Pointless
 

I'm so pissed at my ex, and so sad about my 'friend' who never was, and looking at a future of no career and no book (I was supposed to write a great book, haha, I wrote a book with my kids' encouragement and shopped it around and it went nowhere, no surprise) and no mark on the world, and I wonder why I'm even trying to get better.

There is no cure for breast cancer. There's no time at which risk drops to that of the general population. Women with carcinoma in situ, less than my stage, turn up with mets in two years. With my stage - let's just say that if I had the same chance of winning the lottery as of turning up with mets in five years, I'd drop every dollar I have into this week's MegaLotto. My family is ridiculously long-lived but I'll be the exception. I won't have accomplished anything I wanted to accomplish, I'll just die sooner than I expected and be a fool for giving up so much for other people for so long.

And yes, I'm drunk, and going to get drunker before the night (or morning's) out, and then go for chemo tomorrow. If I puke my guts out who cares? If my liver fails, who cares, it's just disaster a little sooner than would happen anyway. I have a billion academic things to get turned in and I won't get it all done, and I'm alone for chemo tomorrow thank god, I don't have to put on a brave face for anyone, and I wish I'd just die tonight.

I will get through this just to find I can't get health insurance, and I'll know I made the definitive errors and bad decisions years ago and I'll never make my mark as an academic or researcher, never be a writer. Never be anything ... just need another drink and some lorazepam. Maybe the decadron will keep me up all night regardless.

I really invested in that 'friend', stupid as it sounds. He woke me up, made me think, made me realize I was still desirable, made me feel valued and unique. And it was all lies, just his player's game. He confided personal things and hurts that I wouldn't expect a man to confide unless he had some investment, he shared things I didn't think a player would, but in the end that's all it was. Just a well-rehearsed line, doled out bit by bit. And here I sit, so stupid and naive and worthless, and honestly I know I won't ever be able to sort through another man's bullshit and figure out if anyone's being honest. It's not that I can't be alone; but I hate having been lied to, having believed it.

So here's to living alone, as long as it lasts.
__________________

Don't fucking die tonight.

I'll continue reading the rest of your post now.

ortho...

I'm a guy. Your post touches my heart. And it also mashes the hell out of my "I-can-fix-it-button". Like I said, a guy. But I can't fix this for you. I've read in books that listening without fixing is helpful all by itself. I take this on faith. If you are helped by my non-fixing, wonderful. I sure wish I could put a wrench on something though.

And I won't contradict you, oh you're wrong about this and wrong about that... that is kind of insulting, as I don't know your life very well. But I know some stuff and ... shit. now I'm arguing. Sorry.

can't fix.
can't argue.
I'm listening, but that feels passive, ineffectual.

Why don't you just keep talking, and I'll keep listening, hm?

I'm sorry. I've never been a drama queen. Not going to deliberately off myself tonight, just don't care anymore.

I know there's no fix for this. I just find that, when I'm really down, I write. Sort of inflicted this on you and whoever else takes a peek, sorry.

I started out very black and white, very intense, like pretty much everybody does as a young adult. I was sure of what I wanted, got my heart broken at 18, got date-raped at 18 1/2, moved away (it's a good thing) and went on to come first in both the chemistry and biochemistry classes of my university with my undergraduate degree. Went on to medical school, actually got a better school to take me after I'd turned them down. Why? Because my ex got accepted there and not at the place I originally sent my acceptance to. First big mistake.

Didn't cover myself with glory at med school but did well. It wasn't my best fit. I would've done better as an academic. Could've chosen an academic type of specialty, but by then I was bound up with my ex and doing something different, that would mean a split, didn't seem rational. Young love and all that. I will say, he was extremely personable, extroverted, cheerful, spontaneous, and pursued me with determination. No sign of typical abuser stuff. I was a bit lazy, having had my heart broken, and just let him pursue without much encouragement on my part. I gather that's the best thing for conniving women to do, but honest, I wasn't doing that. Just lazy where I should have been alert, for his sake as well as mine.

We spent tons of time together by default, being the only two in an insanely demanding undergrad program at the same university and then in the same med school. We married after third year med, for practical reasons.

