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-   -   Pat Condell (http://cellar.org/showthread.php?t=21894)

xoxoxoBruce 01-17-2010 12:03 PM

OK, you win. Don't you have a research paper to do? :lol:

DanaC 01-17-2010 12:04 PM

*grins* ummm....yeah.

xoxoxoBruce 01-17-2010 12:16 PM

Quote:

The statement by a human rights advocate reads;
"Rights, equality and respect are for people not religions or beliefs." by Maryam Namazie
You know, that's a good thought. If "rights, equality and respect" are afforded everyone, then their religion/beliefs are their own business and none of mine.
But then again, if they want to behead me for being an infidel, it becomes my business... quickly.

DanaC 01-17-2010 12:20 PM

Only if they have the means and opportunity to do it :P

xoxoxoBruce 01-17-2010 12:30 PM

Just them wanting to, should make me vigilant that they don't get the means and opportunity.




Ah, preemptive strike... that's it, nuke 'em... and the whales too! :lol2:

classicman 01-17-2010 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redux (Post 627482)
Why is covering one's face more dangerous than the capacity to hide something under a turban?

I already answered this - It is to prevent know terrorists from keeping their identities hidden - it has NOTHING to do with concealment of a weapons.

Quote:

The first amendment . . .
This is in Europe, not the US.

Redux 01-17-2010 12:42 PM

We remain vigilant by using the legal, intel (and military -outside of the borders) tools available.

If those tools need to be extended, it should not be at the expense of personal freedoms, liberties and protections that are at the very foundation of western democracy.

Redux 01-17-2010 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by classicman (Post 627528)
I already answered this - It is to prevent know terrorists from keeping their identities hidden - it has NOTHING to do with concealment of a weapons.

If applied in a sweeping manner, you are including millions who are not know terrorist.

Quote:

This is in Europe, not the US.
We hear calls from some on the right for similar restrictions in the US.

classicman 01-17-2010 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redux (Post 627532)
If applied in a sweeping manner, you are including millions who are not know terrorist.

That's one big IF
Quote:

We hear calls from some on the right for similar restrictions in the US.
Ok lets try it this way - My new religion. lets call it bombism, says I must carry a bomb with me at all times... Should there be any restrictions upon me?

Redux 01-17-2010 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by classicman (Post 627533)
That's one big IF

How is a law that is applied to ALL women of a particular religion, not just suspected or know terrorists..a big IF?

Quote:

Ok lets try it this way - My new religion. lets call it bombism, says I must carry a bomb with me at all times... Should there be any restrictions upon me?
The legal system and ultimately, in the US, the Supreme Court, determines what constitutes a legitimate religion under the law.

TheMercenary 01-17-2010 12:59 PM

Since 9/11 the rules in this country changed and they should have. We will lose some personal freedoms for the sake of security. That is just a new fact of life. Our inability to restrict certain freedoms is what got us into much of this mess in the first place.

classicman 01-17-2010 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redux (Post 627534)
How is a law that is applied to ALL women of a particular religion, not just suspected or know terrorists..a big IF?

Dunno about European law, so I cannot say whether or not it is solely applied specifically to their religion, if it is written properly. Then it is the act of concealment not the religion.
Quote:

The legal system and ultimately, in the US, the Supreme Court, determines what constitutes a legitimate religion under the law.
So I can be discriminated against because someone else doesn't agree with or believe my religion is "legitimate"? Thanks, thats where I was headed.

Redux 01-17-2010 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by classicman (Post 627537)
Dunno about European law, so I cannot say whether or not it is solely applied specifically to their religion, if it is written properly. Then it is the act of concealment not the religion.

But it is applied specifically to one religion of which the vast majority of followers are law-abiding and are not suspected or known terrorists.

Quote:

So I can be discriminated against because someone else doesn't agree with or believe my religion is "legitimate"? Thanks, thats where I was headed.
That is a silly argument. If you want to rob or murder, the law will discriminate against you.

No...it is not "someone", it is the judiciary that interprets the law of the land unless you dont believe in the legal system.

xoxoxoBruce 01-17-2010 01:08 PM

Quote:

But it is applied specifically to one religion which the vast majority of whose followers are law-abiding.
I don't think so, I read they also prohibited carnival masks on the street.

Redux 01-17-2010 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce (Post 627540)
I don't think so, I read they also prohibited carnival masks on the street.

Well that will take all the fun out of Mardi Gras


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