Talk about the Marichiko ban here
 

I'm ready to take my lumps for it. But please.

AFAIC I would have banned her if she'd made any similar threat to any of you. Frankly I was more than a little alarmed at her threatening AG people that THEY would be banned. As if their behaviour was bannable - it never was. I can't say that enough.

Oh hey, the other aspect of this is - when people tell me to ban them, I certainly will. I'm getting to feel more strongly about that.

It's a game to them at that point, and they want me to ban them to make a point. What that point is, exactly, I'm not sure, but I'm happy to help them make it.

I don't know what she's been doing recently, but there's been an awful lot of bad blood between her and several Dwellars, notably UT and LJ. And some of you just egg her on...why?

I'm not here to defend her in this case. Granted, I can see getting some fun out of giving her shit for a while, but that shit's been going on for what? Over a year now? It's like trying to battle Radar or tw...what's the point? You'll be slinging shit, but accomplishing nothing.

I've been having a rather full week and wasn't able to participate in the ongoing discussion(s) involving Mari, but I do get the reasons for banning her, and am in agreement.

Her line of bullshit was getting deeper and deeper, culminating in that final screed that made my eyes bleed.

I hesitate to even comment, as I have been here for a pooftenths amount of time and have no clue about the history, but then I feel that if I want to be a long term member, I should get involved with bad as well as the good.

I will say that its been interesting watching this unfold. Its like the bad film that you arent enjoying, but you cant not watch it!

To me, a noob, it did kinda seem that there wasnt going to be a win/win solution here, as it appeared the old history was just going to be linked to continuously and thrown in everyone's face.

That said, another forum I am a member of has a Mari character and she seems to LOVE the conflict....thrives on it. I dont know Mari well enough to know this is correct, but it did seem that way :)

You are very perceptive, ducksnuts.

There are people who thrive on conflict and those who don't back down from it. I do not know enough of the dealings to say... but if she did thrive on conflict why give her more of it? Throwing more fuel on the fire which, sadly, reminds me of a different forum I no longer visit.

Your choics UT , this IS your sand box after all ,
Like LJ I beleve some of her postes are BS , ( I don't know if she is just playing games because she ain't got any thing better to do , or if she just gets off on the conflict , or deep down she beleves what she is saying ) ???
But it is a filler ,
Over all I don't object to her postes ,
I just read what I want and Ignore the rest .

Just my 2 cents .

From her last post, I would appraise the situation as ... Suicide by Undertoad !

Why? Chalk it up to a defect in affect. You did what you had to do. :ipray:

I'm lazy and stupid...could someone please direct me to the salient sequence of postings that resulted in this ban?

I never had any more problem with Mari than I ever had with Dave, TW, Radar, LJ (at times), etc, but that's me. I tend to be a fairly easy to get along with person as long as you aren't part of a faceless government entity.

boom , boom , boom
Another one bites the dust !

It's not really worth reading, but the last pig fight was here:

Marichiko smokes cigarettes
http://cellar.org/showthread.php?t=10607


The final sucide post was at the end of this:

Why am I constantly eating?
http://cellar.org/showthread.php?t=10576


Anyone that posts in large red font should immediately get the axe. UT, you are right, if someone gets so angry as to ask for banning, you gotta do it.

Ah...thanks, RS. I see what's happened, now. Interesting to note that the entire demeanor of that thread which contained the "suicide post" has also driven a couple of the new AG folks to each other's throats.

All I'm going to opine is this: Mari has a streak of drama queen, that is true. It is also true that she's had more than a little bit of being poked with sticks to see how frenzied she might get.

I'm curious as to why the various woes and tribulations that I have posted over the years are more believeable or less suspect than the things that Mari has shared with us.

How come LJ and UT don't call me out? What if I'm just more cunning and expressive than Mari, or more likeable in print?

I could be a sociopath for all The Cellar knows, fabricating bullshit for my own masturbatory entertainment. I'm not, but I could be.

So why not drag my woes out kicking and screaming into the light of reason and reality?

I thought it was weird that someone that would be so argumentatitive would make available so much information about herself. Her personal website with pics and semi-private life info. Just asking for trouble.

