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Undertoad 04-18-2020 07:34 PM


Originally Posted by Undertoad (Post 1051083)
Marquette County Sheriff Zybert is a Democrat

Correction: it wasn't this Marquette County Sheriff who was responsible here... apparently they have multiple. It was a Sheriff named Joseph Konrath, who is a Republican.

Griff 04-19-2020 07:38 AM


Originally Posted by Luce (Post 1051100)
Frankly, I don't see the country remaining a single political entity much longer. A couple of years, maybe.

Which puts me in a kinda shitty position, cuz it's all about me. My rural neighbors to the North want to leave NY and join PA because they hate taxes, good roads, and good schools. I need to live in a rural place but actually believe government can have a role and miss Republicans with common sense. A rural "liberal" will have trouble finding a moderate welcoming place to settle when secession becomes wholesale.

Diaphone Jim 04-19-2020 11:15 AM

Evil is a strong word, but it is close to what you have to call the entire Republican membership in both houses of Congress when they vote in lockstep with President Pennywise and his cabal of an administration.

tw 04-19-2020 12:50 PM


Originally Posted by Griff (Post 1051085)
I really wish folks could join Team America or Team Humanity instead of this Red Blue dichotomy because it's easy to re-elect extremists like Trump and McConnell ...

Team America does exist. And has been repeatedly defined. They are also called moderates.

tw 04-19-2020 12:58 PM


Originally Posted by Griff (Post 1051140)
My rural neighbors to the North want to leave NY and join PA because they hate taxes, good roads, and good schools.

Reminds me of a dentist who lived on an island between the township and a borough - a shore community. He was known to be an extremist. And insisted this neighborhood be incorporated by the borough because it had lower taxes. That borough outrightly refused. He then decided, like any good extremist, to take revenge.

So that dentist collected his used needles, carried them out on his boat, and spread them in the water so that needles would wash up on beaches.

Being an extremist, he did not know needles have serial numbers. They traced those needles back to him.

Plenty of Timothy McVeighs are out there. They don't like something. So those others must be evil.

Undertoad 04-20-2020 08:30 AM

Facebook says it has removed promotion of anti-quarantine events in California, New Jersey, and Nebraska after consultation with state governments.

Griff 04-20-2020 10:20 AM

To what extent is this an astro-turfing event vs a ground swell of opposition? I know people are frustrated, hell I'm frustrated but too much too soon will kill. Alex Jones is involved so we know it's about being stupid, but I initially assumed it was a Russian amplification thing rather than an ALEC amplification thing. On a bright note there were bible toting end-timers in Endicott yesterday. Everybody hears the message they want to hear I guess.

Undertoad 04-20-2020 10:36 AM

Nobody will agree with me but

Imagine being told to stay home and your job and salary would be protected by the government and then the government didn't protect your job or salary

Then imagine that instead government went on a micromanagement spree preventing you from taking a solitary walk in a local park

Then imagine that, locked in at home, all you had to complain about this was social media. Then imagine the government and private industry colluded to make sure your social media group was deleted

You don't have to tax your imagination very hard, it's happening

Griff 04-20-2020 10:49 AM

You're not wrong. People are being financially ruined by this leading to further concentration in big businesses vs small. The small business I work for got a payroll protection loan which will cover the gap in my reduced hours.

Griff 04-20-2020 10:53 AM

Why the open carry threat though?

Undertoad 04-20-2020 10:54 AM


The small business I work for got a payroll protection loan which will cover the gap in my reduced hours.
Imagine the payroll protection plan only covered part of it and then money for the next part was held up in government by a leader who, when asked what she is doing in the meantime, showed off her wildly expensive designer ice cream in her wildly expensive designer freezer

BigV 04-20-2020 12:01 PM

Now imagine that this plan for economic help, developed during a time of crisis, with input from multiple co-equal branches of government with a long history of bitter opposition, satisfied everyone completely, covered all the shortfalls and risks experienced by individuals and businesses, was delivered immediately, and with no friction or burden to anyone now or in the future. Imagine all the people working to put this plan together got everything right the first time.

Imagine there were no problems at all with with the development and delivery of such a plan. You can't, can you? I can't either.

It doesn't tax one's imagination very hard to think that there will be problems, and that the difficulties will be unevenly distributed. It's not taxing at all to imagine that the ones that gain the most attention will be the dramatic ones like comparing some fool's ice cream to some other person's bare cupboard.

There will be problems, or room for improvement, depending on your perspective.

BigV 04-20-2020 12:18 PM

But on the topic of the title of the thread, I find the term "censorship" a bit of a stretch when applied to the actions of non-governmental entities. Especially companies where participation is voluntary, unlike living in our society here (though some will say that's voluntary too, "love it or leave it"). Lots of social media platforms have terms and conditions, including the cellar. Enforcing those terms and conditions, including the deletion of member input ... I can see how the term censorship could come to mind. I just don't think it's the best description. The effect is the same, but the context is different in fundamentally important ways.

Equal respect for the rules, shared understanding of reality (that phrase is awkward to say the least, I'm leaving it in for now, read for emotional impact if necessary), having a debate about the relative importance of competing pressures is the optimal scenario, but some will want to skip that part and get right to the torches and pitchforks.

Again, not evenly distributed and the aggrieved parties are the ones that make more noise than the satisfied ones.

Undertoad 04-20-2020 12:21 PM


There will be problems, or room for improvement, depending on your perspective.
I totally agree

there is no make-it-all-better button

you may apply that same standard to dear leader

Undertoad 04-20-2020 12:22 PM

Censorship applies to everyone

First amendment protection applies to US government

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