The Cellar - A World without Nukes

The Cellar (http://cellar.org/index.php)

- Current Events (http://cellar.org/forumdisplay.php?f=4)

- - A World without Nukes (http://cellar.org/showthread.php?t=19990)

A World without Nukes

Obama calls for 'world without' nukes

Quote:

PRAGUE – Just hours after North Korea launched a long-range rocket, President Barack Obama called for "a world without nuclear weapons" and said the United States has a “moral responsibility ” to lead the way, as the only nation ever to use them.

Obama’s speech was long planned as the centerpiece of his first presidential trip overseas, but it gained new urgency after North Korea sent a multi-part rocket soaring over the Sea of Japan early Sunday morning.

He again pointed to history to say that America must lead. “As a nuclear power – as the only nuclear power to have used a nuclear weapon – the United States has a moral responsibility to act,” he said.

Obama proposed doing so by reducing America’s arsenal, if not altogether eliminating it; hosting a summit on nuclear security; seeking ratification of the Comprehensive Test Ban Treaty; strengthening the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty; and pursuing a new agreement aimed at stopping the production of fissile materials.

Also, he proposes gathering up all vulnerable nuclear material – or “loose nukes” – within four years. That’s an issue Obama also worked on in the Senate, with Sen. Dick Lugar (R-Ind.).

Though there is bipartisan support for many of the steps, Obama may face resistance from Republicans in the Senate on ratification of the Test Ban Treaty and other moves.

Going off script to borrow his signature campaign line, Obama acknowledged a nuclear-free world will not happen easily.

“I'm not naive. This goal will not be reached quickly –- perhaps not in my lifetime. It will take patience and persistence,” he told an adoring crowd that waved miniature American and Czech flags. “But now we, too, must ignore the voices who tell us that the world cannot change. We have to insist, "Yes, we can."

Can we really? Is this just a pipe dream? Is this truly a genie that can be put back into the bottle?

I am extremely skeptical. How why are we to believe that any nation would be wiling to give up their, in many cases, one and only equalizing card?

What happened when Carter decided to lead the way in retiring a weapons system?

Didn't we already have the disarmament debate during the 80's?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aliantha (Post 553410)

Didn't we already have the disarmament dream during the 80's?

fixed that for ya.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheMercenary (Post 553368)

Total pipe dream.

Don't be so pessimistic TheMercenary. I promise I will disarm my nuclear weapons after you do so first.

Quote:

Originally Posted by piercehawkeye45 (Post 553467)

Don't be so pessimistic TheMercenary. I promise I will disarm my nuclear weapons after you do so first.

See, that is why it will neva happen. Forgettaboudit.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aliantha (Post 553410)

Didn't we already have the disarmament debate during the 80's?

A long term program had begun where all sides were slowly diminishing their nuclear stockpiles. A program that required long term trust. Also part of that program was to shift nuclear power plants all over the world to less enriched uranium to make weapons grade uranium even more difficult to obtain.

Then some idiot unilaterally suspended international treaties, acted belligerent, attacked another sovereign nation by inventing lies, and characterizing (destabilizing) the world only in terms of good and evil (axis of evil). That destroyed all trust necessary to continue reducing these nuclear reductions.

And so we must start all over again. This time with a new complication. Some international parties have been encouraged that selling and developing nuclear weapons is good especially when the 800 gorilla has no problems destroying another nation simply using myths. Welcome to another legacy of the past eight years.

The cops are taught to NEVER put their weapon down.

I doubt anyone ever will.

Homer Simpson said it best. He was admiring himself in the mirror as he held his new gun and said, "I feel just the way God must feel when He's holding a gun!"

Mankind does a lot of things but change isn't really one of them.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tw (Post 553808)

I wouldnt quite put it like that, but I essentially agree.

Despite all its faults and loopholes, the Nuclear Non Proliferation Treaty and related agreements have accomplished alot since 1970....until the Bush administration turned its back on commitments by predecessors (of both parties) by refusing to extend the Comprehensive Test Ban Treaty, scrapping the ABM treaty, and moving towards placing weapons and militarizing outer space.

Hardly a model of leading by example while still providing the necessary level of national security.

Quote:

Originally Posted by classicman (Post 553834)

Bullshit.

A wacko extremist again shows the extent of his intelligence. He took all day to learn how to spell that word. Even a wacko can be smart.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brianna (Post 553837)

The cops are taught to NEVER put their weapon down.

Nobody anywhere even implied that (except the wackos). View the numbers. When did you see a cop on the beat patrolling streets with 155mm howitzers and bunker busting bombs?

Meanwhile, any trust necessary to make a safer world was destroyed by wacko extremists who see enemies hiding everywhere - even in a stolen Cessna. Reasons why we need even more nuclear weapons. And yes, that is what America was planning - to restart nuclear weapons construction.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tw (Post 553996)

Im a twacko extremist. I took all day to learn how to spell that word. Even a twacko can be schmart.

tw - was just a figure of speech, darling.

love you!

Quote:

Originally Posted by tw (Post 553999)

...When did you see a cop on the beat patrolling streets with 155mm howitzers and bunker busting bombs?

I dunno. Baghdad?

Well I am glad they are trying to do it. We need to get rid of them. And the only way we ever will is if WE are willing to get rid of ours.

And Carter did help negotiate peace treaties between Israel and Egypt / Jordan, and those treaties are still in place. Carter does not get enough credit for some of the things he did.

No one will get of their nukes first unless forced by another country.

Everyone is going to say "you first".

I don't buy it. I believe it can be done. I have to believe that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sugarpop (Post 554826)

I believe it can be done.

Long before any of it can be considered, first that trust must be sufficient so that the US and Russia both reduce their weapons stockpile by (for example) 50%. If both nations did that, then each nation would still have many times more nukes than the rest of the entire world combined. That is how ridiculously many nukes both the US and Russia still have deployed.

Simply reducing that number is a first step to a many generation process of reestablishing trust. A trust that Russia should no longer have considering how we have treated Russia since 2000.

Any chance of nuclear disbarment in less than 20 years is not at all possible. Nobody can blame Russia for being suspicious considering what has happened this last eight years.