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-   -   Question for the right wingers (http://cellar.org/showthread.php?t=5893)

OnyxCougar 05-27-2004 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by marichiko

I assume its the state of Louisisana which is so generous, since there is no program like that available from the Feds.


different post:

All the government would have to do is invest about $40,000 in me, almost all of which I have already paid for in taxes myself.
You didn't pay into Louisiana fund, and now Louisianans have to pay for you to be rehabilitated if you move there. More than likely, once you are better, and able to work, you will have to move outside of Louisiana to make $50K per year. So what's in it for the Louisianans?

elSicomoro 05-27-2004 12:23 PM

The Feds give their money out as block grants to each state. Each state then decides how they want to spend their portion.

OnyxCougar 05-27-2004 12:29 PM

At the very least Mari's math is off. I understand moving to a state with better benefits, but my point remains.

marichiko 05-27-2004 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sycamore
Mari, have you actually looked at the changes being made to Section 8 on HUD's website? I wouldn't completely trust what that interest group is saying, as interest groups can be as bad as politicians when it comes to spin.
HUD naturally wants to put the best face on things, so their web site is all chirpy about how wonderful they are. I went straight to the horse's mouth and called the local program which handles HUD grants here in town and they said that they are cutting back severely on the program due to the withdrawal of funding.

To Onyx Cougar: Sycamore is right, its Federal money distributed to the states which they use as they see fit. I assume that Louisiana is going to remain a part of the US, at least for the next 20 or 30 years, and not go back to being a Confederacy, so the people of Louisiana would benefit from my share of Federal taxes even if I were to leave. And why do you assume that I would up and leave if Louisiana is really as gracious enough to help people as Lady Sid claims? I'd be pretty damn greatful and just might stay on. My family is originally from the South and I may have a long lost cousin down there somewhere in Louisiana. Magnolias, Thomas Wolfe, William Faulkner - Louisiana sounds pretty nice if Lady Sid would just give me her info source for help in 3 days.

And IS my math off? I just used rough estimates, but one thing that's happened to me is that I can't do even the simplest math anymore. If I messed up, I'd like to know.

elSicomoro 05-27-2004 12:50 PM

But it's probably not just Federal money that goes into their program...state funds probably go in too.

marichiko 05-27-2004 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sycamore
But it's probably not just Federal money that goes into their program...state funds probably go in too.
Yeah, I'm sure you're right. But if La. is willing to help me the way Lady Sid claims, I'd happily sign an agreement to stay on and work there after I'm able to get a job again and remain until I'd at least paid La. back in my share of state taxes.

wolf 05-27-2004 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by OnyxCougar


I disagree. I was pregnant and homeless in the milk and honey state of California.

I seem to remember you being neither hispanic nor illegal ... that might have been your problem.

The one-time milk and honey state of california has over time become the land of dust and tragedy because they are serving more illegals than they are their actual residents.

marichiko 05-27-2004 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by wolf


I seem to remember you being neither hispanic nor illegal ... that might have been your problem.

The one-time milk and honey state of california has over time become the land of dust and tragedy because they are serving more illegals than they are their actual residents.

I find that hard to believe. Its certainly not true in Colorado. Here only legal residents of the US are given what little help Colorado has to offer. I've spent many hours in social service waiting rooms and the majority of the people waiting in the chairs beside me were either white or African American young mothers with small children that the father had deserted, the elderly, and disabled people. I'd guess maybe a fifth of the people I saw in these places were hispanic and they were all native born or legal immigrants. I know this because on the outside of the social services office was a sign in Spanish warning that proof of citizenship or a green card would be required.

Lady Sidhe 05-27-2004 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by marichiko


Thank you for your concern. Do you know how long one has to reside in Louisiana before getting this help in 3 days? Can I just go down there and declare myself a resident the moment I cross the state line? I assume its the state of Louisisana which is so generous, since there is no program like that available from the Feds. Will Louisiana give me a place to live right away?



Yes, It's Louisiana. Actually, I'm not sure how long you have to be here. I assume you can get it as soon as you get here. You have to go to Amite, La. I don't know the exact address, but if you ask someone who works at a convenience store or gas station, I'm sure they'll be able to tell you. Or you could go to the courthouse, which is on the left a little after the railroad tracks (when you get off the interstate 55 in Amite, stay right until you go over the tracks. The courthouse is a little past that on the left), and they can tell you. All you have to do is fill out some papers, and they'll talk to you within a couple of days. If you're shown to need emergency assistance, they'll get it to you within three days.


Good luck.

Sidhe

ladysycamore 05-27-2004 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by wolf
Any uninsured/underinsured patient can apply for Medical Assistance (aka Medicaid) while hospitalized. The purpose is for the hospital to pursue a 'limited use' application to cover costs of that hospitalization. The patient can follow up with the welfare office after discharge with the possibility of receiving full benefits if the meet the requirements.

If the MA application does not get approved, the same document can be used to apply for other funding sources, including monies earmarked for this use by the county.

Lucky for me, when I got hospitalized in 2001, they assigned a social worker to me and she got the ball rolling right away to get me Medicaid. It was new to me...all my life before that I had been insured, and now I was facing this mess. I still don't like it, but what else can I do? I sure as hell can't afford commercial insurance, and when I tried to sign up with BC/BS and Aetna, it was a joke. I would not have been able to get covered for a year (those nasty pre-existing conditions), but they wanted you to still pay the premiums during that non-covered year..not!

It's amazing what you learn about the healthcare system when you get sick.

