Football (Soccer)

[W.HI.P]

Originally Posted by King

As far as I can tell, this is the 97-98 season, when I guess their defence wasn't that good. It did improve to be the best in the Premiership around 2000-2002, but it isn't as good now as it was then. Hyypia is well past his best. A future defence of Riise-Agger-Carragher-Finnan could be good, but it would have a long way to go before it could be considerd best in the league again. Obviuosly some of the pre-Benitez players were important in Liverpool's European success, particularly Gerrard and Carragher, but the team he inherited wasn't perfect, signings such as Alonso and Garcia had to be made. And it isn't perfect now. Nor am I claiming United's is either. We need a more consistent centre forward than Saha, and we need a box-to-box midfielder. I'm not trying to wind you up or anything, I respect your opinion and I think you've made some good points, I'm just not quite as convinced by Liverpool as you are. However, that doesn't mean I think they are a bad team, as they clearly aren't.

No, were talking about the season that ends in 99, 6 Seasons ago. You can't count 2006, it hasn't happened yet, its in the making.
Look, my point is, that the Base that Holds Liverpool up is 5-6 years in the making, the rest is all sculpting.
Man Utd is building its base as we speak, it will take at LEAST 1 year, more likely two, before they can gel and reach their potential.

How can you not be disapointed by the past few years?
Sure, Rudd, was great. and Rooney, a great replacment. Saha, will fade.
Respect in the United Defence these past years, no doubt.
But you can't represent England in the Champions league with a weak middle line like Man Utd has had over the past few years.
The idea of having Amazing Strikers does not impress me.
Players that play at an elite level are Midfielders, and even more so, defenders. Now, it looks like they're in the right direction.

Liverpool!
Hyppia offered a lot to Liverpool and was a KEY in their success.
S.Gerrard is one of the greatest players in the game. Capability wise~Leadership, position wise. He is a rare individual!
Riise?? Much respect!!
Carragher=proof of the point i was tryna make above about defenders!

Strikers are expendable, for the majority of them last only a few years at the elite levels....few are an exception to this rule.

To think how stupid Rea Madrid feels for picking up Ronaldo when they could have owned A.Nesta even today.
The difference a wise person makes to a franchise.
I insist, Wenger has to go!<<<<<---If ou want me to get into that, I can, specifically explain WHY, this man has to leave Arsenal in order for the team to remain alongside the Spurs for a champions league position next year.

[King]

Ah, ok. Looking at the table for that year, their defence was poor, and it contained Hyypia and Carragher, although Carragher was young and relatively inexperienced at that point. 2-3 years later, they had the best defence in the league, after adding Babbel, Riise and Henchoz to the squad. But of that defence, only Carragher and Riise are playing at a high level really. Hyypia has been good for them but now is past his best. Liverpool are good, but I think they'll need to establish Agger as the new centre-half alongside Carragher, and get a right-winger; Pennant isn't good enough.

I am disappointed in United over the last few years, but this has been our best year since 02-03 already. They need a striker and a midfielder. Rooney isn't really a replacement for van Nistelrooy, Rooney is more of a second striker. Saha is van Nistelrooy's replacement, and I agree that Saha isn't good enough for that, but he is still a good squad player. It's the same with Carrick, he's good, but not good enough to be in the first team, and too similar to Scholes anyway. The defence and goalkeeper are fine for now. I see what you are saying about strikers often not lasting more than as few years at the very top, but I still think they're important. United shouldn't have sold van Nistelrooy, but they need a great goalscorer to replace him; Saha just isn't consistent and composed enough in front of goal.

Real Madrid mainly go for attacking players anyway, but their squad is pretty good. Their main problem is the full-backs. We can talk about Arsenal if you want. How come its just you and me on here anyway? No other football fans on here?

[lookout123]

i'm checking in on you as i love to watch but i don't keep statistics or anything like that. i'm not a rabid fan of any one team, just love to watch any match really.

[Undertoad]

Sheffield United could drop all their players and play with a high school team and still avoid relegation. The clashes between sheffield Wednesday and United cannot go on anymore and they will always be sepeated by a division,so that they should never have to play against each other in a league math again.

Is that a league ruling?

[W.HI.P]

No, not at all, thats a goverment thing.
You see, after the 84 massacre followed by the ban of English teams in Europe, England has taken greater measures than any other country.
Things that cannot be controlled,
like the Sheffield United-Sheffield Wednesday meetings,
have to be stopped some other way.

All I'm saying is that United will remain in the premiership until the year Wednesday simultaneously moves up, or drops another category.
There's just no way that they would allow these two local teams to compete against each two or more times a year, to much bloodshed.
Its not just the day of the game, the blood keeps flowing for weeks, even months after the game is played.

[King]

Originally Posted by W.HI.P

No, not at all, thats a goverment thing.
You see, after the 84 massacre followed by the ban of English teams in Europe, England has taken greater measures than any other country.
Things that cannot be controlled,
like the Sheffield United-Sheffield Wednesday meetings,
have to be stopped some other way.

All I'm saying is that United will remain in the premiership until the year Wednesday simultaneously moves up, or drops another category.
There's just no way that they would allow these two local teams to compete against each two or more times a year, to much bloodshed.
Its not just the day of the game, the blood keeps flowing for weeks, even months after the game is played.

I'm not sure what your talking about. There is no particular history of violence in Sheffield derbies. There are no restrictions on these teams playing in the same league, they played in the same league last season, between 2000-2003, and in the first two years of the Premiership (1992-94).

[W.HI.P]

I'm not sure what your talking about. There is no particular history of violence in Sheffield derbies. There are no restrictions on these teams playing in the same league, they played in the same league last season, between 2000-2003, and in the first two years of the Premiership (1992-94).

