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Old 10-21-2011, 08:34 PM   #76
BigV
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMercenary View Post
Not really, you just vote for the guy you want to make sure Obama does not get re-elected. --snip
Holy mackeral.

I never, *ever* thought I'd see the day mercy declared he'd vote for Hillary Clinton in 2016!!!

[ faints ]
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Old 10-22-2011, 06:37 PM   #77
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And here comes Herman again...

NY Times
By SHERYL GAY STOLBERG
Published: October 22, 2011

Cain, Now Running as Outsider, Came to Washington as Lobbyist
Quote:
WASHINGTON — Herman Cain, the Republican presidential candidate
with the sharp wit and easy-to-remember tax plan, is a cancer survivor,
radio host and former chief executive of Godfather’s Pizza.
On the campaign trail, he talks up his business experience and
casting himself as a “problem solver” and Washington outsider.

But the role that helped propel Mr. Cain into politics was that
of an ultimate Washington insider: industry lobbyist.

From 1996, when he left the pizza company, until 1999,
Mr. Cain ran the National Restaurant Association,
a once-sleepy trade group that he transformed into a lobbying powerhouse.
He allied himself closely with cigarette makers fighting restaurant smoking bans,
spoke out against lowering blood-alcohol limits as a way to prevent drunken driving,
fought an increase in the minimum wage and opposed a patients’ bill of rights —
all in keeping with the interests of the industry he represented.
And besides all that:
Cain writes: "Jesus was "The Perfect Conservative" and was killed by a liberal court"

Quote:
The [Cain] column claims Jesus as a conservative.
"He helped the poor without one government program.
He healed the sick without a government health care system.
He feed the hungry without food stamps," wrote Cain.
"For three years He was unemployed, and never collected an unemployment check."

Cain then describes Jesus' death:
But they made Him walk when He was arrested and taken to jail,
and no, He was not read any Miranda Rights.
He was arrested for just being who He was and doing nothing wrong.
And when they tried Him in court, He never said a mumbling word.
He didn’t have a lawyer, nor did He care about who judged Him.
His judge was a higher power.
The liberal court found Him guilty of false offences and sentenced Him to death,
all because He changed the hearts and minds of men with an army of 12.
@ Huffington Post
And here I always thought Jesus was the ultimate rebel against the establishment.
So I live and learn.
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Old 10-22-2011, 07:18 PM   #78
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[ incredulous stare ]

That's all I got.
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Old 10-22-2011, 10:02 PM   #79
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Wow.
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Old 10-22-2011, 10:02 PM   #80
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Say what ye like about the Republicans: they're entertainig.
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Old 10-23-2011, 10:55 AM   #81
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Just 10 days ago, Classic forecast the imminent demise of Herman Cain's 15 minutes.

Maybe Cain's run will continue for a while,
and maybe he will become the GOP candidate,
and maybe he will even be elected President in 2012
By now enough has been said about Cain to understand him
So, until my dog does get into this fight, I plan to ignore him and his "discontinuities".

It's time to look closer at the others for the qualities they possess and profess.
Right now, Romney and Perry seem to be the two top-dogs in this fight...
Washington Post
By Philip Rucker
Published: October*22a

Mitt Romney reaches out to voters but often lacks the common touch
Quote:
Would Romney, he [a man in the crowd] wanted to know,
“finally give the people of Iowa an alternative to that?”

This was Romney’s moment to make the case that he is the substantive one,
the electable one, to tell Republican voters that Michele Bachmann and
Herman Cain and Rick Perry may be the candidates they love
but that Mitt Romney is the president they need.
And that that is why they should love him, too.

But Romney didn’t. Instead, he queued up his talking points —
that he will be back again, hopes to win here, but will campaign everywhere.
<snip>
When voters exposed themselves emotionally, Romney offered little empathy.
When they sought his support for their causes, Romney didn’t show them that he cared.
Romney was scripted when he could have been spontaneous.
He was boardroom cool when he could have been living room warm.

It’s not for lack of trying. Romney lets his hair breathe,
goes tie-less and travels with a slimmed-down entourage.
He deploys his wife, Ann, to share stories about Mitt the husband and Mitt the father.
He campaigns less as someone looking to fulfill his personal ambition than
as a turnaround specialist whose skills are needed for the nation.
“I am not in this race for me,” he says.

Brent Siegrist, a former Iowa House speaker who endorsed Romney in 2008
and plans to do so again. said, Romney still has weaknesses.
“He’s almost too perfect — too good-looking, too successful — that’s just what it feels like.
It’s almost like he’s Robert Redford in ‘The Candidate.’ ”
In the movie:
Quote:
"The Candidate", presidential candidate, Bill McKay,
travels the state, with his liberal statements eroding each day.
His support of abortion rights and gun control fade to mush,
while his stump speech is reduced to the same few clichés
and a new slogan: "For a better way: Bill McKay!"
And besides all that:
It has been reported that upon viewing the film, Dan Quayle came to the conclusion
that he was more handsome than Robert Redford, and that
he would be well equipped to win a campaign to enter the White House

I've seen the movie "The Candidate"
Robert Redford was a great actor
Mitt Romney, sir, is no Robert Redford
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Old 10-23-2011, 04:59 PM   #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lamplighter View Post
Just 10 days ago, Classic forecast the imminent demise of Herman Cain's 15 minutes.
I can still hope for a change can't I?
Perhaps the media fascination of this guy will end soon ... I don't see that happening though. See their coverage of Palin, Bachmann et all as a reference. They seem to be fixated on the extremist positions instead of the more rational ones.
(I don't wonder why)
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Old 10-23-2011, 06:47 PM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by classicman View Post
I can still hope for a change can't I?

