New Camera, Dream
 

Thinking about a new camera. One w/a faster shutter speed. I don't make many photos, but when I try sometimes I get shakes.
Am looking at these.
Canon PowerShot A710 IS
PowerShot S3 IS
KODAK EasyShare P850 Zoom 5.1 Megapixel Digital Camera.
Any ideas about these?
I have an old Fuji? 2 megpix and my cards won't fit any on these. So maybe I can give it away. Thanks BB

Don't know anything specific about those cameras (dpreview.com is good), but fast shutter speed alone won't do it. I mean that'll stop the motion, but then maybe you won't have enough light. So also look at the light sensitivity (ISO) setting. Though a high sensitivity often gives "noise" so there's a tradeoff. Some cameras are now offering image stablilization. I don't know how well it works.

I have an image stabilization camera, the Panasonic Lumix. I strongly recommend it, not just for people with shaky hands, but for everyone! The Canon cameras marked "IS" have it. The Kodak doesn't, I think.

With the Panasonic, you can literally jump up and down while shooting and still get a clear image. The only way it doesn't work is with a long optical zoom.

So I can recommend adding any of the Lumix family. The one I have is the DMC-FZ7. It is not the most compact camera in the family, but does have 10x optical zoom. Not everyone really needs that kind of zoom, and I think 3-4x is a long enough zoom for practical purposes.

Toad thanks. I see 2 the DMC-FZ7K and DMC-FZ7S. I'll add them to my list.

I second everything you just said UT (and I have the same camera too!). Three basic things about digital cameras: shutter speed, aperture, and ISO. The right combination of all three of these will produce the image you want. We'll start with ISO:
ISO: the sensitivity rating of film, applied to the image sensor of digital cameras. Basically, the ISO rating shows how sensitive the camera's sensor is to light. The higher the ISO, the more sensative the senor is to the light soming in through the lens. The high the ISO however, the more noise there will be in an image. And likewise, the lower rating used the less noise there will be. This isn't noise as in how loud the camera is, this is the grain so to speak of the image. Basically, the more noise, the crappier image (with few exceptions, depending upon the kind of shot you are going for). Noise is also determined by the physical size of the image sensor. The cool camera with wow 10mp and it fits in your jeans pocket is great and all.. but cramming all the information from 10 million pixels onto a tiny sensor will result in more noise.
Shutter speed: Simple one here, how fast the cameras shutter is when actuated. A longer (bigger number) shutter speed, the more light that is allowed into the camera, and thus a brighter image. However, with slower shutter speeds needed for low light situations, you will get blurry images if you don't use a tripod.
Aperture: Basically how big the hole in the camera is that allows light onto the sensor. This also determines focusing distance. A lower aperture (2.8 is the most common lowest one), will allow more light into the camera, but will also have less of the image in focus (closer stuff will be, further stuff will not). The higher the aperture, the smaller the hole will be pretty much, but more of the image will be in focus (landscape photography for example).

Extras: Image stabilization, zoom, noise reduction
IS: two different types: in camera and in the lens. In lens IS is the best, the camera senses hand movement and makes minute immediate adjustments to the lenses in order to keep the light coming into the sensor stationary. When light hits the sensor, it basically draws the image on there. When you use a slow shutter speed, the light comes in for longer and thus the sharpness of the image is at the mercy of any movement at all of the camera.
Zoom: long zoom is great.. for outdoors. The longer you have your zoom out, the higher your lowest available aperture is. Also, it is much harder to keep the image steady when your zoom is out at all, thus making shooting in low light situations with your zoom difficult.
Noise reduction: Seems like a God-send right.. not exactly. Noise reduction will indeed eliminate the appearance of noise on your image, however it comes at a price. The more noise reduction used, the less detail you will have in your images. So cropping an image significantly becomes a problem at this point because even though there will be less grainy look to the image, you will have traded that for less detail, making crops not as sharp as the full origional image.

short conclusion: IS in the lens is great (the Panasonic models.. I dont know who else has it), but it cannot substitute for a tripod, but tripods will not be good for every situations you might find yourself in.

and this concludes the longest post i have ever made in this forum.. any questions feel free to ask, or make clarifications or whatever. I'm not a pro by any means, nor do I know everything (and dont mean to act like i do), but hopefully this will help out.

