College
 

My dad prettymuch shoved a copy of US News's list of top colleges down my throat this weekend, so, I now present for your collective consideration, a list of some of the schools I'm thinking about at one level or another. If I left off any you think I should consider, or think any of these are particularly bad choices... say so.
But no southern colleges. Not even Austin. I can't live in the south, I just can't do it.

California - Berkeley
UMich - Ann Arbor
California - Santa Barbara
UMD
UC Santa Cruz
University of Vermont
Middlebury
Smith College
Bryn Mawr
St. Mary's (MD)

Smith and Bryn Mawr are incredibly bad choices. Well, depending on what you had in mind. They're women's colleges.

Edit. I don't know what people are thinking, trying to go to one of the "highest ranked" places. Your rankings are going to be different from theirs. I started out trying to go to the most competitive places but wound up in a slightly smaller, slightly less competitive place... and it fit me like a glove, because what I really wanted to do was try a little of everything, which was very possible at a tiny college. Otherwise, I wouldn't have become the manager of the radio station, worked on the literary magazine, did layout work for the newspaper... as a Comp Sci major. At a bigger school that stuff would be reserved for Communications/Lit/English majors. It was perfect for me to be at a small place where everybody got to know me... at a big school I would have gotten lost. On this list, St Mary's would be the closest to that experience, but there are about a hundred St Mary's sprinkled throughout the Northeast. You can't throw a rock around here and not hit a quaint little liberal arts college. And they are getting to be more of a bargain than they used to because everybody wants to go to a massive university for some reason.

What do you mean, womens' colleges?
EDIT: shit you're right, i didnt even notice that, hahahahaha.
Fucking college websites are just about the worst fuckin' sites ive ever seen i swear.

And i just used the list as reference for seein' where I may wanna go, I didn't really pay any attention to the actual rating. I think I really do want more like what you just described, but I dont even know how to go about finding one of those. Besides, I'm still what, two years off from having to make a decision?

Yeah man you really need to go on a college visit road trip or something. No articles or websites compare to physically visiting the campus and getting a feel for what it would be like to be a student there. Example: in high school I wanted so dang badly to go to Miami (of Ohio), but when I went to visit my brother there for a weekend I was completely turned off. It is the preppiest school I have ever seen and I would have completely not felt at home there. I know what you're thinking, yeah but the whole school isn't like that, there's going to be people I like hanging out with and become friends with basically anywhere. Which is true, but it's a fact that each school has a certain atmosphere about it and it's awesome when you find the one that fits you best. I've had friends transfer from some pretty prestigious schools just because they didn't like "the feel of it".

I see someone already beat me to the Bryn Mawr thing. You could go to Haverford, which I think shares some classes with Bryn Mawr and just maybe, if you were cool enough, a group of the mildly less militant lesbians would vote you in as an honorary vagina-bearer. Happened to one of my male friends who was in the social work program there. But he did take his wife's name when they married ...

Well that list is useless, no offense to your dad. "Let's see now... should I go to Middlebury... or Berkeley???" Get some idea of what you're looking for. (A large public university? Small liberal arts? Pre-professional? etc.) In general I would not bother with the US News rankings. For the most part what you learn from it is that famous schools are famous. Harvard is Harvard... does anybody (except for some overexcited alumni) care whether it's ranked #1 or #3 or #2 this year?

I agree with Tony. Don't kill yourself trying to get into the most famous school you can. Actually look at the faculty... meet some of them... how to find them? Ask around. I personally would recommend either my or Mrs. Dallas' alma maters, UNC-Greensboro and Gettysburg college respectively. My advice is to study the course catalog carefully and see who teaches courses. Strongly prefer places where the faculty actually teach undergraduate courses, instead of leaving it for the grad students.

You may not have as much time as you think. You probably need to have all your application stuff in by new year's during your senior year.

EDIT:
Haverford students have full reciprocity to cross-register for any course at Bryn Mawr, or even live at Bryn Mawr, and vice versa. They can also cross-register at Swarthmore. Regular bus service runs between the three campuses. It's a very nice place, but you're definitely paying for the name.

