The Cellar - Vaccination & epidemic

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- - Vaccination & epidemic (http://cellar.org/showthread.php?t=20308)

You clearly have no idea what you're talking about, but you want to tell me what the "truth" is?
Excuse me while I go think for myself, thanks.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jinx (Post 566756)

You clearly have no idea what you're talking about, but you want to tell me what the "truth" is?
Excuse me while I go think for myself, thanks.

:lol:

Bacterial vaccines:
Anthrax
Brucellosis
Cholera
Diptheria*
Hib*
Meningococcus*
Pertussis*
Plague
Pneumococcal*
Tetanus*
TB (BCG)
Typhoid
Typhus
combo vaccine DTwP/DTaP*

*= on current vaccine schedule in US

Quote:

Originally Posted by jinx (Post 566775)

I don't think that the fact that I was wrong about bacterial vaccines (which I readily acknowledged a few posts back - I don't have a problem admitting it when I've made a mistake) really invalidates the fact that many bacterial illnesses have diminished because they are easily preventable and treatable with antibiotics. If your argument against vaccines hinges on the availability of bacterial vaccines, you don't have an argument at all.

The Y. Pestis vaccine, by the way, is still experimental and not in common use. I looked it up, because I like looking things up. Nonetheless, plague is not a widespread or common infection, because it has been controlled through hygiene and is easily treatable with antibiotics.

My point is, the fact that many diseases have been controlled through means other than vaccination does not invalidate or minimize the importance of controlling other diseases through vaccination. It doesn't even make any logical sense to argue that it does.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jinx (Post 566775)

I have pretty much had them all except Brucellosis and Cholera. I will let you know if I get any central or peripheral nervous system disorders.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheMercenary (Post 566793)

I have pretty much had them all except Brucellosis and Cholera. I will let you know if I get any central or peripheral nervous system disorders.

Military?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tiki (Post 566796)

Military?

Yea. I had all the Anthrax shots before they mandated them in the rest of the military as we were off to some hairy places, but I was one of the lucky ones and never had any problem with them.

Quote:

If your argument against vaccines hinges on the availability of bacterial vaccines, you don't have an argument at all.

Argument? I just posted the a list of bacterial vaccines to clear up the misinformation you posted about them not existing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jinx (Post 566800)

Argument? I just posted the a list of bacterial vaccines to clear up the misinformation you posted about them not existing.

Sort of a red herring, don't you think? I had already admitted to being wrong about bacterial vaccines, and it doesn't have much to do with the discussion at hand, which is about whether vaccines prevent disease.

oh....I though the discussion was about who didn't click what link, and who's a lunatic idiot, and who has done all her homework and research so that she can talk down to other people and stuff.

I may have to re read this thread.

It all depends on what you want to see, and what elements you latch onto.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tiki (Post 566409)

You didn't click on the links, did you?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tiki (Post 566539)

I don't have anything further to add to this discussion because I can't intelligently discuss any topic with people who refuse to do any additional reading because they think they already know all the available material, have made up their minds, closed them, and thrown away the key.

"There is no need for me to click on the links or read the studies, or the withdrawals, because I already know everything".

I heartily recommend reading actual medical studies and not third-party interpretations of those studies wherever possible, because when you read the interpretations you're absorbing someone else's opinion, not forming your own.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tiki (Post 566341)

With the withdrawal of 10 of the 13 original supporters from the original Lancet paper that kicked off the anti-vaccination craze (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9500320) and the revelation that Andrew Wakefield falsified his results linking vaccination to autism, it would seem as if the anti-vaccination lunatics (http://www.generationrescue.org/) would back off at least a little on their dangerous allegations that vaccines harm more than they save. Instead, it seems as if they've redoubled their efforts.

In discussing the vaccination issue with people who have chosen not to vaccinate their children, I find that a typical reaction to my pro-vaccination opinion is to assume that I simply haven't read enough. Naturally, given my specific interests in the fields of biochemistry and epidemiology, the opposite is true; if anything, I've read too much. I have watched my children, worried, after each vaccination, and breathed a sigh of relief when none of the many well-documented complications arose. None of those well-documented complications happen to be long-term mental deficiency or autism, but that's not stopping the anti-vaccination ignorant from promoting their potentially disastrous propaganda, nor is it stopping the resurgence of formerly eradicated and dangerous diseases like mumps, measles, and rubella. Even tuburculosis and the horrible crippling disease of polio, formerly considered extinct, is on the rise.

Why, in this day of new and increasingly dangerous epidemics such as AIDS and SARS, are we allowing idiots to disarm our bottom-line defenses against diseases we defeated decades ago? This is sheer insanity.

I think both clodfobble and jinx have clearly demonstrated that people make the choices that they make based on the information they have or can acquire. your initial post insults and lumps all non vaccinators together under the label 'lunatics' and 'idiots'. ...and goes on to note that these non vaccinating lunatics typically do you the injustice of assuming that you're undereducated about them. And here you are doing that exact thing. as usual, you're talking out of your ass. you're an inflamatory hypocrite troll. Of course, I'm probably just picking on you because I'm mean.

but hey...you're very creative and artsy and independant....so maybe you're just ahead of your time and misunderstood?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tiki (Post 566834)

It all depends on what you want to see, and what elements you latch onto.

latch onto this

Quote:

Originally Posted by lumberjim (Post 566839)

I love how, if you can't actually refute points you disagree with, you simply resort to personal attacks, which you then gleefully drag around from thread to thread pretending you're being "friendly".

You're not especially bright, and it shows. :D

^^^^^See that, LJ? That's a personal attack, against you, a person. Not a general opinion such as "I think people who don't vaccinate are irresponsible idiots who are a threat to society". That's not a personal attack, it's a strongly-worded opinion.