NO! That's for democrats.
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Old 10-23-2011, 08:01 PM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by classicman View Post
I can still hope for a change can't I?
Perhaps the media fascination of this guy will end soon ... I don't see that happening though. See their coverage of Palin, Bachmann et all as a reference. They seem to be fixated on the extremist positions instead of the more rational ones.
(I don't wonder why)
I know you don't wonder why.

I believe the why is mostly two fold, and these two factors exacerbate each other in a positive feedback cycle.

1 -- MOST media is commercially based, and depends, as most corporations do, on making a profit. That profit comes from advertising mostly, and the revenues from advertising comes from advertisers who have been told and expect to have their commercials seen/heard by lots of people. What attracts those viewers/listeners? Spectacle, suspense, a good story. More excitement means more audience.

2 -- MOST presidential candidates for a party nomination know that they have to appeal to the greatest number of voters (for this restricted "election"). The voters in these several elections/caucuses/primaries are interested, motivated, focused voters. These are people who have definite ideas about what they want in a candidate. This includes "independents" for those areas that permit independents to vote. These more keenly interested, highly motivated, more intensely ideological voters have their choice among the competitors for the party nomination. They're looking for someone who is the *most* Republican, or the most (fill in the important issue here) of all the candidates. The result is you hear the candidates *competing* to be more _____ than the next one. This results in a "I'll see your position, and raise you" race to the far end of the spectrum in a race to be the most appealing. "I know you are, but I'm MORE." A race to the extreme.

This is double fucking rainbow awesome for the broadcast media, as each day is a richer harvest of more spectacle than the last one. Since the candidates know this too, they play on the media's hunger for more and more, substance be damned. Point 1 feeds on point 2 and that makes more of point 1, repeat (ugh) until the nomination.

Then it is a race to the center, because this new pool of voters is very different than the previous pools for the candidate who wins a major political party nomination. This race to the extreme then race back to the middle makes for some mental whiplash, but that is a small price to pay to get elected. Which must be done before one can govern.
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Old 10-23-2011, 08:29 PM   #85
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Quote:
They're looking for someone who is the *most* Republican,
or the most (fill in the important issue here) of all the candidates.
The result is you hear the candidates *competing* to be more _____ than the next one.
This results in a "I'll see your position, and raise you" race to the far end
of the spectrum in a race to be the most appealing.
"I know you are, but I'm MORE." A race to the extreme.
V's comment above is true. And for Perry, it is business as usual.
In Texas, the candidates traditionally vie for who
is the "most Conservative", regardless of party affiliation.
Romney doesn't have a clue how this works, so his numbers stay constant.

But the thing that is really different this time around is the parties have reversed themselves.
Usually, it's the Democrats beating up on one another in the primaries,
and then have to suddenly realign for the general election.
The Republicans usually fall right into formation with the candidate
based on who is next in line (a la Romney).
I think McCain was the exception, and look where that got them.

If the Republicans are not successful this time, the Roves, Rollins, Norquists,
and McConnolls will squash the Tea Party and their ilk for generations to come.

Last edited by Lamplighter; 10-23-2011 at 08:42 PM.
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Old 10-25-2011, 09:24 AM   #86
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Governor Rick Perry has released his tax plan which is being touted as a "flat tax"
Below is what I have extracted from a couple of articles,
mainly from today's Washington Post

Washington Post
By Perry Bacon Jr.
October*25, 6:22*AM
Perry calls for major spending and tax cuts
Quote:
Texas governor and Republican presidential candidate Rick Perry
has released an economic plan full of long-held conservative goals,
including personal accounts for Social Security, an optional flat tax,
major spending cuts and a series of tax cuts.

In almost every way, Perry, who is looking to woo tea party conservatives
who have been reluctant to back Romney,
presents policies to the right of the former Massachusetts governor.
Federal spending cap as % of GDP
Romney:20 %
Perry : 18% and Balanced Budget Amendment
Huntsman: three tax rates: 8%, 14%, and 23%
Cain: 9% on income, 9% on sales

Current special taxes
All candidates: Repeal estate tax
Romney: no taxes on interest, dividend income for less than$200K
Perry: eliminates: taxes on estates, capital gains and dividends
Cain: repeals all other taxes other than 9-9-9

Social Security
Romney: Raise retirement age
Perry: Private savings account outside
Cain: (0%)

Corporate taxes
Romney 25%
Perry 20% OR current tax system
Gingrich: 15% or current tax system
Cain: 9%