EDIT again:
And read this.

I think I'd be down with that?

Yeah, I know, I know - the list as ranking is BS, I don't care what a school's ranked... but it's a list of decent schools, at least, and it gives me some idea of schools to look at, as a starting point, at least.


Just for reference, I'm looking at a bunch of different majors... from journalism to government/political science to psych to... I really have no idea. But I'm mostly looking into Gov or Journalism, at this point, I think, maybe.

I agree with UT about the bigger/smaller colleges. I went to Berkeley as an undergrad, without any support system at all (my parents were 2000 miles away). Big mistake. BIG mistake.

Start with this question ... what do you want to go to college for, then pick a school that does that.

Oh, and the school should be good to okay at other things too, because you'll probably change your major in there somewhere.

Or you can just choose off the Playboy list of top 5 party schools.

I worked with someone who did that. I was recently very pleased to see that the school is keeping up it's rep, as Rider College had some kid die of alcohol poisoning at a frat party yet again.

I would be glad to be a vagina-bearer. I would carry it on my dick.*








*In this case, the word "dick" was used to maximize comedic value. Other words such as "penis", "cock", and "wang" were evaluated but none were found to have the combination of shock and comic awe of a stronger and more vulgar term. Also, there is a "k" sound in it, which makes it funnier. The "k" sound actually occurs twice in "cock", making it one of the funniest words available to the English language, but its former use here makes it a distraction from the humor of the line.

How about a vagina-barer?

I know, I know. You said not even Austin. But I can't help myself.

You should really, really check out the Plan II program at the University of Texas. (Yes, it's the program I graduated from, that makes me informed about it, not biased. :)) If you come visit the school, I will show you around. I am serious. You would love it here.

Did you know that Austin has the second-highest gay population after San Francisco? Did you know that the 78704 zip code has the highest concentration of professional musicians of anywhere in the country? Austin isn't part of the south, man. It's just not.

Yeah, agreed with everyone else. Were you just trying to show off when you listed those bs schools? No one here is going to be impressed with that. Plus you listed women's schools...shows your researching skills, dude. Like everyone said, visit schools, some blue college yellow page book just doesn't do it. College is the best time of your life, don't base it off numbers. It's the feel.

:headshake What about ND??? :headshake

Speaking as one of the few cellar members currently in college, don't throw away any sources of information. Just saying that rankings aren't total crap, they're guidelines to give you a starting point. The biggest things you want from a school are dedicated profs who have personal experience and high achievement in the subjects they teach, and connections to professional organizations and programs that you will want to use during your major. Most of the time, higher ranked schools have more stuff available to students, but do your research and look up what criteria the list is based on.

My personal advice? Avoid tiny schools that keep on harping about personalized attention. A tiny faculty-to-student ratio is really only useful for your first semester freshman year. If you're a good student who's motivated, you won't have a problem developing a relationship with your profs, they're on the lookout for students like that.
Small schools can hurt you in other ways as well. Here at U Pitt, the professors doing research generally laugh at the idea of taking students from tiny colleges because they find them too spoon fed and attention seeking. It isn't always appropriate to expect a personal relationship with your bosses. A big school will get your used to working on your own with a realistic level of guidance, not constant hand holding, that doesn't work in real life.

(Also, our medical school, which is #1 for transplants, really doesn't even consider applicants from the 'hand-holder U's)

Lots of activities might be fun, but after the four years people are going to want experience in YOUR area of focus. Being all over the board and never doing prolonged work in one area (multiple years) is taken to mean you can't focus yourself.

This from the guy home alone with the haunted basement and dirty laundry on a holiday weekend?

:lol:

The course is the most important thing -there are likely to be several places with teaching that will suit you, then you pick between those based on the lesser factors. You can go to the biggest party school of all, but if you're failing miserably because the course is not right for you, you won't be having any fun. Oh and even if you have a shitload of fun, college is just the best time of your life SO FAR. If you believe it's all downhill from there, you might as well pack it in and get a McJob.

