No Shit? :trolleyes:

...the was supposed to be :rolleyes: but I think the typo was Freudian so I'm leaving it.

lol

So basically, the Separated by a Common Language blogger says the same thing I said :P

American English is my first, and only, fluent language. I would like to think I have a regionally ambiguous dialect, although informally I do use some Texas colloquialism, slang, Spanish, and Japaneses peppered into my speech.

I think i see the Japanese sometimes, although i'm no expert. Sometimes your structures remind me of my friend's husband -who is Ameican-born Japanese. But then sometimes they remind me of my own drunk typing.... so i could just be full of the usual bull. Your vocab is great though -often makes me smile (in a good way). Vernacular was the word that made me ask here.

yebbut common language blogger is merkin so it miraculously makes sense when s/he says it....

sorry for posting this in the wrong thread. I didn't collect at first that it was a geographical difference, y'see.

I am sure I'm filled to the brim with the usual bull. Much of my sentence structures , expeshaly the less than common ones, comes from literal Spanish translations, British literature( The tragedy of Dr. Faust, John Milton, ect) , and American blank verse poetry.

But I am most influenced by the speech of those around me and the media I consume. For instances if I read a lot of poetry I will speak in verse; After I watched the movie Brick I picked up their speech patterns for about six hours.


I am glad for that.

I am curious here. Is vernacular a British idiom or an Americanism?

I blame this post one Monster

neither, it's just a damn good word :)

...but only tends to be used by language-lovers.

I must confess to being a linguaphile.

Have you tried talcum powder for that? :haha:

Sounds like a painful rash.

I prefer fettucine, but I'll take linguaphile w/o clam sauce.

Do you have to let it lingua, do you have to, do you have to, do you have to let it lingua?

My wife is reading a book called Birdman by Mo Hayder, I had to send her to this:

http://www.peevish.co.uk/slang/

I read that! Can't remember it being particularly replete with local vernacular. But I do remember it ultimately disappointed me. I don't remember why; but the fact I never read the sequal seems proof enough.

Then again (back to words) I've been caught out here many times; something I thought was universal has turned out to be British or English. I think I've only needed cultural references explained in return though - perhaps because America exports so much entertainment.

Yes that totally took me by surprise when I moved here -I was familiar with most Americanisms and just I assumed it would be a reciprocal thing. WRONG.

Only to be expected really. When America exports its cultural product to Britain it does so mainly in the original form. When we export our cultural product to America, it's watched by a few BBC America viewers then remade for an American audience; or in the case of books, rewritten with many of the Britishisms removed.

I find the removal of Britishisms in American media very strange. I'm going to chalk it up to the fact that Hollywood, and most of the world from what I have seen, thinks the average American is dumb.

Not dumb; impatient. I think the media generally anticipates that the viewer will only give a programme/book so much time to sink in before they give up on it. If a britishism is there and potentially will stand in the way of instant comprehension they consider that dangerous.

With regards TV programmes, i don't think it's just about making it 'American' and therefore easier to relate to. It's also about what the average American viewer expects as standard as compared to what the average British viewer expects as standard. Our programmes are made on much lower budgets. The American viewer is, in some ways, much more sophisticated and expects a great deal more from a programme. What they aren't expecting, or expected to do, is to do the mental maths when presented with something that is primarily representational. The American viewer expects to see on screen what a british viewer will add in their minds. Because we are used to programmes that have lower budgets. You guys have much slicker shows in many ways.

Do you think they are wrong?

I think it's a self-fulfilling prophecy. By assuming this, the media creates/reinforces those expectations and makes it less likely that people will accept such fare. It also means that American people become less practiced in the ... *thinks* cultural code shifting, that British people, by dint of necessity, are adept at. It's the price of being the dominant culture.

thanks Dana. I missed your post in there and was asking tora if he thought the average American was dumb.

Ahhh *chuckles* gotcha :P

VERY true.
Also, being such a large country, you have far less need to look outside your own borders.
First time I heard about the low percentage of Americans with passports I was shocked. I mean really viscerally shocked. It was quite a while later when I really thought about it, and the sheer size of the States, that I began to realise it wasn't due to American xenophobia or ignorance (although my reaction was due to ignorance on my part.)

