The Cellar - Terrorist Use Retarded Women With Down Syndrome In Bombimg Attack At Pet Store

The Cellar (http://cellar.org/index.php)

- Politics (http://cellar.org/forumdisplay.php?f=5)

Quote:

Originally Posted by lookout123 (Post 429899)

Why is this any worse than the other bombers? Sure, there is visible evidence that the bombers aren't wired exactly right, but really, can you make a case that anyone willing to strap a bomb on themselves doesn't have some malfunction?

Thats actually not suppose to be true, hence why this situation is so unusual.

Most suicide bombers morality and thinking from 1980 on are not very different than the Japanese kamakizee pilots in WWII. They are a bunch of young nationalistic men and women who are willing to sacrifice their life for the greater good (the greater good is obviously perspective).

If you look at notes of speeches left by past suicide bombers, Hezbollah's are a great example even though I don't have any specific examples, they feel they are being forcefully occupied by a foreign nation, which has basically been true in every recent suicide bombing, and feels that the most effective way to fight this occupying country, which is also always a democracy, is suicide bombing.

There has not been a single instance recorded of a suicide bomber being forced to fulfill a mission and brainwashing is very unlikely as well since most bombers are volunteers off the street.

I can't really tell what this instance means, whether these terrorist groups had a mentally retarded woman volunteer without any forceful outside influence or whether they are not getting enough people to volunteer and are starting to prey on the weak minded now.

This book does a good job at explaining suicide terrorism:
http://www.amazon.com/Dying-Win-Stra.../dp/1400063175

Pierce, I hope you aren't out of time to edit. Pray is an unfortunate error when you meant prey.

America's, and therefore global democracy's, enemies are a remarkably scummy, base lot, aren't they?

Study: Female suicide bombers seek atonement

Quote:

Research conducted by Professor Mia Bloom of the University of Cincinnati, found that female terrorists throughout the world have chosen to do so in order to atone for sins or wrongdoings by one of their families members.

Bloom presented her findings at a Haifa convention in conjunction with the center for national security, where she said there is a connection between all incidents where a woman is involved in a suicide attack.

One was caught after committing adultery, while another's father has involved. By carrying out suicide attacks, their pasts are forgotten and the women become saints, she explained.

'Suicide increases her worth'

The study is based on interviews with women caught while attempting to execute a terror attack, as well as those who sent the bombers and their family members.

The female suicide bomber reinvents herself through the suicide, Bloom said, adding that she becomes more valuable with her death, something which also serves her family.

Quote:

...and brainwashing is very unlikely as well since most bombers are volunteers off the street.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Child_s...inian_conflict

Quote:

According to emeritus professor of psychiatry at the University of Virginia School of Medicine Vamik Volkan, "Most suicide bombers in the Middle East are chosen as teenagers, 'educated,' and then sent off to perform their duty when they are in their late teens or early to mid-twenties." Volkan finds "little difficulty in finding young men interested in becoming suicide bombers in Gaza and the West Bank. Repeated actual and expected events humiliate youngsters and interfere with their adaptive identifications with their parents because their parents are humiliated as well." Volkan gives the examples of beatings, torture, or the loss of a parent as typical humiliating events which might make a young person more susceptible to recruitment for suicide terrorism.

Once recruited, children and teenagers are encouraged to cut off contact with "real world" affairs and subjected to an intense program of memorization and repetition of the Qur'an. According to Volkan, "their readings are carefully selected. The 'teachers' also supply sacred sounding, but meaningless, phrases to be repeated over and over in chant ... These kinds of mystical sayings combined with selected verses from the Quran help to create a 'different internal world' for the 'students.'"

UT you should be ashamed of yourself. Quit trying to pop MASHman's bubble and just admit that they are a noble people who have been pushed into these extreme actions by our malicious meddling in the middle east.

From the same source:

Quote:

Anne Speckhard, adjunct associate Professor of Psychiatry, Georgetown University Medical Center and Professor of Psychology, Vesalius College, Free University of Brussels, writes:

"In the Palestinian territories, there currently exists a “cult of martyrdom.” From a very young age children are socialized into a group consciousness that honors “martyrs”, including human bombers who have given their lives for the fight against what is perceived by Palestinians to be the unjust occupation of their lands. Young children are told stories of “martyrs.” Many young people wear necklaces venerating particular “martyrs”, posters decorate the walls of towns and rock and music videos extol the virtues of bombers. Each act of suicide terrorism is also marked by a last testament and video, which are prepared ahead of time by the “martyr” who can later reach great popularity when the video is played on television. Despite the very deep and real grief of the family and friends left behind, the funerals of “martyrs” are generally accompanied with much fanfare by community and sponsoring organization. Often, the effect of this is confusing to outsiders as it can disrupt, delay and even circumvent the family’s ability to focus on its grief over the loss of a family member and it may even support the family in claiming to outsiders joy over the loss of its loved one. This “cult of martyrdom”, which has a strong underpinning in longstanding cultural roots (the honoring of martyrs), appears to have developed principally over the last decade, as the first act of suicide terrorism occurred in Israel only twelve years ago."[7]

You don't think this sort of atmosphere would produce suicide terrorists without the need of full out brainwashing? The Japanese did not to be brainwashed to fly their planes into US ships, they were raised in an environment where altruistic suicide was looked as noble, and the same environment exists and probably exceeds in Palestine.