I don't know the history, and I'm not interested (not trying to be rude either), but I wouldn't have banned her. Message boards need wackjobs.

Call me gullible, but I think that the fact that Mari *did* throw out so much intimate information, despite the apparent inherent hypocrisies which have been pointed out, demonstrates a willingness to be *real* with us here on The Cellar.

Reality sucks for the most part...but let he/she who is without hypocrisy or denial throw the first pack of smokes.

Elspode - I agree with everything you are saying here.

She wanted to be loved. She needed to be hated. A terminal situation. By repeatedly creating situations which provoked attacks, she was able to get abuse from her attackers and love from her defenders.

Her last thread (Mari is a jerk) was the final act. She attacks herself to provoke a final outpouring of affection from her defenders, a final death knell from her attackers and depart having set the stage for armageddon between the two groups at her funeral. In a true armageddon, there are no survivors. I think that's how she wanted it. In the end, it was always about Mari and I suspect the thought that the Cellar could get along without her was both unbearable and irresistable and therefore inevitable.

We were all getting played.

You can't get played unless you present the strings for the use of someone else.

I don't feel like I've done that. Do you?

Is Mari a Drama Queen? Nah. But she could easily play one on TV. But then so could I. And I have, I think. I'd have to do an old post search to be sure.

Most of us here on The Cellar have the luxury of being squarely in the Middle Class, warmly rocked in the comfort of our mortgages, car payments and Nine to Fives. Mari has never been part of that, and she's always been pretty square about telling us so.

I've posted openly and honestly about financial troubles...so has UT (remember the divorce/house value situation?). I've talked about being a heart bypass patient who hasn't the sense to stick to a strict diabetic/coronary dietary regeime. I've talked about having my kids running amok, I've written "poetry" about existential/romantic angst...

Why am I not being stretched on the rack the same as Mari? I'm not defending her...I'm asking why the same criteria isn't being appliled to *everyone* who bares their lives in the name of support and Cellar Reality.

I figure she was being about as real as she could be. I'm not sure she was ready to acknowlege that her reality was heavily fabricated not just for our consumption but for her own as well. I'm no good at sifting for the "truth" in situations like this, so I go with my fallback anti-ban position.

I think that people who get banned do it to themselves. I've seen it many times over the years, and I know UT has seen it more than I.

I have to disagree with this one. Yeah, I know...I suck.

I just think it's funnier not to ban; for all of us, in the long run.

Excellent insight. A lot of the above posts are chock-full of insighty-goodness. I see your point, Els, and I, too, have set myself up for Drama Queen Ridicule, told too much about myself, etc. I'm trying hard not to throw stones at Mari right now but she did sort of ask for attacks all the time. Her whole 'poor-me' story is so damn suspect--she claims abject poverty on the one hand and then buys a purebred puppy on the other. She was constantly doing this sort of schizophrenic thing. One second she is starving to death in America, the next she is buying the same brand cigarette as Brangelina and Dave Chappelle. She obviously has a car and a computer AND internet service. So many things just don't add up. Personally, I never did buy her claim to disability, but, as she is so quick to point out, I'm not a doctor or federal judge so what could I possibly know? Well, I know shit when I smell it. She is a con artist but she asks us to overlook that and swallow her BS whole. Didn't Mari's PoorPitiful Me story run in her local paper resulting in huge donations pouring in for her? I recall someone saying that. AND the very simple, heavily documented fact that she claims the Axe Murderer Ex-Boyfriend of hers stole 23,000$--now, come on! Am I supposed to believe that a formerly homeless woman with a crippling disability just happened to save 23,000$ Smells like the good ol' American Charity Spirit bailed her out, doesn't it? Whatever, I say. As so many of the recent nooby Pep Squad have said, "Live and let live!" Eh. It's over-rated.

spode, you keep asking why you aren't subject to the same treatment as she?

I thought we had covered this. here are the reasons:
1. you're telling the truth
2. you're not posting in every thread about how your experience relates to said topic and spinning it in a poor me kind of a way
3. you're a very good writer, and most of your personal posts are compelling.
4. you have no history of lies, plagarism or excessive drama

is that the kind of positive affirmation you seek?