I have that Kodak, ask away if you have any questions. I could not be happier with it. With my disability I am not steady at all and it helps me out more than I thought it ever would.

Well said Bullitt. Good overview for sure.

Buster you may want to consider the Canon as it is the only one that uses OPTICAL image stabilization (using a "floating" lens connected to a gyroscope) as opposed to the electronic I/S of the other cameras, including the new Nikons (which are called also "anti-shake" which do the deal electronically). Canon has been in the optical I/S business since it's highly successful line of stabilized binoculars several years back which means that you can birdwatch or look at stars or ball games, etc., with much higher magnification without all the unsteadiness. Always go Optical I/S, although they tend to be a little more costly.

Buster, don't forget about monopods. They come in real handy for stabilizing the camera when shooting. I don't have shaky hands, but I still get better pics since I bought one.

Good one Elspode I forgot about those. Little tricks like controlling and timing your breathing, leaning your shoulder against a post, tucking your arms in, using your view finder instead of holding the camera out in front of you, and a host of other things can also help you steady your camera while shooting in those tough lighting situations.
I took some pictures at our homecoming dance tonight and the IS really helped out alot.. it is a feature that is very nice to have without a doubt. Also, I will vouch for Canon cameras heavily (they really do make quality products), however if you like the S3-IS but want a lower cost alternative (that comes with a lens hood!) check out the DMC-FZ7 that UT and I have.

A dodad I made to help solve the shake problem.

so the camera is screwed in , inside the 2 handels , How does that help ???

More to hold on to.

I definitely recommend dpreview.com for checking out camera reviews. I have 2 Canon cameras (a much coveted Powershot G6 and a Digital Rebel XT) at home and the Powershot S80 at work. I've been happy with them.

If you ever see yourself potentially wanting to play around with a camera more than just a point and shoot, you may want to go with the S3 IS. Pay no attention to digital zoom. It should not be used. The zoom capability of the lens (higher mm capabilities means more zoom) is much more important in my findings.

Am giving the PowerShot S3 IS a close look. $319.96

DPreview is great. The first thing is to decide how many megapixels you really need.
Circuit City is selling the Panasonic LZ-3 for $160. It has image stablization, but is 5MP. The Canon is 7MP, but costs twice as much. Both have stablization and 6x zoom.

Optical zoom is as important as megapixels, because when cropping long shots to enlarge the subject, you are pretty much doing what a 'digital zoom' is doing, which is sacrificing image quality by cropping and enlarging the image. So a long shot taken with a 5MP and a 6x zoom might be better than the same shot taken with an 8mp and a 3x zoom if you end up cropping.

IMO, Canon is a better name than Panasonic and I loved my A-10, but you probably don't need the 7MP unless you intend to do landscape or professional portraits, so I would buy the Panasonic and use the $150 I saved for accessories.

That being said, read the reviews. Some cheaper cameras have plastic bodies and feel flimsy.

BTW, if you might end up using the camera as a cheap digital videocamera, which I did with my A10, check the comments on audio. Apparently, some cameras do video but do not have microphones.

dpreview is a great site, also check out http://www.steves-digicams.com for more reviews, and also cnet.com, http://photography-on-the.net/forum/index.php for more help on Canon digital cameras than you'll know what to do with, and 4 of the best online digital camera stores (I dont buy anywhere else than B&H): http://www.bhphotovideo.com/, http://www.beachcamera.com, http://www.bluestripephoto.com, http://www2.butterflyphoto.com

Also a good reason to date fat women.:rolleyes:

The PowerShot S3 IS made the cut, $342.36 from Dell. Now I need help with the cards. It uses SD/Multimedia Memory Cards. So which is best, and are the new faster cards better? Steve's has a primer on cards,
http://www.steves-digicams.com/flash_memory.html But I haven't read all yet.

