The Cellar - Illegal wire tapping of the FOX reporter

The Cellar (http://cellar.org/index.php)

- Politics (http://cellar.org/forumdisplay.php?f=5)

- - Illegal wire tapping of the FOX reporter (http://cellar.org/showthread.php?t=29054)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adak (Post 866470)

Why wouldn't I listen to an attorney, like Mark Levin for instance? He was the AG's Chief of Staff years ago, and not only is (obviously), a talk show host now, and a lawyer, but also, has been involved with Landmark Legal since last March, on some of these cases now in the news.

Because you didn't hire him and you are not paying him, therefore he has no legal or moral obligation to you. His allegiance is to his wallet, and those that insure his wallet's future.

Why not trust him? DUH, he's a political lawyer. :rolleyes:

Quote:

Originally Posted by glatt (Post 866478)

I don't think anyone is arguing with you on that point. You said the wiretap was illegal and that Holder committed perjury. You gave no cites to back up those statements. Both assertions are false.

I don't like what Holder has done, but it's not illegal to get a court order to wiretap someone, and it wasn't perjury to say that he wasn't prosecuting members of the press when he wasn't actually prosecuting members of the press.

This is the one scandal that I'm against Obama on, and you've got me defending his administration because you are making shit up. Just stick to the facts. They are bad enough.

I gave my source, and gave a link to it. You just didn't like it.

A reporter is NOT a co-conspirator, because he communicates with confidential (whistle blower) sources.

At the time I started this thread, it appeared that it was illegal, and that Holder had committed perjury.

I'm not a mind reader, and Holder certainly has not been forthcoming with the details in this matter.

This is not a court of law. My opinion was that Holder vastly overstepped his authority in this case, and that he was lying to Congress, but I had not heard his recorded previous testimony, until yesterday.

Despite their assertions to the contrary, Nixon was a crook, Clinton did have sex with Monica, Bush knew there probably was no weapon of mass destruction in Iraq, and Obama lied about Benghazi, through Susan Rice.

You may call it something different, but a very misleading statement from a high public official, should be judged a lie, because of the trust and authority, we have given these people.

I don't believe a jury would see it any differently, in a court of law.

Yes, we need to raise a fuss about this. That's the only way to keep these politicians in line. We can't wait until all the facts have been ascertained, before we start. By the time that happens it's "yesterdays news. Nothing new here to see.", and the opportunity to resist or debate the action, is lost - right along with our rights.

Quote:

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce (Post 866523)

His listeners are his boss. He's now a nationally syndicated talk show host, and if I (and others), stop listening to him, he'll be out of a job.

He's another Beck, if he doesn't keep you pissed off you lose interest, and he loses money. So the job is not to inform, but to piss off, which means doing whatever it takes, even (read especially) if he has to bend/twist the truth, connect dots that don't exist, and make shit up.

IT'S SHOW BIZ!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adak (Post 866535)

Despite their assertions to the contrary,
Nixon was a crook,
Clinton did have sex with Monica,
Bush knew there probably was no weapon of mass destruction in Iraq,
and Obama lied about Benghazi, through Susan Rice.

How short is your memory, Olly ?
Did you deliberately skip that mental giant, Ronald Regan
and Iran-Contra / Lying to Congress

Pardoned before trial
Caspar Weinberger, United States Secretary of Defense,
Duane R. Clarridge (US Republican Party)

Plead guilty / Agreed to cooperate / Pardoned by Bush
Elliott Abrams
Robert C. McFarlane,
Alan D. Fiers
Richard Secord
Albert Hakim

Found Guilty
Richard R. Miller
Oliver North
John Poindexter
Clair George
Thomas G. Clines
Carl R. Channel

Quote:

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce (Post 866540)

Not at all. He's a lot older than Beck, has had a great career in law and especially working in the Justice Department. His talk show is all about the Constitution and it's use and abuse, by either party, today. And he's not just a died in the wool Republican either. His mentor was Hubert Humphrey!

Iran Contra was wrong, but we can look back from our vantage point after all these years, and see that the Communists were a real threat in several Central and South American countries.

Their response was wrong, but their threat assessment was correct.

There were things that should never have been done: like the CIA killing President Allende in Chile.

WTH were they thinking??

What a contrast that is with today's congress and media. Reagan's law-breakers were investigated, brought up on charges, and convicted.

Obama's law-breakers are unknown, (who approved Fast and Furious, who ordered the military responders to Benghazi to "stand down", who ordered the words "attack" removed and "disturbance" inserted into the CIA's report?, who ordered the conservative 501c 4 groups to be harassed by the IRS, FBI, OSHA, and other federal agencies, etc.)