I don't recall ever taking a poke at you, Pat, but apparently you've had some issue with me. I can appreciate that, and understand it. I'm a bit rough at times, and as you are a compassionate sort, I get it that I may have offended your sensibilities. And I actually care about that, and apologize.

It occurs to me that when I roast someone, there is a bit of collateral damage done to those who see some of the 'victim' in themselves. So....i extend the same apology to all of you who I've nicked whilst flaming mari.

I have too short a memory to sustain anonymous feuds online.

$10 says she comes back in a new incarnation from a new IP after her move.

Funner not to ban, Steve, of course, I agree 100%.

Until you are the subject of personal threats. That's not fun at all. I don't play that shit.

Neither do you - your reaction is to stop posting personal information. That's your prerog, but IMO people need to be free to post whatever they like. Without thinking it's gonna come back and bite them in the ass or something.

LJ, I am most definitely *not* aligning myself against you in any way. You know your proclivities and you freely acknowledge them. I am also not seeking any free passes or otherwise looking for positive jerking off.

All I'm attempting to communicate is this: Perhaps Mari has issues, but demonizing her because her issues are *obvious*, instead of well-couched, seems to me to be a bit unfair.

I *know* from poor. I know that it is possible for a person on a limited income to be shit poor, yet be able to indulge themselves on occasion (my son buys a couple of DVD's a month and drinks Pepsi one-liters very freely, but he's on Social Security Disability and receives food stamps...shall we have him investigated?)

One of the hardest things to do in this country is to get on Social Security Disability in the first place. If Mari is on it, it isn't because she's scamming the system. She's on it because she went through a process...a very goddamn strenuous process, satisfying numerous criteria, visiting multiple physicians who evaluated her and signed off on the paperwork. *I've* put my son through this process, and it was a motherfucker. I'm guessing that you haven't had to do this for someone, let alone someone you love. It sucks.

If you're going to criticize Mari for buying premium cigs while on disability, then you need to toss a stone at my kid for his profligacy in the DVD section.

All of this is probably moot, though, as I don't think you buy the notion of her being disabled in the first place, so anything else that follows is a waste of breath.

I would only ask that you put yourself in the place of someone who *does* have a disability, in particular, a cognitive disability, which can be insidious and not altogether obvious at first blush - especially in an online situation.

And, just so I'm not seeming to be altogether biased...Mari could also shoot herself in the feet a bit less from time to time.

UT, what was the threat? I think i missed it? she dared you to ban her, but i don't see a threat. she threatened me personally once via pm, though. i'll see if i can find it.

"ban me so I won't bring up any more uncomfortable things for you", when the opener was illegal matters to start. I don't think she has anything on me and was not that uncomfortable to begin with. But I will not take that kind of threat lightly against myself or anyone else. That shit simply doesn't fly.

Y'all shoulda seen the personal anonymous threats directed against a known Cellarite here a few weeks ago. Turned me pale. Included shots of someone who was beaten up. You didn't see them because I deleted them. More fun NOT to delete them? Shyeah, I GUESS.

Mari posted photos of a beating in order to threaten someone here on The Cellar? Yow. If true, that would certainly change my point of view.

It wasn't Mari, it was someone anonymous.

That wasn't a threat. She was talking about the health effects of weed vs tobacco.

Ah...I see.

I'm going to have to just step back from this whole thing, as I'm actually having trouble being objective. I didn't really see anything from Mari that would merit such a comparison, and since I hold your judgement to be unusually just and reasonable, it is better that I stop batting this issue around.

<Stormieweather munches popcorn and follows all the links, getting to know the Cellarites>


One question, what's AG? Another site? Forum?

Yikes! Thanks for the vigilance.

AudioGalaxy, a board dedicated to file sharing, which apparently folded, which for some reason resulted in a whole bunch of refugees washing up here on the shores of The Cellar.

Now that the wheat has been pretty much sorted from the chaff, it has actually been rather a good thing (Patrick waves and smiles at our new members who were able to survive the Inquisition and stayed around to become substantive contributors).

