originally Posted by Sundae

They only rescued four prisoners you know.
But one of them wasn't the Marquis de Sade - he'd been moved to Charenton only 10 days before. He is suspected of inciting the storming by shouting that they were murdering prisoners though.

Nice triv point. Did not know that :p

Four-shmour though. In Ancien Regime France it was nothing less than a social and cultural earthquake. The symbolic value of the Bastille cannot be over-estimated.