Are you kidding???
LMAO dude, no violence? What world do you live in?
There is no official restriction, but mark my words!
Sheffield United and Sheffield Wednesday will NEVER play in the same division again. Higher forces will make sure of that.

King...You wish to talk about the premiership, and yet you lack common knowledge, and furthermore press a point that you are unaware of??? Whats up with you?

[lookout123]

i think we found the UK's version of TW.

[King]

Originally Posted by lookout123

i think we found the UK's version of TW.

Please excuse my ignorance, but what is TW?

[King]

Originally Posted by W.HI.P

Are you kidding???
LMAO dude, no violence? What world do you live in?
There is no official restriction, but mark my words!
Sheffield United and Sheffield Wednesday will NEVER play in the same division again. Higher forces will make sure of that.

King...You wish to talk about the premiership, and yet you lack common knowledge, and furthermore press a point that you are unaware of??? Whats up with you?

Where did you hear this? What higher powers are you talking about? Can you provide any evidence for this or is it just your opinion? I didn't say that there had never been any violence whatsoever, but there is not a tradition of violence, such as in the Rome derby, and certainly there have not been enough problems to seperate the teams artificially. If Sheffield United are relegated (possible), or Wednesday are promoted (a bit more unlikely), then they would play in the same league next year.

[W.HI.P]

What higher powers are you talking about?

I never said Higher powers did i?

The higher forces I speak of, are the same kind of forces that stop war from happening.
Like when the European champions Greece travel to Albania and Turkey.
A greek win is forbidden. This is not in any rule book, but a greek win inside either country on the soccer field will never happen, and it has nothing to do with the players on the field, it has to do with avoiding war.
These things are common knowledge to those involved, yet proof cannot be provided, apart from the results of the past years which you will probably call coincidental.
Ask any Greek though, and they'll tell you why Greece will never win whenever they travel to that tiny soccer nation called Albania.
What they'll tell you is that if a war ever broke out between the two nations, the Greeks would be slaughtered in their sleep, as there would be no invasion neccessary, Albania has already moved into Greece!
If you chuckle at the notion of war coming from a silly soccer game, than it would be an ignorant chuckle in this case.
..but then again, wtf am i suppose to expect from someone who lives in England and is unaware of the bloodshed in your own league which you came here so desprately to talk about.

I'm done with this thread

[King]

Originally Posted by W.HI.P

I never said Higher powers did i?

So you're masking a distinction between the terms higher forces and higher powers? They essentially mean the same thing.

The higher forces I speak of, are the same kind of forces that stop war from happening.
Like when the European champions Greece travel to Albania and Turkey.
A greek win is forbidden. This is not in any rule book, but a greek win inside either country on the soccer field will never happen, and it has nothing to do with the players on the field, it has to do with avoiding war.
These things are common knowledge to those involved, yet proof cannot be provided, apart from the results of the past years which you will probably call coincidental.
Ask any Greek though, and they'll tell you why Greece will never win whenever they travel to that tiny soccer nation called Albania.
What they'll tell you is that if a war ever broke out between the two nations, the Greeks would be slaughtered in their sleep, as there would be no invasion neccessary, Albania has already moved into Greece!
If you chuckle at the notion of war coming from a silly soccer game, than it would be an ignorant chuckle in this case.

As you can't actually provide any evidence for this, it seems a lot like a conspiracy theory to me. If that's what you believe, thenm I guess that's fair enough, but it's just a lot of speculation on your part.

..but then again, wtf am i suppose to expect from someone who lives in England and is unaware of the bloodshed in your own league which you came here so desprately to talk about.

Why you get so angry with me I don't know. This 'bloodshed' of which you speak is a throwback to the 60s and 70s. Violence in English domestic football today is pretty much non-existant. For anybody reading this abroad, please don't think that English football games are just mass brawls. I've been to over 100 matches in this country, and I've NEVER seen any problems. If you're looking for an example of violence, go and watch the Rome derby, or the Glasgow derby, or the Istanbul derby, because it generally doesn't happen in England anymore.

I'm done with this thread

Presumably because you can't get me to buy into your completely baseless conspiracy theories?

[lookout123]

sooo, i may have to break down and spend more dough than i planned. i've been trying to get my hands on a Jay Demerit/ Watford Jersey, but because no one expects them to avoid relegation Watford Jerseys aren't carried through any of the major shops so if I want it I'll have to order directly from the team website. they, of course, want an arm and a leg, with an option on my left nut.

are lower quality team jerseys hard to find over there or something? I would have thought Ebay would have turned something up, but nada.

[wolf]

If you find a source, I'd love to get some Tottenham Hotspurs gear for one of my shrinks.

[Sundae]

Originally Posted by W.HI.P

..but then again, wtf am i suppose to expect from someone who lives in England and is unaware of the bloodshed in your own league which you came here so desprately to talk about.

I'm done with this thread

W.HI.P I have to agree with King here - the idea that two Leagues would be involved in a conspiracy to stop the two Sheffield teams being in the same League is frankly incredible. Every team would have to be in on it in order to fix the results so that they did not go up/ down, not to mention how frustrating it would be for whichever team was "chosen" to play in the League below - Wednesday in this case.

Yes, there has been trouble in the past between the two side. Yes, the teams have "crews" of hooligans with a reputation and the desire to spill eachother's blood. But the London teams have crews as well, and they play against eachother in the same city year in and year out. Also, why would this have kicked in this year (as King says, they played eachother last year) rather than at the height of the violence 4-6 years ago?

I do also question the idea that it is "common knowledge". I've asked a Blades fan friend of mine and he's never even heard of this conspiracy. Perhaps if you could point us in the direction of some evidence (at least evidence that other people believe it) it would make it easier to credit.