Quote:

Witness Hamas’ claims to have thousands of self-recruited individual bombers

Quote:

In both Palestine and Chechnya, experiences of deep personal traumatization and bereavement create in some a vulnerability, which leads them to seek out the ideological message of those promoting violent and jihadist methods.

Quote:

Arin’s motivation for violence began first with the constant humiliations at checkpoints, threatening encounters with security officials on the road and in her community and finally culminates in a desire to be a bomber when her boyfriend was killed two months previous to her action. Arin is still so distressed by his death that she cannot discuss it but she states that when he was killed, “My mind was stopped. My life was stopped. My thought was everything is black.” She describes going to ask for a bomb. “I wasn’t asked. I asked to get the belt.”

http://www.uwmc.uwc.edu/alumni/news_...20_suicide.pdf

What UT quoted could very well be exactly true in some cases, I don't doubt it, but the fact still remains that these bombers have to be raised in a certain social environment to go to that level. Every quote here shows two persuasive forces, the social resistance to the occupying force and a group that wants to fight that occupation for a variety of reasons and are willing to use the social resistance to their advantage. Maybe I underestimated the amount of influence by these groups, I realize I will never always have a true view on this matter, but that second factor is still present and strong enough for me to legitimately claim that as the more powerful influence of the two. From the sources that I have read, every suicide bombing has occurred when a foreign nation with a different religion has occupied and threatened the lifestyle of the people in the occupying country. Some may be more extreme than others but that trend still remains. If you can find something different, I would like you to show me Lookout.

I was not trying to throw in some anti-imperialistic slant in my previous post but every suicide bombing I have seen has been a result of imperialism in some way or another so don't attack my intentions or my "bubble".

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urbane Guerrilla (Post 429937)

I sure don't need to add anything.

We're not bombing the opposition with retarded citizens.

No, you just have retarded citizens sending other people to bomb the opposition. :)

What sort of environment are they raised in to blow up their own people and not the perceived invaders/enemy?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aliantha (Post 430007)

No, you just have retarded citizens sending other people to bomb the opposition. :)

:lol2:

Quote:

Originally Posted by piercehawkeye45

From the sources that I have read, every suicide bombing has occurred when a foreign nation with a different religion has occupied and threatened the lifestyle of the people in the occupying country. Some may be more extreme than others but that trend still remains. If you can find something different, I would like you to show me...

You say you couldn't find a counter-example in everything you've read. But you pointed one out... in your previous paragraph.

Quote:

The Japanese did not to be brainwashed to fly their planes into US ships, they were raised in an environment where altruistic suicide was looked as noble...

The Japanese: occupied by whom?

Isn't it a fact that any soldier for any country that goes to war must be going off to that war with knowledge that they'll be dying for their country regardless of whether they do end up dying or not?

I really fail to see much difference in the two other than the method of death.

"Now I want you to remember that no bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. You won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country." Patton

Of course, Patton being a general, the "other poor dumb bastard" could be one of his own frontline troops.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Happy Monkey (Post 430054)

Of course, Patton being a general, the "other poor dumb bastard" could be one of his own frontline troops.

Are you trying to say that our generals look at their troops as nothing more than "Poor dumb bastards"?

Marc Sageman in his book "Leaderless Jihad" defines how a terrorist is created. The process has four stages that begin with 'moral outrage'. Second step is a "morality play" where an inadvertent recruit sees his people at war. (How curious - the same attitude is found among 'big dic' thinkers who automatically use same rationalization to view war as the only solution.) Stage three is when personal and global grievances merge; triggered by personal frustration such as joblessness or discrimination (and no electricity, sewage in the street, children dying from no basic services, no education, soldiers firing 50 cal weapons at everyone out of fear, no potential future, a completely incompetent government … exactly what George Jr, Rumsfeld, Cheney, Bremmer, Wolfovitz, Rice, etc created in Iraq). This is the point that others might call brainwashing.

The last stage is when a potential recruit crosses over; joins an actual terrorist cell to find a nurturing family of 'jihadists' who will prepare and equip him for his ultimate objective. Very few - hardly any - make the journey from stage three to stage four.

The trick to subverting terrorism addresses those earlier stages. President Cheney's agenda did nothing but encourage so many potential recruits to rise to stage three. Israel's actions - especially the illegal settlements of the West Bank and Gaza - did same to so many Palestinians. Even their last stupid invasion of Lebanon only made things worse.

How do we undo this mess? Addressing the reasons for stages one through three will probably take a decade just as a decade of ignorance was necessary to create the problem. In Iraq, America was so stupid that it only took a few years to drive so many to stage three.

The old biblical prophesy applies: "As thou sow so shall thou reap". It can easily take Israel a decade to weed that garden. Is Israel willing to withstand a decade of missile attacks before smarter policies finally terminate terrorism? ‘Big dic’ mentalities only believe in immediate solutions.

America has it easier. We need only leave what George Jr created and the problem starts curing itself. "If you break it, you own it”, said Colin Powel. But he was talking to someone too stupid and too wacko extremists to understand, and who under orders from Cheney.

Since so few potential recruits move on to stage four, it suggest how many are so angry as to be at stage three. Solutions to terrorism start by addressing the reasons that created stage three. It also explains why overt military action ('big dic' thinking such as blaming everything on a mythical Al Qaeda) only makes things worse.

Meanwhile, were the women retarded? It's an old political trick even used effectively by Hitler. Push the rumor. Then the least intelligent will always believe the rumor and agressively deny the truth when it arrives. There is no reason to believe these women were retarded. None expect the power of propaganda. Propagandists would also fear you learn the four stages of terrorism.