At home, in Brittany, when a super tanker goes to the coast, whoever wants to lend a hand is welcome.

The only thing asked is that you wear protective gear (boots, gloves, etc...), but nothing hazmat-like. And, of course, the army is there to help.

Makes perfect sense to me. I still don't understand what the heck is taking SO LONG to have people there on the ground or to allow them to build berms to protect the coastline - especially if this is gonna continue to leak into August.

And we have an enormous advantage: a big rocky coast.

Rocks are a lot easier to clean than marshes, mangroves, etc...

We also have very powerful tides with waves that wash the rocks where we cannot gain access, little bit after little bit.

Even more reason to have had them there and ready.

However, every it happens, you can expect the usual SNAFU during the first few days since the spill comes from a boat and impacts directly on the coast.

I'm a bit surprised that it's not better organized on this event, they had quite a few days to do it while the spill was still at sea.

Of course, since BP isn't able or maybe don't want to give precise numbers it's difficult to prepare. And let's not forget about juridiction battles.

From my very limited knowledge of american organizations, I think that FEMA should be in charge but may be I'm wrong. Is that the case?

I almost forgot that it is also spanning over several states.

I haven't really heard squat about/from FEMA. I'm sure they are involved though. Seems like the Coast Guard are the ones doing most of the talking.

They don't want to waste money, we're taxed enough, already!:stickpoke

thnort

If BP is paying for it, what difference does it make?

None. In fact, the fed gov should pad the bill! :D

Then wtf is your point?

That you don't have a sense of humor.

27 Former Hill, White House Staffers Working For BP
more and more...
This could get very hairy for all concerned. Better invest in paper shredders.

More whores hit the Whore Shop of the Rotunda...

Some nice (in their way) photos of pelicans covered in a thick layer of oil, by AP Photographer Charlie Riedel

http://inapcache.boston.com/universa...1_23681845.jpg

Jesus H Christ that's sad. :mecry:

I have a hard time looking at that.

I have a hard time listening to trolls trying to turn such a horrible tragedy into political gain or personal "I told you so." Fucking assholes should be ashamed of themselves. Also whoring is this type of behavior, selling self and compassion for the greater good to seem so fucking goddam smart and right about everything, when the opposite is so obvious.

That picture needs something...

There. That's better.

That reminds me of Toxic Avenger.

That is so horrible. Worse is knowing that it is going on thousands and thousands of times all along the gulf coast. These areas are ecologically very important and are in the process of being repeatedly kicked in the nuts.

Although it is not so dramatic, what is going on under the water is probably more important. Bacteria are feasting on all that oil, using up oxygen as they do. There have been transient anaerobic dead spots in the gulf for years - largely due to run-off coming down the river - but this is going to be the big daddy of dead spots. Even after the leak has been plugged, and the oil scooped up, broken down or dispersed, it is going to take years - decades - to fully recover from this.

Roll on hydrogen cars.

Newsflash: a clean-up crew with mops was dispatched to central Chicago after over 6 liters of H2O leaked from processing facility...

Now if we get another CAT 3 storm to hit the coast we can just put it in a box and forget about it. It will not be the same for at least the next 20 years.

Are you serious?

Hydrogen safety

I think the explosions will make the news first.

I watched a hydrogen powered car race at Bonneville (on tv), it needed an escort everywhere it went to make sure it kept a safe distance from everything else - as it was considered an explosion risk.

Yeah, I wonder what a good hurricane will do to all this. One will probably come through just about the time they've capped the well and are siphoning oil onto a ship - just enough to force the ship to dump the siphon hose and flee, letting the spill resume.

The effect on the shore will be terrible - oil bloody everywhere - but possibly the turbulence might help reduce the anaerobic dead zone. Maybe. [clings to hope].

Merc, your nearest coast is facing the Atlantic, isn't it?

Jinx ... yeah, true, think of that as a self-cleaning spill ... very clean. ;)

Yes, but the Gulf Stream is 50 miles from our coast, head 2 hours South and the Gulf Stream is a few miles away. It is unlikely that we will get effected.

We are here:

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&sour...44603&t=h&z=12

Gulf stream ... could this oil end up on English beaches?

I have no idea, but I seriously doubt it.

It'd probably drive the oil several miles inland, maybe coating everything in the process.

Time to disseminate that to my enviro-friends. Fuck that is horrifying.

I would guess that a hurricane is just what is needed to reduce the concentration of oil to a survivable level. Hardly an ideal solution...

Hey, free rust-proofing!