I'd be happy to have a digital camera that will take a picture when I want instead of when it's damn good and ready. :mad:

That would be a digital SLR, Bruce.

Buster, the reason you should buy the fastest card available is the new Canons--and the S3 should be no exception--take great .avi movies limited only by the size of the memory card. Why not just buy a large capacity card and not bother with all the (more expensive) speed? Well, the same reason you buy a high speed 7200 rpm hard disk vs. a slower one: access time. The high speed flash cards will record your movies you take with your S3 in pretty much real time with no waiting and hangups/freezes and no jumpy bullshit or dropouts later when you view them. No matter if your neighbor tells you that he's never had a problem with a slower card, I'm telling you that your Canon will perform better with a high speed card. Plus, you can take take full advantage of the Canon's ---what is it, 6 megapixels?--at full, uncompressed resolution by taking one hi-res shot after another w/o the camera hanging up--just don't try to take another shot or fiddle with the menu while the camera is taking a few seconds to save that big file or you'll end up either hanging it up or making it take 3X as long..

Last year I bought a 1G SanDisk Extreme III high speed Secure Digital (SD) card for $125 and THAT was considered a good deal. Now, you can get 2G for that price or less and a 1G for about $50. The big three you saw on Steve's link are all reliable but I can only speak for SanDisk as far as customer satisfaction.

Where to buy? Well, the Old Reliables have always been Beach Camera and Buy Dig.com. They are consistently low in price and quite often offer rebates which will save you even more. Try going to NexTag.com and putting in SanDisk SD 1G and see what pops up. Make sure that you use your product immediately upon receipt as there is a tradeoff between low price and return policy time.


HELL-oooo. Thank God!!

Now, they just came in here and told me I can go home tomorrow and I'm out of here. YES!!!!!!! So, because I'm stir-crazy and half-crazy (only half?) from being in here, I'll supply the following imaginary dialog (make sure that a moderator sees it if you don't mind):



Buster: Why thanks for trying to help me, Rock, I know that you are new and a lot of high-posters don't like newbies getting too uppity too fast but I appreciate your taking the time to give me the benefit of your experience (and several others for that matter as I have seen in your postings, maybe I'll look back over them to see how far out of line you were) and, may I ask, what the fuck is this all about?

Rock: Well, Buster, I'll attempt to tell you: If you don't want to go to hospitals, stay off of motorcycles (btw, tell that guy Zip that I think he's pretty cool) because I've been laid up here for the better part of a month and have, by necessity avoided some of the boredom by constant surfing the net because, let's be honest, TV sucks (and especially in 3rd world countries). I just discovered the Cellar a few days ago, but was impressed by the (apparent) I.Q. level and especially the sense of humor displayed by the "arm on groin" posters. So, regardless of protocol, I just jumped in and started posting although I don't think I've been too disrespectful at that considering my size and ADD personality--(I've said this before: stay away from steroids, kids, that xtra 50-75 lbs on your bench press ain't worth it).

Buster: With all due respect, man, I still haven't a clue as to what you are talking about, has someone here insulted you or something?

Rock: Oh, no no, it's not that. I'm not sure what I'm saying, actually. Like I said, I've had a lot of time on my hands and have started posting in a LOT of forums just out of boredom. I'm 60 years old, should have been dead many times over and have seen and lived through things that would fry most people's hair out by the roots--yours too, I might venture. I have done a lot of different things in my travels a few times around this old world and have some lay expertise in a lot of different things and I WILL say that the nicest and politest (they always say "welcome to ___ forum, Rock" and "thanks") are the so-called "geeks", the hardcore hobbyist forums, like R/C planes and Telescope nuts, Chess types (taught myself to play in here)...all of these people freely share knowledge and expertise and, unlike jerks like me, still are self-effacing and, well, umm...shit, I forgot what I was gonna say because that cute little night nurse came in to say goodbye. I suppose when I get out of here tomorrow, that short-term memory thing will get even worse, if you ah..get my drift.