We had children sooner than expected; I got pregnant right at the start of my internship. Let me tell you, I don't recommend it. Spent months seeing patients in ER and excusing myself to run off and throw up. There is no pity among residents; they're all so stressed out that the prospect of someone not pulling her weight brings out animosity, not compassion. My first child needed the NICU and teetered on needing an exchange transfusion for days (in 1986, when the blood supplies were unsafe - he would've very likely gotten HIV). I went back to work full of anxiety and then we went north as soon as we could, because after all I could write my Board exams anytime and there was no point delaying my ex for 6 months. I'd gotten sick after delivery and spent time in hospital, needed to make up time to finish my internship.

My beautiful first-born was followed by my second son, who shouldn't have been born, according to the docs. I was supposed to be too full of scars. My second son was so big and beautiful, but very soon it became clear there were problems. He was diagnosed autistic, then Asperger's, then early onset bipolar, and many other things. He was very violent from about 7 years old. I home-schooled my kids until my oldest was in sixth grade. In third grade he read at college level. In seventh grade, at age 12, he was diagnosed with schizophrenia.

My third son came along two years after his older brother, and my daughter two years later again. By then our household was in chaos. My ex had long previously chosen to live as a bachelor in terms of his work and athletics (he was very athletic) and amusements. He wasn't unfaithful as far as I know. He was much more committed to living for himself, not that interested in looking elsewhere. To this day I think he probably never strayed.

I was very lonely from the time I stayed home with the kids, from the birth of my second son. I did some locums but had no reliable babysitting; was accepted for a Master's at a prestigious university but my ex wouldn't share child care. I got to the final round of interviews for a very good job with the Canadian federal government in the Health Protection Branch but my ex then announced he wouldn't move to Ottawa. I tried to get into programs in Public Health so I could be a Medical Officer of Health but ex wouldn't move to cities where I could enroll in the program.

And so on. I ended up caring for my kids full-time because my ex was absent and they needed a lot of care. We moved to the US and I needed to advocate even more. I think the day I was told my oldest son had schizophrenia at 12 years old may have been the worst, the hardest, of my life.

Enough already ... crap. Who wants to know all this? Sorry.

Ah.

There you are.

wow... wow.

that's one rich life story so far. and of course, you're still writing chapters.

I wish you didn't feel so bad orthodoc. :( Sorry.

It is a great story, and I thank you for sharing it with us. I'm glad to hear you're not going to off yourself, really, thanks a million for that. 'preciate that. this sounds pollyanna, but it's not. you ahve a lot going for you, and a helluva a lot to look forward to, especially being part of ridiculously long lived people. That's a good thing. I'm no doctor, I'm just a friend. You **are** hanging in there, and I'm glad about that, thanks for that.

Hang in there a little bit more, ok? One day, one night, one treatment, one ordeal at a time. Reading your story--whoa, that is a hell of a lot of everything. but you weren't overwhelmed by it, you just lived it one day at a time. Tonight's no different. You have a big crappy day ahead. Drink up. Or sleep. It's gonna be ok this time tomorrow.

You'll see. :)

Yeah, V's right. No big need to rush the dying thing. Stick around. Things always change. Even if they don't get better, they always get different which means you still have any number of possibilities that may be out there for you. And things might even get better. It can happen, you know. Might as well stick around to find out.

Also, keep in mind that while your so-called friend was actually a dirty double dealing rat, he does not have the ability to steal from you your own special self. It may feel like he's done that, but he hasn't. You are still a talented, special, the only one of your kind, incredible human being. Minus one rat. And minus a minus is a plus. Good thing you're rid of him now rather than later. You can now get on with your life. What a relief!

Chances are that given some time, you'll find someone far more worthy than your ex friend could ever even dream of being. It sounds like he might have been the evil twin of the last man I was in a relationship with. Except that after 6 years I found out that we'd actually never had a relationship at all. I felt pretty stupid and terribly used and very lost and very angry. Those feelings DO go away. But you know that already.

