Things haven't loosened up. This is how it's been for years. I don't want a leader who will 'stand up to the EU', frankly, we've had enough anti-Euro politics in the UK in recent years.

As to Europe's 'anti-free speech' laws. I fully understand why some European nations would seek to make it illegal to use nazi salutes or propogate nazi propaganda. There are still many, many people across Europe whose lives were affected by real fascism. Not the stuff you're pointing at Rk, but the real fucking deal that led to the slaughtering of millions.

Really? That wasn't what allowed them to take hold in Germany. They had the freedom to print what they wanted, about whom they wished, and they used that to prepare the ground well.

Nothing helps these groups more than the sheer complacency of people who think they wouldn't/couldn't gain power again.

Which is illegal in the US. Inciting to do harm is not speech it is assault, a clear distinction.
You would think if they hated it so much they would want to avoid becoming that above all.
Once you adopt a tactic, that is what you are.
"We hate Nazis... let's be just like them!" yeah, makes perfect sense.

You are oversimplifying a complex issue.

Yeah, I must have missed the part where we set up death camps and exterminated 6 and a half million Jews, not to mention assorted Gypsies, Mental patients, disabled children, communist party members and Trade Unionists.

Thankfully we all can look to America where freedom is enshrined in law and everybody's civil liberties are adequately protected.

The country that is more susceptible to propaganda, unquestions orders, and is blindly nationalistic will be the one that will go to fascism.

I doubt Europe will go to fascism because a big event is needed. In Germany it was the great depression, WWI, and Hitler's "war on terror" that gave him so much power and support.

What the fuck are you babbling about? Idea about what?

Well, maybe The Daily Kos, but that's just the risk you run, hey?:rolleyes:

Pay attention, Bruce, and engage forebrain before operating fingers.

Try rereading this thread and I think you just may garner a clue what I'm "babbling" about. Right now the gibbering you're doing tells me you're not using all three digits of your IQ. Is it truly your goal in life that I regard you as an idiot, revising my opinion of your brainpower... downward?? Sounds preposterous.

Anyway, two things are clear. First, I have a certain political perspective and certain ideas of what should be done, both of which I've spoken on. Second, you think these ideas are just awful, the political perspective astigmatic.

What is far less than clear is just why Bruce should hold any such idea or objection to mine. There seems no visible basis for Bruce's supposition.

God damn, you sounded just like tw. Same style, claim superiority and attack me instead of a straight answer. Pathetic.

In other words, no visible basis for your suppositions, and too lazy to get one? That's how it looks from here, Bruce. If you're a good man, you can deliver. If you're not, you'll refuse to.

My straight answer is my third paragraph.

I'm struggling to decide which is more repulsive.
1-The fact that you advocate killing any, and all, that choose a different socio-economic system for themselves... people that are no threat to you other than the failure to work to make you richer.

Or 2- Your failure to comprehend why anyone would not wish to join your Big Game Hunt. Why anyone would disagree with your desire to force your choices on the whole world and murder any who resist.

Your 'fer me or agin me' attitude is most telling.... all the fascists have had that attitude.

Again, there's libertarian democracy, and there's everything else -- never something more, always something less. The something-less is not a matter of "choosing for themselves," but is forced upon the otherwise happily democratic by coercion, the old "you bow to us and give us your money or we shoot" paradigm. There lies the true fascism, or other objectionable-ism. They're all pretty much the same thing under the skin. To accept that it was "chosen for themselves" is to believe an official opinion poll -- from a dictatorship. Hardly wise.

These are the oppressors. They are the ones to be shot instead. Funny you'd rather let them perpetrate their oppressions just so you can stay comfortable, isn't it? Destroying evil isn't murder, Bruce. You seem to be unclear on the concept of murder if that's your argument.

Destroying evil and its practitioners is a beautiful thing, Bruce, even if you haven't the eyes to see. Calling a faith in democracy, one measurable even in the blood of tyrants, "repulsive" is not the action of a wise man. It does just great for a fascist shill, though.

And wouldn't the nasties I describe be just as ready to shoot you if you didn't cooperate with them? Why, therefore, should they continue to take up space, warm the globe, and breathe up oxygen? The undemocrats are in the main a waste of carbon-14 uptake. Their shills and lackeys... well...

Funny how "give us your entire country or we shoot" is totally okay and nice and right, but "give us your money or we shoot" isn't.

Invading and taking over a sovereign nation, especially on a foundation of lies and misinformation, is never acceptable - just as unacceptable as ruling that nation undemocratically.

Being the simpleton I am the only thing that struck me was that word
Absurdam.:p

NO, there's what people choose for themselves and what you choose for them. That's all, everything else, all the fancy names, is bullshit, hype, propaganda and excuses, for you imposing your choice on everyone.