SlutWalk -- Seattle
 

I'm going! Who wants to join me?

SlutWalk Seattle
Goddammit!

You have *got* to be kidding me!! There are people drawing breath today who hold such ideas? The Toronto Police officer? I am stunned! Well, fuck that shit.

I'm going.

Google up Slutwalk and look at some of the images on the shirts, on the signs. I'm right there, baby. "Silence is not my consent" "Ask me what I'm asking for" "I was wearing slacks and a sweater, is it my fault too?" "I'm a rape survivor and I'm not gonna stand for this shit" "My clothes are not my consent" "Real men take 'no' for an answer". and on and on. All of you know I have a BelovedDaughter. GOD FORBID she should ever have an experience like this. But it's not about my daughter only. I have sons too, and they need to learn to be real men, taking "No" for an answer. Consent is the key here, well, everywhere. This has been a big hit in many other cities and I'm gonna do my loudest, rowdiest, sluttiest best to draw attention to this fucked up misconception--slut shaming--instead of rapist blaming. Heheh, maybe I'll rent a biiiiig wood chipper and tote it along behind me with a sign "evildoers feet first".

By the way, I just found out that Westboro Baptist Church has also applied for a demonstration permit for the same day, same route.

I am most fucking-A definitely going.

Well...you know I'm going.

Ha! Excellent. There was a SlutWalk in London as well recently. Shame I wasn't able to go.

:D

Good for you V - have a good time and share our thoughts on them with the WBC - nonviolently.

Fess up V, you're only going for the sluts... ain't ya?

Make a statement - wear a tube top and Daisy Dukes, and post the pics.:D

Liz Jones's take on the London Slutwalk, writing for the Daily Mail. Headed: Class is the real problem, sisters - not slutty clothes
My Mum loves her column [gag].

This is from the end of the article, click on the hate Mail link above for pictures and descriptions as opposed to her opinion.

The slut walkers, with their black clothes and gothic make-up, are well educated and fiercely super-confident young women raised by middle-class mothers to expect everything they want from life. They take no prisoners.

They will glide through life, bossing their husbands and bosses, doing exactly as they please.

That's an image I didn't really need in my head.

You know many people sneer at Muslims who believe that a woman's hair is her beauty, which is why it should be covered in public and shown only to her husband. And that a woman must dress modestly to be a true believer.

But there are plenty of men out there that don't even have religion as an excuse.
It's always the fault of a woman.
She dressed like a slut, so it was okay to rape her.
She had a drink so she didn't deserve respect.
She's slept with more than one man so she is a whore - no, wait, worse than a whore because she did it for pleasure not money.
She wore a skirt when cycling, therefore she was a distraction to drivers?! WTF?! Seriously, send that policeman on a training course. There are far greater hazards driving in NY than a girl in a skirt. Best turn your siren off in case it distracts cyclists.

I'm in no way a man hater. And I do not, will not and have no intention of associating with the kind of man that has these views. But I am still cross that "society" in general still seems to accept them. Including some women.

re: the girl in a skirt and the "cop"

Not to put too fine a point on it but she has no proof that what she alleges happened, happened. She does however have some nice free publicitiy for HER BICYCLE COMPANY.

Convenient that she got off with a warning from this spectral cop / PR agent and no hard proof of this phantom encounter.

My bullshit meter was redlining when I read that story.

Good point well made.
My bullshit-o-meter is highly tuned when it comes to UK publications. Partly because I know their individual bias. I'm more naive when it comes to overseas press though. But if she recived a ticket, she will be able to present it surely?

Not retracting any of my comments. just acknowledging they might not be justified in this case.

There is absolutely no excuse, none whatsoever, for rape. I do want to add, however, that women should not dress so provocatively if they do not want to be ogled. Example story: My friend once came over to have dinner with me and my sister joined us. My sister was sitting across from my friend. We were eating when my friend said, "Stop staring at my boobs." That's when my sister realized she's been staring at my friend's boobs; she wasn't even doing it on purpose. My friend was wearing a low-cut blouse, had a huge cleavage going because she was going clubbing with some other friends later. Now, if even a woman is drawn to boobs without intentionally doing it, how can you blame a man?

Your comments are spot on, sundae. She didn't get a ticket and doesn't know the name of the officer that supposedly warned her.

Absolutely no one deserves rape, and there is no excuse. The question that is in my mind is: why dress in a manner that intends to draw (sexual) attention from everyone around you in shithole bars and night clubs? It's not asking for trouble, but it does send a message to everyone that sees you that you want attention and you want that attention in a sexual manner. Upper thighs, chest, ass, etc. exposed or nearly so. Idk.

Women dress to be looked at, not to be touched. When a woman is only allowed to be looked at, she has the power. As soon as touching is involved, the man's superior size/strength means he now has the power.

Correct.

... You answer your own question Bullitt--to draw sexual attention. That's easy.

But to extend that line of thought, the attention can lead to lots of things. One thing it could lead to is a conversation about sex. "Hey, you're hot. Wanna fuck?" "Yeah!" Probably not rape. That sexual attention, that sexual conversation *REQUIRES* consent. No consent, no sex. Even if there is penetration. Attention seeking and attention giving isn't a crime.

Have you ever seen a woman who drew your sexual attention? You probably didn't rape her. There's no connection. No more than the woman who's wearing slacks and a sweater (or her pajamas or anything else) has in some way, *any* way acted to contribute to being raped.