Lady Sidhe 05-27-2004 02:01 PM

I guess La. isn't such a bad place to live after all....in addition to having the best food on the planet, anyone who needs public assistance can get it. If you're pregnant, you generally don't have a problem getting WIC, and as long as you qualify (a family with an income under $17000-- for a couple with a small child--under six--can qualify). Almost every town has a free medical clinic and there's a free psych clinic in about one in every five towns.

I mean, I've been reading about California, a place with one of the highest costs of living, and the trouble people have getting assistance there....damn, man, that sucks.

Like I said, I have no problem with the people who need it getting it. That's why it's there. And the difference with Mari as opposed to freeloaders is, I assume she plans to get a job once she gets back on her feet. Therefore, she will be a contributing member of society.



Sidhe

wolf 05-27-2004 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by marichiko

I know this because on the outside of the social services office was a sign in Spanish warning that proof of citizenship or a green card would be required.

They still receive services. And that's why there is a booming business in fake green cards and ss#s

OnyxCougar 05-27-2004 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by marichiko


I find that hard to believe. Its certainly not true in Colorado. Here only legal residents of the US are given what little help Colorado has to offer. I've spent many hours in social service waiting rooms and the majority of the people waiting in the chairs beside me were either white or African American young mothers with small children that the father had deserted, the elderly, and disabled people. I'd guess maybe a fifth of the people I saw in these places were hispanic and they were all native born or legal immigrants. I know this because on the outside of the social services office was a sign in Spanish warning that proof of citizenship or a green card would be required.

Well try sitting in welfare waiting rooms with 500 + other people, over (this is rough estimate, eyeballing it) 75% of which are hispanic, 50% of which are NON-English speaking people, many with 3+ children IN TOW, pregnant with a 4th, making over $400 in food stamps and $200 + in AFDC + medical for themselves and children + WIC + Housing + automatic entry (with welfare card) into other low-income programs. Many of these people are women that claim no male is living with them, but in actuality, there are 2 or 3 working males (husbands/brothers/sons) that get under the table jobs and together bring in way more than that woman could get aid for.

And I couldn't even get food. There was NO such sign outside ANY of the six, count them 6 welfare offices I was in. And trust me, I had ALOT of time to read every sign (duplicated in Spanish).

If an illegal female manages to get across the border and has her child on US soil, it's considered American. Therefore, the mother, while still illegal, CAN and in most cases DOES get federal and state assistance.

I have to admit that it really pisses me off that illegals can get ANYTHING (education, jobs) in this country that a legal immigrant can, but the people who take the time and the money to get in cannot go on welfare. Ever. Or risk losing their immigrant Visa.

Colorado does not sound like a fair representation of the welfare system in this country. Yes, people against welfare generally bring up the abuses, but I lived in poverty in California, and I lived in poverty in Arizona and Nevada and Oregon. I've been on the Arizona welfare system, and had alot of acquaintences on it in the other states, and let me tell you from FIRST hand knowledge that many many many people on assistance LIE and CHEAT to get it. I don't know how prevalent it is, but it happens, and I think it's happening in a far greater number than most people realize.

marichiko 05-27-2004 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lady Sidhe
I guess La. isn't such a bad place to live after all....in addition to having the best food on the planet, anyone who needs public assistance can get it. If you're pregnant, you generally don't have a problem getting WIC, and as long as you qualify (a family with an income under $17000-- for a couple with a small child--under six--can qualify). Almost every town has a free medical clinic and there's a free psych clinic in about one in every five towns.

I mean, I've been reading about California, a place with one of the highest costs of living, and the trouble people have getting assistance there....damn, man, that sucks.

Like I said, I have no problem with the people who need it getting it. That's why it's there. And the difference with Mari as opposed to freeloaders is, I assume she plans to get a job once she gets back on her feet. Therefore, she will be a contributing member of society.



Sidhe

You bet I want to get back on my feet and get a job! The thought of spending the rest of my life existing on $600 a month with or without a housing voucher strikes terror into my heart. Besides, I miss working. I really do. I loved my job and I'd give anything to be able to perform well enough to do it again. Thank you for the information. I'm going to call and check it out.

And to Wolf: So you would deny help to me and thousands of other Americans just like me who WANT to get back on our feet just because of your percieved view of a very small minority who abuse the system? I'd like to see your statistics, on that by the way, as well as the source for them.

Oh yeah, Onyx Cougar: I can't really speak to the whole WIC, ADFC thing, since I've never been on welfare. Colorado does have a lower hispanic population than either California or Arizona, so, naturally I saw fewer hispanics in the waiting rooms. Its interesting that Colorado is the only state, apparently, that posts those warnings. As far as I can tell, they're pretty strict about it here. They made sure that they had copies of my social security card AND birth certificate even though I'm obviously anglo in appearance and speech. I don't doubt for a moment that abuses such as you describe occur, but why should there be such barriers for the disabled to get help because of welfare abuse? Its a whole different thing and a different programs and its dismaying to be unjustly tarred with the same brush.

OnyxCougar 05-27-2004 02:32 PM

I just thought of this too. You wanna know what else pisses me off? That there are over 10% of active military members who qualify for welfare. That is a damn shame. And they wonder why the number of volunteers is decreasing....



On a seprate but related note:

Don't forget that families of every single man and woman that dies in the service of our country gets paid a minimum of $100,000, most times $200,000.

+ the children of the deceased military member get "retired" level status benefits, including medical, commissary and BX privilidges (sp) and access to base facilities until the age of 21.

x the number of casualties in Iraq + Afghanistan + every other region where US servicepeople are stationed.

I wonder how much of that has been budgeted into the cost of the war?


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