Buster: Ok, now I'M getting bored, but just let me say for myself and perhaps for anyone else in here that if someone has done something to ...

Rock (interrupting): No, no, really, I shouldn't have mentioned anything at all. I'm sure I'm out of line anyway (I'm used to being in that situation) so, tomorrow, I'm outta here. My girlfriend's picking me up--I hope she's not still mad at me--and my bike will be ready and I'll catch y'all in another life 'coz ("because") sitting in front of a 'puter monitor for hours a day isn't my idea of what works for me--I'm NOT putting it down, it just doesn't hold my interest if I'm ambulatory-- but I gotta say, I was NOT bored being in the Cellar for these few days--wish I'd of found this when I first woke up in here, then again maybe you'd have run me off before now. Good luck to all. This has been my third and worst accident this year, so I'm sure the Law of Averages has caught up with me, so I'm gonna get drunk tomorrow night raising glass after glass to Freddy Fender--tell ole Griff thanks for the bad news--and saddle up and head on out.

Buster: OK, Rock, thanks for um..expressing yourself in here. Good luck to you, too. <sotto voice>(Jesus, what a maniac!)

Rock: Adios Muchachos (y Muchachas)

Ok Rock , now you have to fill us in ,
motor cycles , third world countrys , hospitols , girl friends ,,
We NEED PICS and storys !!!
You started this , not us !!!!!

That would be $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$, Steve.
I know, and I have all these Nikon lenses already. :rolleyes:

Ok i was woundering about this ,
Bruce has lenses from a film camera ( Right Bruce ??)
If he was to get a good Digi SLR body would the lenses be compatible ??
And if not ,, why ??

Yes, they would be. If Bruce bought any of the Nikon DSLR bodies all his lenses should work. The reasons are obvious. (It lets the manufacturers reuse parts of their existing design, it gives them a pile of lenses they can sell new customers right out of the gate, and it gives existing customers a disincentive to buy a camera from another company.)

Got 2 Corsair 512MB 60X Secure Digital Memory Card and 1 SanDisk Ultra II 1GB SD Plus USB Flash Media. Thanks for help and other usefull info!
I'm with Zip, Come on Rock. Fill us in.

Also, my Kodak has a $20 adapter that lets you use film camera lenses with a 55mm base.
But, it seems you have moved on to other models.
I have a couple of 2G cards. One cool thing is that it comes equipped with a flash shoe, standard.

Thanks Krage. My sis got all my film camera lenses years ago. Hope this is last money I spend on cameras.

AAAAaaaaahhhhhhaaaahaaaaHHHAAAAAhhhaaaaahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!!!!

That's a toy, Steve....check out the first two posts here; http://cellar.org/showthread.php?t=3511&page=163 :D

I have one I made to use w/camcorder for "Shine" I ordered one yesterday, a Trailblazer Monopod.

That was first made to hold an unbrella for shade while welding. It worked out well setting on milk carton in back of truck for parade(ies?)

Actually, it depends on how old the lenses are. For most people, the old lenses will work fine. But if they are manual focus lenses, they won't work perfectly with the DSLR bodies. If they are more modern autofocus, they will work just fine. There are charts that show compatibility. The big problem is the DSLR bodies can't change the aperature inside the lenses to get the exposure right, even if you are willing to focus manually. That leaves you having to carry around an external light meter and doing the math to figure out what aperature to use with the shutter speed you set.

I've got a beautiful old Nikon FE (circa 1983) and a big set of manual focus lenses. When the Nikon D50 came out, I was all excited until I read the lens compatibility charts.

Don't forget about cropped image sensors in most of the consumer-end dSLRs.

$4800:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:
I just broke down and bought a Canon 540 to replace my missing Canon A10, as well as upgrade from 3.1 to 6 MP in a compact camera.

Pluses: Low price (under $200). I bought a tabletop tripod and camera case to put myself over $199 and get %10 back as a gift card. Smaller in size than my A10, but with familiar shape and buttons. This will mean a smaller learning curve for Marci and me.