Growing up on a small island just off mainland Europe with its many small countries is a very different situation to growing up on a reasonably homogenised continent.

the one that always bugged me was the changing of Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone to "Sorcerer's Stone." That never made sense to me at all, and it's kinda rude. It implies Americans are too uneducated to have heard about alchemy, but ready enough to believe in sorcerers, and I just don't buy that.

I believe that the average American can handle more intelligent entertainment than we are give on average, furthermore, I feel if we are given more multicultural allusions we would pick up more over time.

Yeah, it gave stand-ups some yucks in this country at your expense.

I'm pretty known as a Merkin-phile around these parts, because I I deplore hearing ignorant conversations about "all Americans". I dispute the idea that there is any organised anti-American feeling in this country. But ignorant people like to make "aren't foreigners funny" comments pretty much everywhere and about everything.

OH - something that made me laugh today! I had The Daily 10 on. I occasionally like to hear frothy news about people I don't recognise. In the same way I will sometime have Welsh language programmes on in the background just for the noise of the language.

Anyway, the presenter said to a guest that he was European, not gay (in response to denied gay rumours). He responded, "Actually I'm Australian." Great research there darling. No idea who he was. He and his wife have a book out called something like Little Kids, Big City but I'm simply not interested enough to look it up.

*Winces* I don't have a passport. I did have, once...a one year passport...my housemate used it to roach his joint :P

Ha! That's from a couple that appears on Real Housewives (of NYC).

I have a passport!

I use to have 2 passports.

One Blue, one Red.

I don't have a passport. It costs money, the same kind of money I don't have for a trip of any size.

Sorcerers are easier to believe than most philosophers I've heard. ;)

Hey! I may or may not - albeit the latter in some nearby possible world - resemble that remark!

No, dumb.

Sorry, luv. Wishful thinking. A walk through the ocean of average american intelligence wouldn't get your feet wet.

Nope, you and the folks you are hanging out with are above average people. Don't fall into the trap of thinking that you and the people you surround yourselves with are a representative slice of America.

intelligence isn't the problem; education is

Good point. One of my high school teachers was fond of saying:
Ignorance can be fixed, stupid is forever.

There's also a danger in taking the 'view from above'. Programme makers make assumptions about their viewers: doesn't mean they're right. It is generally in their interests to target the lowest common denominator in order to increase consumption and reduce risk.

The fact that in a totally commercial environment (which the US entertainment market is) clever programmes do get made and are popular (you just have to look at HBO to see that this is the case) suggests that there is an appetite for challenging television. In the UK we are in a fortunate position of having the gargantuan BBC dominating the entertainment landscape and ensuring that even the commercial channels have to compete against them on the grounds of quality as well as popularity.

That doesn't mean we dont have lowest common denominator programming; but it does mean that such fare cannot dominate in the same way.

That you guys can routinely produce fabulous television that breaks the mold and pushes the boundaries again and again, despite operating in a totally commercial environment is to be admired and gives the lie somewhat to the idea that the audience isn't there, or is ill-prepared to accept the challenge.

After all, only half of us are below average.;)

Half are below median.
Just saying

Less than half.

Half of me is above average. So I am only half of the half who is half above half the others. Or something.

I prefer milk.

I've always wondered what the milk fat content of Half and Half is. It's half milk, half cream. But milk can be anywhere from 0% to 4%, and cream can be anywhere from 18% to 36% depending on if you are getting a lighter table cream or a heavier whipping cream. It's a real math problem.

This chart at wikipedia answers this and more.

Half and half is 10% to 18% milk fat. Seems kind of loose to me. If you have a name for something, it should have a specific fat content. Skim milk is always 0%. Whole milk is always 4%. Why can't Half and Half always be say, 14%?

If I ran a dairy, I'd put the fat content in a big font on the label regardless of what was being produced. Butter would have a 100%, skim milk a 0%, and everything in between would be clearly labeled as well.