For the record, I don't think you're suggesting this line of thought, though others have said it or implied it. Whoever hold this idea, they're wrong.

If dressing to partially reveal your knockers/thighs means you're up for it, does that mean that everyone who's ever mooned someone is up for buttfucking?

Well, we would have to ask Sheldon if that's what it's suggesting to him. :p:

The cop in the OP must have missed the class about rape being a crime of violence.

Having said that, I think this is another good spot for this picture. ;)

funny pic!

However, I think it's more likely that the cop in the OP *HAS* been exposed the facts about rape being a crime of violence, but doesn't buy into it. "You better not dress that way!" What total bullshit. Does he tell people with nice cars "Fool! Drive a beater instead if you don't want your car stolen!"? Does he tell people with wood frame houses "You're asking for arson." Such... I'm at a loss here... "ignorant" is inadequate. Such wrongness baffles and infuriates me.

If rape is a crime of violence, not of sexual desire, then any conversation about what anyone should or should not wear is moot. The cop in the OP IS ignorant. Yet, we are discussing the very issue of clothing choice as if it has any relevance whatsoever, which lends it relevance. Protesting too much and all that.

A girl can be a ho-bag all she wants. Her ass can hang out of her shorts and her tits can be stuffed up into her botoxed face. I might think it shallow and stupid, but that's just my opinion.

But the subject of forcible rape is not up for discussion or interpretation. It is rape. It is a violent crime. It has nothing to do with fashion or looks or age or any of the million things society points to in an attempt to define any particular woman.

I just think this is a bad analogy. Certainly an issue when buying a car.
Insurance on these cars is also more because of that statistic, and others.
What is necessary are some, ANY statistics or correlation with a women's dress and rape.
If there is something, then we can address that.
No matter what, it shouldn't matter and men should be able to control themselves.
If not, then those people should sent to ZippyT's chipper.

Here's a statistic for ya. For every percent that a woman reduces the amount of clothing she wears, my naughty bits increase a percent. That's what cold showers and internet pron are for. Rape is not an option.

I'm sorry you don't think it's an apt analogy. I heard it over and over this weekend. The idea that the VICTIM was complicit in anyway in the crime is what I'm trying to draw your attention to here. Time and time again I heard stories of women who heard from authorities, prosecutors, police, bystanders, bloviators, whomever, that said, implied, *decided* that the woman's actions, or dress, or state of intoxication, or location or presence.... that the woman was in some way responsible for what happened.

You can't really be telling me you've never heard "She was asking for it" or "Look at how she was dressed--what was she thinking?" For fuck's sake, the woman's clothing is considered EVIDENCE. It's treated as an integral part of what happened.

Look, there IS NO CORRELATION. Except in the minds of people. When you hear a news story about a gang rape, it always goes woman was gang raped. No talk about "Fourteen men assaulted a woman". The focus is on the victim, and not on the perpetrators.

You tell me. What culpability does a woman have in the case of rape?

I'm sure (I fucking hope and pray) your answer is a simple and unequivocal "None.". But there are a lot of people who offer a lot of answers to such a question. Every other answer is wrong.

I don't want to derail this talk "defending" my analogy. My point is that the victims of such crimes bear no responsibility for the criminal actions of the rapist. Just like the owner of a nice car isn't responsible for the actions of the car thief.

ok - in that context, I agree.

The part I was getting to was that if you buy the most stolen car on the market, one shouldn't be shocked if the vehicle is stolen. It is in this context where I believe it does not apply as I don't agree that a woman is "asking for it" based upon how she dresses.

I have a lot of different thought swirling around in my head on this.

The relationship between a criminal and their victim is complicated. I'm talking about all crimes here, not just rape. We all have locks on our houses and cars. If we don't lock our stuff up, and if it gets stolen, will insurance pay if we never lock our stuff up? If I walk alone, listening to my iPod, in the nasty crime ridden drug neighborhoods of DC late at night, and get mugged, was I being stupid?

The criminal is always 100% responsible for the crime, and the victim is 0% responsible, but we all do stuff to a certain degree to protect ourselves from being victims of crime.

After a bunch of horrible crime in a big city, often citizens will stage a "take back the night" sort of an event where they march around in a big group to assert their right to walk around unmolested in their own neighborhoods.

I think this "Slut" walk is a similar thing. I think women have the right to wear anything they please and not get raped. But I also think there are bad guys out there. I don't completely know how their lizard brains work, but I think some of them will rape a woman they find desirable and are able to get alone, and they may find "sluts" more desirable than others. Those "sluts" are 0% responsible for getting raped and the rapists are 100% responsible. But there is probably a correlation between certain behavior and becoming a victim of crime.

Don't believe it? Then why do self defense programs tell people to pay attention to their surroundings? To act alert? Criminals don't tend to choose alert victims. Criminals make decisions based on a person's behavior when they decide if they are going to attack them. Dress probably plays a part in it for some rapists.

Perfect. Thank you.

Slutwalk Seattle was an awesome, awesome experience. I'd encourage anyone who has an upcoming Slutwalk event coming to their area to go. I was humbled by the stories I heard from the various speakers.

Did you see the WBC BigV or rrrravvvveeeennnnnnnn?

Customer: Is the neckline on this dress too low?
Sales girl: Do you have a hairy chest?
Customer: Of course not!
Sales girl: Then the neckline's too low.