BP has succeeded in putting on a cap device that has caught about 6,000 barrels in the past 24 hours. Unfortunately, about 19,000 barrels a day are leaking into the ocean. Its a case of too little too late. I've read that the water near the coast looks red from all the oil. Such a tragedy! :(

Possible path of oil:

But BP says nobody needs to know how many barrels are leaking ... and then said it was only 5,000 barrels per day. Why do these numbers not work? Is somebody smarter than a 2nd Grader?

Oh c'mon tw - there are plenty of people smarter than a 2nd grader.
It seems that none of them are currently employed at BP.

Edited for TW, I'm sure that's what he meant classic. Or at least thats what I've decided he meant. :p:

Perhaps you are right - after rereading it the writing style still leaves it ambiguous. <shrug>

I saw some tv news over the weekend. They were talking about gallons of oil, my bad.

The whole situation will be a nail in the Coffin of LA.

Here in France, the news channel speak of 'barrels' of oil, yet when I read news in english the amount of oil is sometimes expressed in gallons.

I know the difference between the two: 55 gallons to 1 barrel.

Can someone give me hard numbers ?

As in, how much oil? BP has been offering numbers around 5,000 barrels per day, other estimates range from 20,000 to 70,000 barrels per day.

In metric terms, this is 1.7 gigashitloads per day.

According to Wikipedia, a barrel of oil is 42 gallons or about 159 liters. Other liquids measured in barrels are 55 gallons, but oil is 42.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barrel#For_storage_of_oil

Thanks for the correction. Though I'm familiar with US/UK units from my reading, I don't use them on a regular basis.




I'll say that if BP says 5000 barrels a day, you can probably add between 25% to 75% to that amount.

Therefore, an estimation of 10 000 barrels/day seems reasonable... as long as BP isn't lying through its teeth.

As for paying the cleaning of the coast, there's no third party between BP and the goverment. It's should be easy enough to present them with the bill.

BP now claim to be capturing 10,000 bpd or more, yet they estimate that this is less than half of the leak currently flowing. Do the maths.
In their defence, the cut-and-cap move did initially increase the flow, but only 'marginally' whatever that means.
I would not rule out the possibility that BP is indeed lying through its teeth.

fixed that for ya.

I just received an e-mail from the agency for which I work, seeking suggestions for sub-surface containment, surface containment, shoreline cleanup and remediation, safety improvements, and flow stoppage of the Deepwater Horizon oil spill. These suggestions will be vetted and passed up to senior leadership for "accelerated consideration," if appropriate.

So if any one here has any real suggestions I would be glad to pass them on. Here is our chance to do more than just complain about the problem.

:cricketsmilie:

Bullshit. There's no "happy talk" coming from the Obama administration or the press.

That sounds like a good reason to use gallons (or liters) when mentioning it in the news. We're not talking about the wholesale market; we're talking about liquid dumping into the sea. Best to use a measurement that is more commonly understood. However many people know the 55 gallon number, I would guess that fewer know the special case for oil.

I don't care how many barrels BP won't be able to sell; I care how many gallons are being spewed into the sea.

If the house special is blackfish, would you order it?

Yes, I would order it. I would order it to go wash all the damn oil off itself. :lol:

I'm not racist. In fact some of my best friends are blackfish.

I just ate a Wendy's double baconator combo with french fries; a little crude oil-marinated blackfish is nothing compared to that.

What if it started as a whitefich and turned black because of the oil?

Critical to a good meal is the presentation. The chef comes out. Throws a match on the entre. Flames cascade high above the pan as the flavoring burns off. They baked this way 20 years ago in Alaska - due to a similar environment.

HLJ...you're sure getting a lot of suggestions from all these guys who usually don't have much to say about anything! :lol:

Figures.

This is where we realize that none of us know as much as we think we do.

Last night I spent about half-an-hour discussing this with a co-worker (another engineer). We came up with lots of ideas, but nothing that we could send to the top of the Department of Energy.

Does anyone else have any real suggestions?

Cover the end of the pipe with a giant hose and pump all the oil coming out of the pipe into tankers.

Heat shrink tubing. You get some fat-ass tubing and slip it over the whole mess, then you shoot hot water at it until it shrinks and seals everything up.

No? Tubing is too weak? How about bolting a second blowout preventer on top of the first one, and then closing the valves on it?

No? Methane ice will clog it up right away? Um. how about making a machine that will clamp securely onto the first blowout preventer and then will use hydraulic pistons to jam a plug right into the end of the pipe? Kind of like an old fashioned beer bottle stopper on a hinge, except with hydraulic pistons or screws on the sides to force it shut.

Basically, I don't know jack about how much pressure you are fighting and how the ice forms, but there are lots of different random ideas I could come up with.

How about a giant angioplasty balloon that you can stick into the pipe and then clamp it in place and start to inflate it with heavy mud or something?