I respectfully disagree, Flint.

All solutions involve telling people stuff. And it (abstinence) is more than a theoretical solution, it is a real, partial, solution. Just as talking to people is part of the solution. There isn't one transmission vector, and there isn't one "magic bullet" solution. All progress in the area of reducing the spread of AIDS has involved simply telling people, as a start.

We agree that being abstinent is difficult. But a conversation where abstinence is part of the discussion can easily be done. Such a conversation can easily lead to more understanding where similarly effective methods (condom use) that are much more likely to be implemented can be introduced. You don't even have to start the conversation with "Be Abstinent!" But ignoring it is being willfully blind.

What you are talking about is a common-sense approach that covers all the basics. That's not what you get when you approach the subject from a religion-crazed mindset. The same mindset that tells you "I am not going to wash my hands before I do sugery because God doesn't want me to."

Preaching abstinence to the exclusion of condom education is one example of stupid religion-based ideas that come from this hemisphere, from white people! To demonstrate that it's not just those "crazy Muslims" injecting their religious attrocities on our society. We do it to ourselves, too.

A few, if by "see" you mean "perform surgery on". Connecting that to an increased chance of infection, even the most generous interpretation doesn't come close to "infect a whole hospital".

Flint used some imprecise shorthand in his initial mention, but the common dichotomy when it comes to sex education is "abstinence only" vs comprehensive, including abstinence. Abstinence only education is what the religious folks Flint was referring to are pushing, and while the effectiveness of the abstinence message are one thing, the effectiveness on disease avoidance among the inevitable kids who do have sex is worthless.

Flint called their "shorthand" nonsense. Then he repeated it. I called him on the repetition. The only defense against ignorance of this type is education. Repeating the nonsense gives it more momentum, and Flint was doing precisely what he was complaining about. Flint, for all his flaws, is no ignorant hypocrite, and I urged him to avoid talking like one.

As for abstinence's worthless effectiveness among kids who do have sex... that makes it *exactly as effective as* any other proven remedy that is not employed. It's not the "fault" of abstinence that makes it worthless in the situation you describe. It is the fault of the people not using the remedy.

flaws?!

Inciting envy in us mortals by your godly perfection.

That, and you're a drummer.

Now, let’s rewind…

:::reedle-deedle-eedle-eedle-oop!:::

As a footnote to the point: the constraints that religion can put on the scope of a person’s thought process, leading to ridiculous behavior such as Islamic surgeons not wanting to wash their hands properly, for exclusively religious reasons; I want to point out that Islam does not hold exclusive rights to religiously-inspired stupid behavior. For example, right here in America, we have people preaching “abstinence-only” plans as a comprehensive response to the AIDS pandemic. Which is equally stupid, and refutes the idea that one religion leads to more stupid behavior than another.

Now, how many times do I have to mention religion before Bruce shows up and gives me the business?

For christs sake V, it's pretty clear what Flint was saying. What's your problem?

Maybe he has AIDS. Funny story: Sarah Silverman, on her show, is filling out the paperwork at the place where they test you for AIDS.

Nurse: Under sexual partners...you put two numbers?
Sarah: Oh, that one is for "the front"
Nurse: :::speechless::: But, they're the same number...
Sarah: Yeah, I'm kinda "OCD" like that.

Now you're just being a shit stirrer again Flint.

What, I can't tell funny stories?

For Christ's sake, I explained my "problem" in four different posts? Can't you read?

Yes I can read thankyou very much. You should know that by now without asking.

As I said, it's pretty clear what Flints point was. Why are you choosing to be so 'obtuse'?

you forgot to bold obtuse