Not to minimize the importance of the Cellar, but in the grand scheme of things, it's just a Goddamned message board. I know we can get to know people fairly well here...but it's only a sliver of a person, really. Even if we are acting as real as possible here, we don't really know each other. And I know that I've gotten into my share of flamefests...and they were pretty fucking stupid. There was really no point to them.

Anyway, let me get to my point...I think it's stupid to be a dummy on a message board. There are so many better things to do...like smoking weed. :)

Ah, then I'm with ya, UT. F her.

Have a good day all, I'm off to the Tribeca Film Festival.

Actually at that point she was talking about her original ban.

When I see people rummaging around in their handbag for the most damaging thing they have at hand, I don't wait around to see whether it's a gun.

GOOD POST SYCAMORE

We need 'How not to be dummy rules' posted.

well I need um anyway. In fact that should be my personal user tag. ' message board dummy'
or sumpin.


[edited spelling-sorry it sucks so bad]

Ok thanks! Carry on.

I (obviously) found it very frustrating to converse, debate, argue, co-exist, with Mari because she was not constrained by truth or reality. It was not a welfare* issue, or what I thought people on welfare should be buying with their money - it was Mari's posting style, her habit of fabricating whatever bullshit argument she needed to come out on top. And if someone who is not adverse to making shit up threatens to make you uncomfortable, I think concern is valid.
Elspode, I'm not sure why you're comparing your son buying dvd's to Mari's endless string of absurd claims. I think you'll just need to rest assured that if someone had an issue with you or your son, they'd let you know.

I realize this kinda shit is no fun for anyone and I apologize for my role in it.

*or any other assistance program

Might I also add, I've been the subject of a few rather obvious "phishing expeditions" recently. And so has my mom, because one or two 25-year-old personal details about me are still published with her address attached to them. So if I'm on a hair trigger for threats...

Nothing makes me want to give this up more than that. Syc's right; the "this is just a message board" aspect swings many ways. One of them is "it's just a message board so why ban people?" Another is "it's just a message board so why do it at all, if you'll be threatened for it?"

I have no idea what any of this is about, so therefore please leave me the fuck out of it.

don't read this!

As she told it, she did once have a reasonable job, a comfortable home*, and could therefore have had the savings. The homelessness and disability came later ...
I'm with Elspode and RockSteady on this - sometimes she was asking for trouble, some of her posts were insightful, some were full of shit. A while ago I was vaguely acquainted with her on another board - FWIW the story told here was consistent with and consecutive to the one told there. However, UT, it is your sandpit ...

* Perhaps I got these bits from the other board ...?

no, there was a homeless period in between.

i've said it before. there are no wheelchairs online. i dont have a problem with her getting assistance. i had a problem with her lies and grandeose (sp?) airs that she put on. the superiority based in her inferiority.

I never ever posted threatening or wierd pics. That is an absolutely outrageous accusation! I certainly won't come back here after that. I was mad that Clodfobble claimed I wasn't banned the first time around and, at the time UT, seemed to want to pretend that he hadn't banned me. That's all I meant. I know nothing about UT to get him in trouble over.

I came back on this board and I didn't post about wierd stuff, but people couldn't resist throwing shit in my face. One reason I'm on disability is that I have severe PTSD and its very easy for me to get triggered, so I make an easy mark that way.

The $23,000 was from my disability back pay. I was able to buy a used car with it, and my ex made off with a considerable portion of the rest.

The only other boards I post on frequently are my support groups. I am troubled if Limey and/or Ducksnuts are or were members of those boards and would post here about what was posted on a private recovery board. How would you feel if I did that to you? That is just wrong!

The only thing I posted about the AG people was that maybe it was time to get out the fly swatter. Fargon wanted to "eat them," and Beestie pretended to take up a collection to get rid of them. Patrick said their board died of a meth overdose. My comment was hardly that terrible and others here shared that sentiment at the beginning.

UT was the one who went after me with his "Marichiko smokes cigarettes" thread. That was simply mean spirited, and it seemed to me that since he owns the board and obviously dislikes me so much, he should have just banned me which he has done.