A Buddhist mantra just for you. Repeat after me:

May I be filled with loving kindness
May I be well
May I be peaceful and at ease
May I be happy

Breathe. Repeat as often as needed. And post again tomorrow to let us know you're Ok. OK?

well put, Sam.

I just lost my second post. I can probably shorten it. We moved to the US in 1992, there were no career opportunities for me and the kids were extremely needy, and the abuse worsened through the '90s until I tried to leave in 1998 and 1999. Didn't succeed. We went back to Ontario in 2003- 2005 and I cared for my mother-in-law (who hated me because I wasn't Ukrainian). Tried to help my kids in the Ontario school system. My second son became an addict. Ontario has no drug laws, in practice. Dealers hung out in the front hall of the high schools with their pit bulls. My son lost his meds weight and became very athletic when we arrived back in PA, but in college he succumbed to the drugs.

The summer after his first year was very scary. He went through rehab, took up with a woman who had an addict mother, moved in with them, and was lost. He now has terrible health problems - pulmonary emboli that have killed half his lung capacity - and gained 200 lb, and is depressed and addicted to narcotics.

My oldest son struggled through university and graduated with Honors in Bioengineering, went to law school, just graduated. He still struggles. My third son is an academic star. He came out to me, privately, after sophomore year. He is very verbal and can, has, cut my heart out as with a knife. He considers that he was never really loved. My daughter was diagnosed with ADHD in school, had problems due to the chaos of her violent older brother and all the other problems, but is a sweetheart and the sunshine of my life. However, she is vulnerable to abusive men.

So at the end of all this, I determined that I had to leave and find my own way, and now this.

I will say, my long-lived folks are a source of inspiration. My father has out-lived his father and brother (it's the women who live into their late '90s) and this summer had surgery on both his cervical and lumbar spine for stenosis; he left a miserable marriage in his early 50's, married a woman he loved (but who was an absolute BITCH to the nth degree to us), cared for her through her illness and death from lung cancer, and lives alone now 11 hours' drive from where I live. I was with him for his surgery this summer. He now keeps on keeping on, determined to walk without a walker or cane, living alone. He doesn't regret his divorce, although he made mistakes at the time ... but now I'm older, I don't judge. I don't judge anyone.

Our family motto (British/Scottish) is: Freedom through adversity.
Maybe I need to take another trip back to Katrine and rumble around Scotland and feel my ancestors again.

Thanks, Sam and V. I'm sorry. Although I'm all too familiar with things getting different, but not necessarily better, I acknowledge the possibility that they may get better. I've been trying to live in the present for awhile now. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

I will say, I have no fear of physical abuse anymore. It's the easiest, simplest sort. After going nose to nose with my second son after months of him punching through walls, slashing art, leaving weird and very disturbing things for me to find, and attacking my third son, and finally going nose to nose and just telling him to deck me and get it over with - fully intending to take the shot and call the police - and seeing him back down, I don't really care anymore about physical stuff. Emotional stuff is much harder to deal with.

But for all I'd gone through and learned, I was so naive when I encountered this 'friend' that I just became an idiot. I was lonely, very lonely. I didn't expect it. I was -honestly, you will laugh, but honestly - looking for a friend, someone who had been hurt and might understand where I was coming from. NOT looking for anything else. Just so naive.

I hadn't had any friends locally for years, with the kids and the abuse - isolation is par for the course. I went looking for a friend without any sort of sophistication. I wasn't working then. And women have never been very warm toward me - I did make female friends once I got working in the last six months before I moved, but until then I had none. I've always gotten on better with men, for whatever reason. Although I do have some female friends now. Making friends in the last six months before I moved was such a revelation! I hadn't had any for so long.

Anyway - I reached out to a male because I'd always gotten along best with men. Logical, scientific, med school, internship, whatever. I found the men were more kind than the women in my professional/academic experience. But in this case it was such a mistake. Whatever his hurts and problems, it doesn't justify what he did. Men should know that women always invest, always engage. If they don't want that, they should stay home, so to speak.