Just look the old man straight in the eye and say, "College? I'm a fucking Rock Star."

I've tried that one already. Seriously.

OK, that explains, "My dad pretty much shoved a copy of US News's list of top colleges down my throat this weekend,...".

Don't rule out the South so quick, dude. Cities like Austin and Atlanta are really progressive places these days. In Atlanta I found the people friendlier and the culture extremely laid back, which sounds like it might be your thing. And if you wanna get into art or music, you may find these two cities in particular very accommodating.

And a note on majoring in journalism .... it's not necessary to "study" journalism. Take the intro classes and then join the newspaper or the radio station - you'll learn more than you need to know. College media is often more professional than you'd imagine.

My mom is a journalism major and a psych minor, and she somewhat recommends doing a journalism major. She also kinda wants me to go to like, law school... thats pretty out too.

And I just know I could never live in the south. Going down that way to visit family is excruciating enough. Austin would probably be a cool city, but as soon as you get outside Austin... you're back in hicksville. I can't stand the south - sorry, southern folk.
You're allowed to hate on the south if you're a southern boy, anyway.

as soon as you get outside Austin... you're back in hicksville.

There goes the rust belt: NJ DE PA OH MI IN IL WI and certain parts of NY are hick incorporated outside of the suburban areas. NASCAR has advanced as far north as NH.

Austin and surrounding areas is a very cool place.

I just took my vacation on Canyon Lake, went to Schlitterbahn in New Braunfels, and visited historic Gruene.

Well who needs to ever leave Austin? I mean, as soon as you get outside your city you're in the jungle, right?

You seem to be about my age (I'm a junior in high school). And I live in South Carolina...what you got against us southerners? Sure we've got a few senile old racists who put up their dukes at the sound of the word "Iraqi" but other than that I'd like to think we're kinda nice. Kinda. I'd like to think.

I'm actually thinking University of South Carolina for several reasons, and here are a few: 1) I want to be a pilot, so I figure I'll take some aeronautical engineering, physics, math, and communication...all of which are available with at USC with a relatively good reputation (Clemson's engineering program is a little better but neither are spectacular). 2) I'm very familiar with the campus because my older sister attended and graduated (Cum Laude with honors, in fact), so we made several trips to visit/move her stuff/family events/etc. 3) It's an hour and a half away, so the 'rents won't be all sad and I can make trips home without much difficulty. 4) I'm familiar with the Southern culture and crap; I won't be too much of an outcast, plus I'll get in-state tuition, more scholarship opportunities, etc.

I'm not real sure why I just spilled my life's goals and plans out on a thread that's not even mine, but I did. Good luck on finding the right place.

Tolerant guy, isn't he? :headshake

Eh, you got years ahead of you. Pick something you like and show your parents a well-laid out plan - they'll get off your case if you produce some output.

Ditto UT - like 90% of the northeast is just as whitewashed - if not worse - than below the mason-dixon line. I felt just as much out of place driving through parts of NJ as I did taking road trips to Mississippi and Alabama.

You could cope culturally with about anything in California, then.

That's pretty much true outside all major metro areas. Even in California.

Learn to appreciate a variety of people. That's one of the things college is about.

I do appreciate a variety of people. Don't get my wrong... for all my bluster, I love the south. The people are nice, generally, and boy do southerners know how to eat... but I just can't stand them, politically. And aiya, if I can't talk politics, I just can't live there.

That's the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Living at a certain latitude does not define your political beliefs any more than the color of your skin defines your intelligence.

I suppose it makes the world seem more understandable, less daunting, when we force widely diverse data sets into rigid catagories; but never fool yourself into believing that you are describing reality.

Let's test your theory: I live in Texas. What are my political beliefs? Unless you can state the correct answer with 100% certainty, then your theory is total shit.

When a theory is total shit, you abandon it. Otherwise, you're a fool. Your choice.

Wait, I just realized what your response should be:

dude... Reed

and I've got a nephew at Hampshire and he takes classes at Smith, Amherst and Mt. Holyoke.

Liberal Arts with a capital ELL!

And ugly chicks.