Deductions:
Romney: Current system
Perry: keeps mortgage interest and charitable donations
Huntsman eliminates all deductions
Cain: eliminates all deductions

Quote:
Democrats strongly oppose many of Perry’s ideas,
and they are unlikely to become law, even if Perry is elected president
And besides all that:
Steve Forbes previously announced his support of Perry, and
Perry's plan is based on Forbes' "flat tax" plan from previous years,
but a Forbes Magazine article today says:

Quote:
Unfortunately, this is one area where the Perry flat tax falls a bit short.
His plan gets rid of lots of special favors in the tax code,
but it would retain deductions (for those earning less than $500,000 yearly)
for charitable contributions, home mortgage interest, and state and local taxes.
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Old 10-26-2011, 08:41 PM   #87
TheMercenary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigV View Post
Holy mackeral.

I never, *ever* thought I'd see the day mercy declared he'd vote for Hillary Clinton in 2016!!!

[ faints ]
What a funny statement!
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Old 10-27-2011, 10:17 AM   #88
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The political news over the past days has been lackluster.
The media seems to be drying up on GOP tax plan proposals,
leaving Gov Rick Perry as 'foil dejour' .

With another GOP debate coming in just two weeks,
Polls are the fun and games for the news media
... in the North, Romney leads Cain
... in the South, Romney and Cain are tied
but in all the country but Texas,
it may be unanimous... Perry is at the bottom of the heap.
And maybe wants to stay there.

Christian Science Monitor
Does Rick Perry really want to be president?
Texas Gov. Rick Perry's debate performance, and other clues,
indicate to DCDecoder that Rick Perry may not be 'in it to win it.'
The Christian Science Monitor
By Liz Marlantes
October 13, 2011

Quote:
Watching Rick Perry’s debate performance Tuesday night,
Decoder (along with many observers in the press) was struck by how
itching-to-get-out-of-there uncomfortable he looked.
It was like watching someone’s half-hearted attempt to engage in polite conversation
at a dinner party he was only attending as a favor to his wife.

And almost by definition, a candidate who jumps in only after some
arm twisting by supporters - as Perry did and Christie did not -
probably doesn’t want it that bad.
Even Perry's campaign staff and are admitting problems
with Perry's performance in debates, and the media are speaking openly about it.
The Atlantic
Oct 27 2011, 9:14 AM ET

Rick Perry Ponders Staying Home for Future Debates
Quote:
In Michigan on November 9, Gov. Rick Perry is confirmed to be
on the debate stage beside his rivals for the GOP nomination.
But after that? "We are going to evaluate each debate as it comes
and take each one on its own merits," his campaign spokesman told the Wall Street Journal.
"The primaries are right around the corner and there is simply more to do than there is time to do it."

Conn Carroll recommended this strategy a couple weeks back:
"Perry has performed poorly in all four of the GOP debates in which he has participated.
Even the candidate himself seems to acknowledge that debates can only hurt his campaign.
So why show up?" he asked.

This announcement is an admission that the Texas governor doesn'teven expect he can improve over time.
Of course, it isn't actually essential that a president be a good debater,
but it is essential that he has a deep grasp of numerous issues,is a quick study,
and can use the bully pulpit to good effect.
As it happens, these are the very things at which Perry is failing miserably.
With nothing good to say, the news media is focusing
on Perry's role in State government, which also seems to be haphazard.

LA Times
October 26, 2011

Perry opposes Confederate Texas license plate proposal
Quote:
Perry said he opposed the plan to offer the Texas license plates
with the emblem, which includes the Confederate flag.

"We don't need to be scraping old wounds," Perry said.

Afterward, a spokeswoman clarified the governor's position.
"While the governor believes this is a decision for the DMV board,
he personally does not support the Confederate plate,"
spokeswoman Lucy Nashed said via email.
And besides all that:
Perry is not despairing.
He is not the only GOP candidate whose remarks need to be clarified.
Perry has a role model in Mitt Romney:

Mitt Romney Questions Obama Troop Withdrawal, Says He’d Vote for Rick Perry
Quote:
MANCHESTER, N.H., — At a campaign stop in the Granite State today,
former Mass. Governor Mitt Romney questioned whether President Barack Obama’s decision
to withdraw troops from Iraq entirely by the end of the year was “due to politics or ineptitude.”
<snip>
Having avoided mentioning any of his GOP rivals by name during brief remarks
delivered to the volunteers making calls for his campaign,
Romney was asked by a member of the press if he believes
Texas Gov. Rick Perry has the “intelligence” to be president.
“I do,” quipped Romney. “I believe every single person on the stage
in that last debate would do a better job than President Obama.
If Rick Perry were the nominee I’d be voting for him.
I, of course believe he’s qualified, as are the other people on the stage."
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Old 10-27-2011, 10:45 AM   #89
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Quote:
“due to politics or ineptitude or economics.”
Fixed it...
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Old 10-27-2011, 04:48 PM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lamplighter View Post
Perry opposes Confederate Texas license plate proposal
He may have a problem getting votes in GA.
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