Wow, Orthodoc! I had only read your first post when I made my first reply to you. Now I have read your other posts. What you have managed to endure is simply amazing. I am so sorry that your life has been filled with so much difficulty. I don't have any answers either. I try all the time to understand why things happen the way they do. I want for it all somehow to mean something, but mostly I am just at a loss - both when contemplating my own experiences and then when thinking of the lives of others.

Frankly, I have been feeling very sorry for myself lately, but when I read your posts tonight, I realized yet one more time that all of us have to endure sorrow - some more than others and who knows why. My heart goes out to you. If it helps to post about what has happened to you and what is happening now, post away. The one sure conclusion I have come to is that we all are in this thing together and none of us gets out alive. While we here, we are here to offer one another compassion. And I offer you mine.

Thanks Sam. I just lost another post, my internet connection is totally worthless at $154 per month, I can't even post here. None of us gets out alive. That's about all I've gathered from what my life has added up to. Thank you for your compassion, it's probably the one honest virtue. I give up on this internet connection, I've written so much tonight and it's all gone into the ether. but thank you.

checking in. more later. hang tough.

Ortho-see my PM's to you.


You wouldn't treat a friend (or even an enemy) the way you are hammering on yourself.

Life is a series of making mistakes. It's okay to make mistakes. It's okay to be nice to yourself. If beating yourself up over things worked, I'd be fixed by now ;)

^wss

only advice I can offer is to narrow everything down to the present moment. stay out of the past, it's gone. don't live in the future, it's not here yet, and there's nothing to be done until it's now. pull it all back and focus on today. get through today. right this moment, what is lacking? this too shall pass.

keep your chin up, kid.

maybe this will help?

I've got nothing to offer. Except that I'm pulling for you. It trite to say "hang in there" but it's also true. You can do this, and I know it's hard, but you can do it.

I think you're right. Ortho is too strong to not pull through this...

Keep posting if you need to. We are here.

Doing better this morning, generally. Problems remain but I'm drinking water today (and tonight), not booze. For today, I will focus on my treatment. And on the lab and assignments due this afternoon that didn't get done last night ...

Sorry about the drama. Yes, thank you, the bunny helps ... have to save that one. I can never find things like that.

Thanks, guys. No more drama, I promise.

Ortho, you are not alone, even if there's no one in the room with you, you are not alone.

:comfort:

Ortho, dear, you can be as dramatic as you like! Hell, you've had a pretty dramatic life already and earnt the right to express it how you damn well please. I second what Jim and others have said about about leaving the past behind you, it's done, can't be changed; and not to borrow trouble for teh future, or anything. The future is not your here and now. Just take today. Drink the water. Do the assignments. And know that we are all rooting for you.

Yeah, your ears could be broken...

Maybe this'll help?

Attachment 41607

Ortho - you have many friends who care about you. They are your fellow dwellars here. If you needed anything, you know most of us would break our neck getting to you.

I truly care and I know many others do too. Opening up about your family situation was incredibly brave. I wish I had a tenth of your courage

@gravdigr

:) made me laugh. But I don't live in CO or WA.

Thanks for the good wishes, limey. I'm taking your advice. Finished chemo, have to get down to those assignments. At least the coursework keeps me busy. I have trouble leaving the past alone; it's what led me to where I am. But I know what you mean, I can't dwell on it like I did last night. Move forward. Have to keep it in mind, though, because if I took things day by day with the ex, most of the time things would be peachy. Just those occasional major zingers, like this week.

Thank you, Sarge. You're a good man, and you exemplify courage. I just hope last night wasn't tmi. Probably was. :yelsick:

Elton John > "I 'm Still Standin'" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZHwVBirqD2s
Stop drinking alcohol. Your body needs to be alkaline not acidic to fight cancer. Take care of yourself. [/parent quote] :hug:

Great song! It should be on the Empowering Women thread.

And yes, I have stopped drinking. Last night was not a good thing. But thanks, you're right. :o

Love the black humor. I've never seen this one.

Wait....what? You've never seen Life of Brian?