There's a book out there called "Colleges that will change your life." I think it would be a good read for you -- it gives more weight to the personality and philosophy of the school, and less to largely-meaningless statistics. Other than that, I would suggest that you apply to Eugene Lang in NYC, but that's based on my very vague knowledge of what you're into. :)

And sorry, but I have to join in the dogpile here. Liberal towns in the South are very, very liberal -- like more yoga studios than gas stations liberal. :D

So you only want to talk poiltics with those who agree with you? Spoken like a True Republican ;)

No, I was half-kidding about that. But honestly, I just dont want to live in the south. It's too hot, too conservative, too dictorial, too christian (too babtist, specifically), and too not-me.

Calm down, man. There's no way in hell you can deny that there are a LOT more conservatives in the south than in the north. It's just the way it is. He wasn't saying that southerner = republican, he was saying the south = conservative, which is true.

And Ibram, I'm a yankee born super liberal, but I've managed to find quite a bit of interesting things south of the mason dixon. If you're looking for the right college, I would suggest finding one that will challenge your world view rather than just support it. Take a chance and step out of yourself, you might find it's better than you thought.

Jesus I sound like a recruiter or something.

I can deny that very thing, in fact. There are slightly more conservatives in Texas, straight up through the midwest, and over to the west towards Wyoming and Montana. Don't believe the all-or-nothing red state/blue state bullshit. Here's an electoral map from the 2004 election showing each county as a shade of purple based on the percentage of red versus blue votes. That's a whole lot of blue and purple in the south, and a whole lot of red and purple in the north, ain't it?

But notice how you can actually see the vermont state borders there in blue?
Thats where I wanna be.


also, just because a southerner votes democrat doesn't mean theyre a social liberal. Most southern democrats are still socially conservative, which to me is really the problem.

I'm not saying that southerner = conservative! I'm saying the south is conservative. You can't just ignore the cultural differences of the south, in attempt to be more understanding. The south is more conservative. There are a lot more civil war memorials and such down here.

Of course, they're not all KKK members, but the conservative ideal is more institutionalized.

Nice one, Fobble. Does that site include any interactive maps you can zoom on?

So I'm going to take this year off. I still haven't decided if I want to go to school. I feel like sometimes higher education, as good as it sounds, isn't always the best option. Some people just aren't fit to be in college. My cousin tried to go to a private institution but ended up unenrolling after first semester as a freshman. He's a bright guy, smart, but just couldn't handle college. I kind of feel like, if I too were to attend college that it just might not be right for me, and I might waste a semester's worth of money when I could be establishing myself in the blue collar work force for maybe 14 dollars an hour this fall. Let's say in a year I move up to 18 dollars an hour, full time job. That's what, 30k a year? Maybe my math is wrong, but for a 19 year old I'll definitely take that. From what I've read most of you are well educated and attended school, but I am not convinced it will be the best decision for some people, maybe myself.

Vermont hicks exist, and are breath-taking. Remember that it's completely rural and mountainous...

I'll tell you what. Try this as an exercise. Go to Match.com and check out what sort of people are within ten miles of the area code that you figure is perfect for you. You don't have to date them, just browse and look at them.

True. Of course if you really want intolerance, check out the Vermont left.

I highly recommend the University of Iowa. Iowa City is a spectacular place, filled with diversity galore. I know websites are teh ghey, but give Iowa's a glance. Pay special attention to the Gay Lesbian Bisexual Transgender and Allied Union It's one of the the oldest University recognized and funded LBGTA groups in the United States. (36 years old this year!) :2cents:

When you live in any area, you will be dealing with individual human beings, not statistical probabilities.

I have a few questions:

Who are the "them" that you can’t stand? All Southerners, or just the ones that you disagree with? Can you "stand" the Northerners that you disagree with? How exactly will being at a certain latitude have any effect on this? People are people. Yeah, I just quoted Depeche Mode.

But, wait. Maybe it’s not a "them" …maybe it’s an "it" ???

What exactly is the "it" here? The actual dirt that you are standing on? The mind-control chemicals in the drinking water?