The Congress has not been able to check the power and misdeeds of the President, and the media is largely responsible for that. With elections every few years, not many politicians can afford to attack Obama, when all his cheer-leading media types will immediately cast him or her, in the worst possible light.

BTW, the "half dozen or so" IRS agents that were being investigated for targeting conservative groups, has now been expanded to include records from 88 agents.

They have been informed to secure all "related" communications from their computers. Who decides what is "related"? They do! :D

Reagan may have been impacted by Alzheimers in his second term, but 30 years after his election, what is it that we need very badly? OH! It's a missile defense shield! And before that, he was easily the best communicator we ever had in the Oval Office.

Quote:

<snip>There were things that should never have been done:
like the CIA killing President Allende in Chile. <snip>

@Adak, It's one thing to express a political position, but it takes some
sort of documentation or reference to support a statement of fact.
I did not, and still do not, know if your statement above is true or not.
Below is a link to a website report that explicitly contradicts your statement.

So, I offer you a challenge...
Provide an authoritative source that supports your statement that
the CIA killed Allende, or acknowledge that your remark is false.
... nothing in between and no diversions on to something else. OK ?

CIA.gov Home > Library > Reports > General Reports > Chile
Central Intelligence Agency
CIA Activities in Chile
Sept 18, 2000

Quote:

Summary of Sources/Methodology
This section is the details of the review of documents and interviews
with involved CIA officers in the preparation of the report

Summary of Response to Questions
1. Q. All activities of officers, covert agents, and employees
of all elements of the Intelligence Community with respect to the
assassination of President Salvador Allende in September 1973.

A. We find no information — nor did the Church Committee —
that CIA or the Intelligence Community was involved in
the death of Chilean President Salvador Allende.
He is believed to have committed suicide as the coup leaders closed in on him.

The major CIA effort against Allende came earlier in 1970 in the
failed attempt to block his election and accession to the Presidency.
Nonetheless, the US Administration’s long-standing hostility to Allende
and its past encouragement of a military coup against him were
well known among Chilean coup plotters who eventually took action on their own to oust him.
<snip>

Quote:

The “Assassination” of President Salvador Allende
In 1962 the CIA received authority to carry out covert action projects
in support of the Chilean Radical Party and the Christian Democratic Party (PDC).
These programs were designed primarily to assist the parties in attracting larger followings,
improve their organization and effectiveness, and influence their political orientation
to support US objectives in the region.

A secondary purpose of these programs was to support efforts to split the Socialist Party.
At the request of the US Ambassador in Chile, with the support of the Department of State,
in 1963 the 5412 Group approved a one-time payment to the Democratic Front.
Propaganda efforts to support public media consisted primarily of funding and guidance
to recruited assets within selected Chilean radio stations and newspapers.

In preparation for the 1964 [Chilean] elections, a political action
campaign was approved on 2 April 1964 by the 303 Committee.
The goal of the campaign was to prevent Dr.*Salvador Allende,
the leftist candidate for President, from winning.
Eduardo Frei of the Christian Democratic Party was the principal beneficiary of these efforts.

<snip>

Quote:

Early Allende Presidency
On 10 September 1973—the day before the coup that ended the Allende Government—
a Chilean military officer reported to a CIA officer that a coup was
being planned and asked for US Government assistance.
He was told that the US Government would not provide any assistance
because this was strictly an internal Chilean matter.
The Station officer also told him that his request would be forwarded to Washington.

CIA learned of the exact date of the coup shortly before it took place.
During the attack on the Presidential Palace and its immediate aftermath,
the Station’s activities were limited to providing intelligence and situation reports.

Allende’s death occurred after the President refused an offer
from the military to take him and his family out of the country.
Available evidence indicates that President Allende
committed suicide as putchist troops entered his offices.

A credible source on Allende’s death was Dr.Patricio Guijon,
a physician who served on the President’s medical staff.
Guijon was in the Presidential Palace, La Moneda, with Allende during the assault
and claimed that he witnessed Allende shoot himself with a rifle.
The Chilean National Commission on Truth and Reconciliation in 1991
also concluded that Allende took his own life.

There is no information to indicate that the CIA was involved in Allende’s death.
<snip>

Lamplighter, you've fallen for an old trick used by conspiracy wackos. They make wild unsupported claims, and while you spend all afternoon finding evidence to refute their bullshit, they steal your hubcaps.

In this case, it's OK.

Nixon was not one of my favorite presidents,
so I'd be satisfied if Adak was actually correct this one time. :rolleyes:

John Stewart did a great piece on this....