Nope. I take it it's a must-see? I

God Damn, I slept through a hurricane here. Sounds like you've been to hell and back. Well I'm glad you got back, now one day at a time, and keep us up to date, please. :ipray:

Oops, last post went too soon. I thought it had, but couldn't retrieve it at the time. Anyway - haven't seen Life of Brian.

Sorry about the drama, Bruce. Bad night last night, but doing better today. Just blurry vision after chemo physically, and the rest I'll put on hold until another day.

Don't be sorry, not at all. Take it one day at a time and we'll keep up. I promise. :grouphug:

So sorry to hear about all you're going through, ortho. I can identify most with the kid-stuff, obviously, and on the one hand it hurts and scares me to read but on the other hand you give me hope. Because I look at you and I say, "If she's through it, she's out the other side and has her head held high (and bald :),) then it must be do-able." I know you don't feel like it right now, but your strength is an inspiration to other people. You don't have to fight for that strength, it's already there inside you.

It is absolutely do-able, not easy but do-able, and from what I've read on the board you're doing an amazing job. I used dietary approaches as well, with some benefit, and just tried to find as many resources and as much support as possible. Every child is different; my second child was extremely challenging at every step and had multiple diagnoses, and that's not always the case. I did have in-home support but we couldn't keep workers; he was too violent. Yet he was sweet-hearted between rages and never fit the 'sociopath' label one or two docs put on him. If he'd gone to residential he would've been taken advantage of to the nth degree by the real Conduct Disorder kids there; that's essentially what happened in high school and college anyway. He was an easy mark for the smart, bad kids, always very naive and believing at face-value whatever he was told.

My oldest has been more recently diagnosed with Asperger's, and since Asperger's can have psychotic episodes and mood issues, I think it's a much better fit than the original schizophrenia label. Either that or he had scz but improved, for whatever reason, and has done well. He hasn't had psychotic episodes in years. There's a school of thought that includes a proportion of improving patients in long-term outcome, and another that rejects improvement as being inconsistent with the diagnosis. I prefer the Asperger's concept in his case.

Anyway ... there is a way through. And the good times with the kids are always there, and seeing improvements means SO much - I've always appreciated every milestone so intensely. Now they're adults I stay in the background and let them know they have my love and support always, 24/7, and sometimes they lean on that and other times they fly solo. It's good to see them spread their wings.

Your life may have not turned out the way you imagined it would, but I'd be god damned to let anyone call you a failure. You've led an amazing life with great achievements against incredible odds. Your chin should high and proud.
http://cellar.org/2012/aaclap.gif

Wise words.

I think that, at some point, most of us find ourselves somewhere we hadn't quite planned or chosen to be in life. I've come to a place where I try to take the attitude of 'be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle'.

It doesn't excuse naïveté or stupidity on my part, but it helps keep things in perspective. As do the good people here. I truly appreciate this community.

Here are two poems for you Ortho:

Wild Geese

You do not have to be good.
You do not have to walk on your knees
for a hundred miles through the desert, repenting.
You only have to let the soft animal of your body
love what it loves.
Tell me about despair, yours, and I will tell you mine.
Meanwhile the world goes on.
Meanwhile the sun and the clear pebbles of the rain
are moving across the landscapes,
over the prairies and the deep trees,
the mountains and the rivers.
Meanwhile the wild geese, high in the clean blue air,
are heading home again.
Whoever you are, no matter how lonely,
the world offers itself to your imagination,
calls to you like the wild geese, harsh and exciting
over and over announcing your place
in the family of things.
-- Mary Oliver


The Journey

One day you finally knew what you had to do, and began,
though the voices around you kept shouting their bad advice--
though the whole house began to tremble and you felt the
old tug at your ankles. “Mend my life!” each voice cried.
But you didn’t stop. You knew what you had to do,
though the wind pried with its stiff fingers at the very
foundations, though their melancholy was terrible.
It was already late enough, and a wild night,
and the road full of fallen branches and stones.
But little by little, as you left their voices behind,
the stars began to burn through the sheets of clouds,
and there was a new voice
which you slowly recognized as your own,
that kept you company as you strode
deeper and deeper into the world, determined to do
the only thing you could do-- determined to save
the only life you could save.
-- Mary Oliver

Here's one of my favorite old sayings for you ortho: Life is hard, then you die.