When I go to a Pagan Drum Circle, what is the "it" that swoops in, checks what latitude we're at, and transforms the whole gathering into a Baptist Church Service?

When I’m playing a gig, and we’re playing a Neil Young song, what is the "it" that swoops in, checks the latitude, and transforms the song we're playing into a Toby Keith song?

There is no "it" … There is no "them" … There are no "Red States" or "Blue States" …

No matter where you go, you will gravitiate towards a group of like-minded people. Or, ideally (and this is a whole new subject), you could interact with people that you don't pretend to agree with, 100% on everything, and you could find some understanding and some common ground, and expand your horizons as a human being instead of being stubbornly closed-minded, clinging to your little comfort zone.

The "us versus them" mentality is the number one problem in the world. Don't be a part of the problem.

Ibram, based on what I've heard you say, and what I know about you, I'd suggest you look closely at Marlboro College in VT. I have no affiliation with it, but it may be a good fit for you.

Flint, I understand that, and I'm cool with it, down with it. Just cause it's a red state doesnt mean theres some dots of blue.
But when it's state policy, and the opinion of the vast majority of the local population, that I have less rights than you cause I like sticking my pee-pee inside other people with pee-pees, there's a problem.
And, see, I've done the whole, conservative society thing. I live in fucking asia, for crying out loud, and when it comes to homogeneous uniformity, taiwan kicks texas' ass any day. I can assure you, assure you, that I'd be much more accepted if i were to walk down the street in tight jeans, david bowie glitter shirt, makeup, girl's hair, etc, in brattleboro (which doesn't even have any kind of public law forbidding nudity (or at least not anymore)) than in San Antonio.

I'm done living somewhere where I get stared at for being different, rather than getting stared at for being individual.

Believe it or not, I think you're more likely to be pilloried for that in Brattleboro than San Antonio.

Vermont may be blue, but it's still New England.

glatt m'good man?

I think I love you.

I have just found my school.

I second LabRat's advice with great fervor! I went to University of Iowa, (my pops also taught there and did some research for the PoliSci dept until recently) and I constantly and consistently recommend it to others. It's a fantastic university, great programs, etc.

My one main selling point would be the campus and the student body.
There is no real campus, all the buildings are dispersed throughout the town, so you walk around the down town area to get to class. Also, (and I'm sure this has nothing to do with your decision), but I've been to many a campus, and never found one with the party atmosphere that Iowa City has. It's a whole other planet come Friday night, not to mention just about every type of social group you can imagine (hippies, of course, being my favorite). Plus, dollar pitchers is an ok deal in town... ;)

...not the most responsible reason to choose a school, I know, but something you won't find listed on the webpage.

Great! Glad to help.

You should really research it well though. I don't know a lot about the place, but it seems like a good quality school if thats the style of school you want to attend.

You won't be interacting with the vast majority of the local population. You won't be interacting with a theoretical being whose attributes are an average of the attributes of the vast majority of the local population. You'll be dealing with individual human beings, each one of which is unique.

I think you're over reacting. Just because someone says "the south is more conservative than the north," it doesn't mean they're going to walk around all day thinking "they're ALL REPUBLICANS!" Like it's been said, there are like minded people in every corner of the globe to be your friend. He knows that, I know that, only the most simple minded people don't know that. You know?

Yes, I know that - I'm the one saying that. ... Our society is overwhelmingly homogenous. To define a geographical region with such simplistic characteristics is absolutely ridiculous, and it needs to be called out for what it is. I am reacting appropriately to a display of sloppy, illogical thinking.

...so you're saying that the south isn't more conservative?

No, but it does have several other interesting displays of the data, cartograms and such.

I'll answer your question with another question: If I lived in the "North" and I decided to have my home disassembled and shipped a few hunderd miles South, to a latitude that is considered (by whoever the committee is on this) to be "in the South" would my political beliefs, and that of everyone living in my home, magically change because I was living somewhere different?

Or, are you saying that the mind-control drugs are injected into Southerners at birth?

Oh, wouldn't that explain a lot!