Pico you really have no idea what you are talking about and I really have no need of your respect but I have to say I spent 7 years educating and lobbying my breed club to change part of the breed standard to protect my breed from those that sought to cross breed to include a color pattern that is detrimental because my breed comes in many pigment reducing patterns. Some thought cross breeding merle dachshunds, and mini aussies with Chihuahuas would make them pretty. Not only does adding that gene rob my breed of its breed type it includes a pattern that some think of as a disease. I wrote a breed standard revision that included a serious fault to make it possible to discourage the breeding of this pattern. Dogs with this pattern and blue eyes are more likely to be deaf and have eye anomalies especially in my breed. You can read more about it here.
http://tanyastoys.com/infoM.htm

This issue divided our breed club and surely made me super bitch in the eyes of many people either because they wanted something to make them seem special or because they were apathetic. But I care about my breed and I have a thick hide and some things are more important than others greed.
I wrote the petition which had to be signed by 99 members of our club and I wrote the revision and with the help of others and our club voted and the revision is now included in the AKC standard as of Oct 2008 If you do not know how difficult it is to revise a breed standard consider that 2/3 of the membership of a club have to vote in the affirmative.
Blue eyes or a difference in the color of the iris in the two eyes, or two different colors within one iris should be considered a serious fault.
http://www.akc.org/breeds/chihuahua/
If I never do another thing in dogs I will have done more for my breed that you will ever do in your lifetime for any animal.

Nirvana...congratulations. I get that you are committed.

I know all about expenses related to showing dogs. I helped my mom for several years show her Cairns and I have really neat memories of going to the International Dog Show at McCormick Place in Chicago. Showing and breeding dogs is an expensive hobby.

I'm not begrudging you your hobby. It just rubbed me the wrong way to hear you rant against animal rights groups or the groups that want to outlaw pet ownership. They have a right to their POV. I don't think that they will ever really successfully push their agenda through, but I do respect their reasons for wanting to. I think that anything that tries to protect against the abuse of animals is a good thing.

Pilau was devastated to read this. I had to talk him out of asking UT to ban him...

Diz asked me to tell Pilau to chill.
Well, he started to, then he licked his arse and forgot what he was saying.

carly and stella want to know when's breakfast?

Pilau respects the views of Carly and Stella enormously.

It's not because of the sharp claws, is it? Coz they hardly ever use them.

:apaw: for Pilau :flower: :flower: :flower:

Pico there is a difference between those that care about the welfare of animals and animal rights extremist groups. One wants the annihilation of your rights as a pet owner/breeder/animal owner and the other works to care for animals. The difference is as vast as the ocean. So no I don't get the animal rights extremist groups POV, but then I don't always get the POV of extremists.
I never got Hitler's POV but others were convinced and look where that went...:eyebrow:

You might want to rethink your analogy: Hitler wanted to breed a master race of (iho) perfect people from perfect stock...

But not Diz, obviously?
It's because he's purebred isn't it?
You've got an issue with him because of his pure blood, right?

Reverse racist.
That's you that is.

Umm....no....it's because their views advocate food.


And cos he is black. *


[eta} * this is not a reference to his actual colour.

I call you Severus Snape.
Nyaaaaaaaaaaah!

(still loves ya really)

An extremist is an extremist why would I want to re-think the analogy? Crazy is as crazy does... Apathy and ignorance look the other way while its happening.

I would submit that an extremist might also be one who compares some laws about ethical animal breeding to Hitler's slaughter of the Jews. :eyebrow:

Because a few people with power and money convinced the ignorant that was the right way to go? I am an extremist for making the obvious comparison?
These are not laws about ethical animal breeding. They are laws designed to end the breeding and owning of ALL animals. [an extremist POV] We already have anti cruelty laws in every state they just need to be enforced. We do not need new laws we need enforcement of existing laws.

I guess that depends on your definition of "obvious comparison." I can't see that comparison having very much to do with your argument, except that it made me think of Hitler's Breed of Perfect People and your vision of perfect animals. My comparison was to point out the irony of your comparison, fwiw.

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out because I was not a Socialist.
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out because I was not a trade unionist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out because I was not a Jew.
[embellishment]"Then they came for the animal owners and I did not speak out because I was not a breeder."[/embellishment]
Then they came for me,[embellishment]and my animals[/embellishment] and there was no one left to speak for me.

Pastor Martin Niemöller

OK.

You cannot give me visions that do not exist in my mind. I don't have a vision of perfect animals because I am intelligent enough to know there is no such thing.

do me a favor - don't tell my cat that.

Brianna no worries, perfection of the soul abounds in animals :)

except for...you know, sea animals! And alligators!

Oh please. Please, Nirvana, tell me you didn't bastardise that powerful statement on fascism to make a point about the 'plight' of dog breeders.

I'm sorry, Nirvana, but I find that absurd and distasteful.

I appreciate your POV Dana I am sorry that you found my way of making a point absurd.

Tell him I'm just a monster on the internet that good doggies never get to meet. he only needs worry if he steals more snausages......

Fucker in the park today had a huge black lab thing off the leash (illegal) running way ahead of him. As the MF bounds straight for me, my dog-liking friend is trying to insert herself between me and it, the owner jogs up and calls him off about 2 feet away, then runs past and mutters "he's friendly". grrrr. that's what they always say after the MFs have mauled some child to death "he was slways such a friendly dog, wouldn't harm a fly....." :rolleyes:

As a once-co-owner of a dog rescue which dealt with the unfortunate aftermath of puppy mills and unwanted dogs, all I'm going to say about this whole mess is that I agree with the concept of creating and enforcing laws governing the existence of puppy mills. The vast majority of pet mills create poorly-bred, faulty, inbred, overpriced pets that are neither suitable as pets or as breeding stock... which is unfortunately where many of the intact puppy mill dogs end up, creating further inferior puppies in a vicious cycle. I have nothing against hobby breeders, who seek to IMPROVE the breed and who (usually) hold themselves to strict guidelines when selecting breeding stock and who (again, usually) either sell their imperfect puppies already fixed, or under a spay/neuter contract. I respect those who devote a good chunk of their lives creating beautiful animals, whether they be dogs, cats, horses, fish, or birds :)

I thought this was another thread about Octo-mom.

That's what I was thinking! :D