I thought squirrels preferred nuts

Talking of being separated by a common language, and going back to the perennial topic of US remakes of Uk shows:

I just caught a little of the US Life On Mars: specifically the ending....wtf? They had them actually go to mars??? And then having given it this ridiculously literal ending, they played out with an Elton John track...rather than Bowie's LIFE ON MARS!

Having depressed myself thoroughly seeing this I fell upon a clip of the pilot for the USA Red Dwarf...I didnt know there'd been such a beast. It is truly awful. And pointless.

Will you guys (not here on the cellar, i mean more generally) please learn to cope with non-American versions of the English language and then demand that your tv networks stop destroying great shows? In return I promise we won't remake Frasier, Friends and M*A*S*H....and whilst were at it, if you endeavour not to rewrite all out books, I solemnly swear we'll read Catcher in the Rye in it's original American.

*grins*

sorry. That was unfair. I know the whys and the wherefores and the d'ye mind if I don'ts. I do understand. But it is terribly frustrating at times.

I don't understand why it would be frustrating. You don't have to watch the American version of your favorite British whatever. Just watch the British one.

Sure, I can understand rolling your eyes or mocking, and we Americans probably even deserve it, but being frustrated is what I don't get.

Heeheee, I have no interest in any of the shows, remakes or otherwise, for me to ponder the difference in the versions.

Unless of course, Benny Hill is in one. He's so goddam funny and all. :rolleyes:

:)

Okay, but... Can I say something heretical? I've seen the British version of Red Dwarf, and I didn't think it was funny either. I'm sure the American version sucked too, I'm just saying. I also didn't like Black Adder in the slightest. [duck and cover]

Two reasons:

1: silly and illogical as it is, I feel mildly insulted that we're not seen as good enough in our own right. We love your shows and that's not quite reciprocated. ....yes I know, chip on shoulder :P

2: Some of the best things we've made won't get seen by most Americans and I think that's a shame. Like when I come on here talking about Doctor Who, or even US shows like Dexter, I want the world to see the shows I love :P


[eta] Forgive me, I'm a tv fanatic :P

Red Dwarf is a little like Marmite: you either love it or loathe it :)

You didn't like Black Adder???? Get thee to a nunnery!

I suppose it kinda depends when you saw it.
Both series were ground-breaking. I watched Blackadder I from the third episode. That was when the 'rents first got a video. I was too young to watch it as it was broadcast (21.00) Of course I've watched it countless times on video & DVD since - I even have the script book.

Same with Red Dwarf. It was the talk of the changing rooms - I thought it was a mediaeval comedy show (because of the title) and begged the 'rents to tape it. I was gutted that I'd missed so much!

They're dated now, of course. No, reallt - very dated. But those of us who watched them during a comedy drought (being FAR to young to appreciate the live "alternative comedy" explosion happening in London) know selected episodes by heart and can still laugh at them.

I've watched some "classic" SNL sketches and been as unmoved as Mount Rushmore. Given that they're acclaimed by some of my comedy heroes, I think it's less an international divide and more just time and place.

FTR - I'm the only person I know who really reveres the first series of Blackadder and fades away series by series. And I also know people who despise The League of Gentlemen. And even criticise the award winning Benidorm. But I know not everyone can have my good taste.

Surely the best Blackadder episode is the third season one where Baldrick accidentally burns Johnson's Dictionary and they decide to write a new one.

Yes, I can certainly believe that is the best Blackadder episode.

UT is lying. That is all.

For me the best episode is "Head", from the second series.
It could never read as well as it plays - you have to be able to hear Rowan Atkinson and Tim McInnerny to appreciate it in full. Aside - I have always maintained that the best comedy (ie what I like) can be listened to on the radio with little or no amendment. Frasier for example.

There are a number of scenes which delight me in this ep, but this is my favourite.
I still say, "We're not at home to Mr Cockup." But no-one gets what I mean :(

Percy is trying not to let Lady Farrow into the gaol because in fact they have already cut Lord Farrow's head off (to save time). Blackadder is about to try to impersonate Lord Farrow so that she doesn't find out.