I can see that certain people here refuse to beleive me and you wouldn't beleive me if I posted my medical records or the Federal Judge's ruling. Why should I open up my life to further attack just for an Internet group?

The newspaper article was written by an award winning journalist who checked my story thoroughly before printing it. She called my doctors and the people involved in the story and spoke with them personally.

UT's accusation is the worst slander I have ever heard. It is my understanding that those nasty posts were traced to an ISP in France or something, at least according to the person they were directed at who was a friend on this board. I'm a techno tard. I don't know how to make my isp look like it comes from anywhere else than where I am.

Its beyond me why LJ and UT hate me so much. UT could easily have dispelled the Flippant/Atropos thing by tracing the ISP's there, as well. I have a whole slew of PM's from and to Flippant. Why would I send PM's to myself? Why would I lie about my story?

I had a good job and then I became ill and ran through my savings and had to go on disability. What's so amazing about that? I find it ironic that my refusal to lie or be anything other than myself has convinced people I'm a liar.

UT and LJ and others poked at me and poked at me until I finally lost it. Now UT has done the final nasty slur by implying that I sent threatening messages anonymously to the board. If anyone here is the liar. Its UT.

I have to congratulate the members of The Cellar on the generally small amount of pig fighting here. I'm a mod on another forum where pig fighting of the LJ/Mari variety was a daily activity for years. Now, the forum has almosted disappeared thru lack of posts. It's hard for a mod to decide what is best for the group. If you let pig fighting go on too long, the nicer people will disappear from the forum.

At least UT had the stomach to do it himself. At this other place the owner made one of the fighters a mod and went out of town for a few days, let someone else do his dirty work. The new mod was so unstable that a month later he banned himself.

The new mod was so unstable that a month later he banned himself.

That is TOOOO FUNNY !!!!

I just read marichiko's suicide post.

BAN

Her post as "Buddha" above does not dissuade me at all.

I assume you're referring to the other board we have in common? Yeah...that was nuts.

There, you see? It pointless. You can't fight the herd mentality.

Bye now.

Yes.

In that case, the Mari character was a successful high-income CFO. She and the owner were co-dependent fighters. The ambush and ban played out similarly.

Now that there are about 5 posts/day, there's no more fighting.

Congratulations on your long, hard fought victory, LJ.

fuck you bruce.

**thank you** sheesh. leave for forty days and I become a noob again. unless this is my second childhood... :eyebrow:

This all looks wrong to me. How often do we complain about how others act and yet are no better ourselves? Maybe Mari was digging up past events, but there were plenty of others doing the same. And before someone shouts 'well 'x' started it' - in such arguments that cause people to recall history, it's almost impossible to define the start.

If there was a threat from Mari to UT then in my view it was vapour and a thing of the moment. I can't see a crime, especially when the argument has reached such proportions of emotion that the words are not said for what they mean but from a frustration that forces the writer to say them - that's been happening from a number of sides in the offending thread.

Seems to me that banning is not the solution. From the way this reads to me I would find it impossible to point the finger in any one specific direction. Certainly I could not point it in Mari's based on events in the offending thread. What IS the solution? Everyone accepting (reluctantly and with some difficulty I suspect at such an emotional stage) to stop the thread and take 24 hours out to calm down would be a good move. Back this up by the threat of a ban if any party then afterwards continued to dredge on what should now be considered closed would then IMO be appropriate.

Sorry UT, but I have to say that this looks to be the wrong move IMO - it smacks of a gut reaction - the depth of emotion and long-held hard feelings evoked in the offending thread aren't solved by the remedy and deserve a better result.

(I've editted ' this thread' to 'the offending thread' - apologies for the intital error)

Blah blah blah, beyond all the discussion and spite, he's gonna ban whoever he wants and this will remain a "watch what you say" messageboard like untold thousands of others.

Lying and snark are fine reasons not to like somebody, but shitty reasons to censor them permanently. Any such acts without REAL justification (and come on, what she said wasn't threatening) just reek of an abuse of power.

The same goes for me. If I don't like it, I can leave. After this I most likely will.

There are a lot of shitheels on the internet, big surprise. But if you can't deal with them like an adult, then you're a bully with a big stick, and that doesn't fly with me.