I prefer footses poems. Especially the second one.


Sent by thought transference

Foot has excellent taste. Here's another by Mary Oliver:

Roses, Late Summer

What happens
to the leaves after
they turn red and golden and fall
away? What happens

to the singing birds
when they can't sing
any longer? What happens
to their quick wings?

Do you think there is any
personal heaven
for any of us?
Do you think anyone,

the other side of that darkness,
will call to us, meaning us?
Beyond the trees
the foxes keep teaching their children

to live in the valley.
So they never seem to vanish, they are always there
in the blossom of the light
that stands up every morning

in the dark sky.
And over one more set of hills,
along the sea,
the last roses have opened their factories of sweetness

and are giving it back to the world.
If I had another life
I would want to spend it all on some
unstinting happiness.

I would be a fox, or a tree
full of waving branches.
I wouldn't mind being a rose
in a field full of roses.

Fear has not yet occurred to them, nor ambition.
Reason they have not yet thought of.
Neither do they ask how long they must be roses, and then what.
Or any other foolish question.

@footfootfoot, thank you - the poems are beautiful, I love both of them. Unbelievably apt ...

@sexobon, I'm familiar with that saying - have just found that taking a hard look at death makes me want to draw a little more from what's left of life.

@SamIAm, thanks for this - I really have to look up Mary Oliver. Don't know why I haven't run across her work before.

(Sorry to be a bit telegraphic - rough day coming off steroids.)

That's OK, any communication tells us a lot. ;)

God, Mary Oliver gets right to my gut-I know it's pure poetry b/c I get goosebumps when I read her stuff. Those are great poems to contemplate; slowly; over and over again. I remember when I was having some sort of rough time and SamIAm sent me the Wild Geese poem and it made me feel better.

I also like the one that begins "You do not have to be good-" b/c I am not and I always think I should be.

My thoughts this rainy, blowy morning are with you orthodoc. You will prevail.

One Art - Elizabeth Bishop

The art of losing isn’t hard to master;
so many things seem filled with the intent
to be lost that their loss is no disaster.

Lose something every day. Accept the fluster
of lost door keys, the hour badly spent.
The art of losing isn’t hard to master.

Then practice losing farther, losing faster:
places, and names, and where it was you meant
to travel. None of these will bring disaster.

I lost my mother’s watch. And look! my last, or
next-to-last, of three loved houses went.
The art of losing isn’t hard to master.

I lost two cities, lovely ones. And, vaster,
some realms I owned, two rivers, a continent.
I miss them, but it wasn’t a disaster.

—Even losing you (the joking voice, a gesture
I love) I shan’t have lied. It’s evident
the art of losing’s not too hard to master
though it may look like (Write it!) like disaster.


You will survive this and forgive me if I make you gag (it would've made ME gag if someone had said it to me when I was sick) but cancer made me stronger, better, more loving and forgiving and more compassionate. Hard to believe, but I used to be worse than now. Just ask around. ;)

It's true. She did!

true.

but that's not saying much (given what a fine, intelligent, compassionate friend she is now).

I'm sorry if my experience with cancer didn't live up to your expectations, bigV.

Cancer slacker. You call those tumors? HA! I've seen bigger tumors on a, uh, umm...

highlight and read biggies white words

I'm an idiot. I apologize, BigV.

I'm a super sensitive wench sometimes (as we all know) and I took it completely in the wrong way. It's easy to do that when we communicate via computer and have no inflection or body lang. to grasp on to.

I apologize and thank you for your kind words.

Apology accepted, but I respectfully disagree about you being an idiot--you're not an idiot.

I was trying to be clever, but I hurt your feelings instead. That was my mistake, and I'm sorry I hurt your feelings. It's true I, and everybody here, thinks you're great. I don't know if teh big C is to credit or blame, but I sure like the net effect.

:eek:

total doubletake.

thanks for the whiplash, dana, thanks a lot.

Trils, you may be off the hook with BigV, but I still say you are a total cancer slacker.

But you're OUR cancer slacker.