Minuses: For about the same price I could have gotten a Panasonic Lumix LZ5 with anti-shake and a 6x zoom.

What decided me against the Lumix were the CNet ratings, with the A540 tagged at 7.6 and the Lumix 6.6. I was concerned about low light performance and I was counting on the Lumix anti-shake, but the review specifically downgraded the Lumix low light performance. I'm still not sure if I wrote the Lumix off too soon, but so far I like the new Canon as much as I liked the old one. Short of finding and borrowing an LZ5 from someone, there really is no way to try one out to make the comparison on my own.

Mine are all auto lenses from the 90's. :D

CNET is not exactly the best reviewer of cameras towards the upper range.. You should stick to DPreview or Steve's DigiCams for the best information and most thorough testing and comparison.

Well, DPReview user's gave the Lumix a slightly higher rating, but with only 4 samples compared to 16 samples for the Canon. There was no expert review.

Steve's Digicams gave the Canon a good review, but the Lumix a 'qualified good' review mentioning image quality. It also pointed out that the Lumix had no speaker for audio playback, something that I use when shooting short videos.

I really would have liked the 6x and image stabilization, but in the end I went with something I knew I would be happy with rather than taking a chance.

OK, this is funny. Marci just found my Canon A10 today. It's been missing for over two months and she finds it 4 days after I bought a replacement.

I am not taking back the Canon A540, unless it's to replace it for the Panasonic.

OK, this is funny. Marci just found my Canon A10 today.

Funny as in HA HA funny ??!!??
Do I make you laugh ???!!?? ;)

Hey Undertoad, I'm thinking about taking the plunge and getting a new camera. My trusty old Coolpix 950 is showing its age. My knowledge of digital cameras is about 7-8 years out of date, so maybe this is a dumb question, but how's the battery management of the Lumix? I'm used to a having a couple of sets of rechargable AAs ready to go when they are eaten by the hungry Coolpix. What's the setup with the Lumix? Do you carry extras with you, or do you have to find a place to plug the camera in? In everyday use, are batteries ever a problem?

I've gotten used to things like 3-4 seconds of shutter lag and batteries being eaten like candy, so I don't really know what is standard in cameras today. I know I want a camera with about 5-6 megapixels, image stabilization, great quality images, less than a second of shutter lag, and a nice zoom lens. Good close-ups would be nice, and my pipe dream would be to have a swivel body like the Coolpix. Nobody makes swivel bodies any more, which is crazy, since they just make sense.

The Lumix comes with its own custom Li-ion battery pack which is slightly more compact than 2 AAs. That is a shame, but the camera itself is less power-hungry than the 950, which I also had. This seems to take twice as much usage to run out of juice on one battery session. The 950 just ate batteries and ate and ate... especially on constant auto-focus.

My wife just had a birthday on Sunday. She didn't say she wanted a camera, but I thought it would be good for her to have a little one she could keep in her purse to pull out and take snapshots of the kids etc. I looked around for a while and finally settled on the Fujifilm Finepix F20. I'm really impressed with it.

It's a pretty standard point and shoot with a 3x zoom and 6MP. It's almost exactly the same size as a deck of cards, so it's pretty small. The two things that make it really stand out is that it's about half the price of a similar Nikon or Canon, and it has a better sensor. It was only $148 from ButterflyPhoto through Amazon. The sensor is nice. Fujifilm has figured out how to crank up the sensitivity of its sensors (ISO 2000) without having a ton of noise ruin the shot. This allows you to take pictures inside in relatively low light situations without a flash, and there is very little noise at all. This camera is not reviewed at DPReview.com, but its bigger brother, the F30 is. They share the same sensor, so a review for the F30 applies to the F20 in almost all ways. (Only major difference is the higher available shutter speed of the F30 and the software cranks the sensitivity of the F30 up even more.)

Anyway, if you are looking for a simple to use point and shoot camera that fits in your pocket or purse and delivers a great image for a low price, you should look seriously at this one.

Only complaint is that it uses a different kind of memory card, the XD card, so if you have a bunch of SD cards and card readers floating around, you can't use them.