I blame.......for our present shit show.
 

Who do you blame for the state of 'merica politics?

I blame Bill Clinton for our present shit show.
Bill opened the DNC for business with business. He moved the party to the middle right taking care of corporations rather than working people. This flooded the democrats with money but lost them the workers they could have pulled back from Reagan, leaving the Dems beholden to big money and identity politics. The GOP grabbed abortion and anti-gay rhetoric bleeding moderates while keeping their corporate donors, which gets you Trump from pissed off voters.

Who do you blame for the state of 'merica politics?
 

Americans.

Clinton didn't ascend to the throne by way of noble mandate.

No, we hired him.

It's our fault, all of it.

You're not wrong.

I blame sound bites. I've heard tell that sound bites are what's causing our present shit show. Sound bites are the root of all evil. Only the military should have sound bites for use against our enemies in psychological operations. There's no reason for civilians to have sound bites in view of the mass political destruction they cause. SOUND BITES KILL political discourse. People have no defense against them. We need a Constitutional Amendment to exempt the use of sound bites from freedom of expression. Sound bites have even been denounced right here in The Cellar and if you see it here it must be true.

I blame social media/the interweb for our present shit show.

And there is the preposterous sally from Team Dem to blame Trump for the spread (I think that's their particular grating statement) of Coronavirus/COVID-19. Citing an erroneous idea that CDC funding had been slashed by the pen and the desires of The Donald, also that instantaneous, hasty official organization about it did not occur the hour they started yapping about the virus -- you know, rather than the actual beginnings of government effort on the problem starting January 2019.

There's village idiots,and national ones. What'll it be next, the Wisconsinian Glaciation? Chilling effect.

Obama might have dubbed the undiscovered fault that announced its existence in that temblor that jiggled Washington some years back the "Not Bush's Fault." But he did not pounce on the opportunity.

I blame Flint.

but blame doesn't help solve the problem.

More important is who you gonna call?

...although I think calling clodfobble would probably be a more likely to lead to a solution.

(I initially mistyped "coldfobble". sounds like an unpleasant medical condition)

That must be what we're all sick with in House Fob! Definitely not coronavirus, nothing to see here folks, move right along...

This morning I left the house for the first time since Tuesday afternoon, to stock up on much-needed groceries. I tend toward the morning hours in general because our store is popular and undersized, and let me tell you: there were *way* more people there than usual for 8:30 on a Saturday. I suspect it got worse as the day went on. Whether or not people are actually afraid of the medical risks, they are starting to believe that some major lifestyle inconveniences are coming in the next few weeks, amd prepping accordingly.

Printed signs were taped to every pharmacy window declaring they had no masks to sell.

I think the word clodfobble sounds like a Kamasutra position that's 50/50 pain/pleasure.

I'm blaming Putin.

Was it you he Putin that posture? Sympathies.

Somewhere about the 'net, by the magic of Photoshop, there's an image of the barechested Putin in the saddle -- riding a scaled-up spotted hyena.

I think we're calling Bernie. Only he and Warren would move the party sufficiently left to recreate a balance and send moderate Republicans home. If we go Biden we continue this middle way nonsense which will lead to more theatrical absurdity on the right. I don't want a one party state. The GOP has painted itself into a corner it doesn't have the ability to leave on its own. The Dems may have to help them out.

Say what? You're already tired of Donald Trump's Flying Circus and are looking now for something completely different?

RELEASE THE KILLER RABBIT!

15 posts in and nobody has mentioned the Russians...!

And Democrats are painting themselves into a corner thanks to an extremist - Bernie.

Moderates know that no solution is recommended until a problem is first defined. History demonstrates this.

Long ago, automobile insurance was going the way of health insurance. Did we nationalize car insurance - get the government to pay for it? Of course not. First a problem was defined. Then much later, a solution addressed only that problem. Litigation. Car insurance was no longer approaching $5000.

Industry (free markets) alone could not solve this problem Free markets only work if properly regulated. So government created a new standard (regulations) that addressed that insurance industry problem - no fault insurance.

Bernie wants to solve health insurance by throwing government money at it. He is neither addressing nor even defining problems. His intentions are admirable. But he only want to cure symptoms with money - not address the problems. No different than Trump. What his left wing extremism advocates is different from Trump's dumb extremism advocates. But both only want to solve problems by ignoring the problem.

Also explains why moderates are good leaders. A problem or threat is defined long before throwing money at some magic solution.

I come from a group where Republicans, Democrats, and independents are in equal numbers. Last election, all votes were against Trump. Because these are educated people - not driven by their penis. Even one, who never voted Democratic, voted against Trump. Trump is that obviously bad. But Sanders may force some moderates to vote from someone they hate - Trump. (Or not vote at all.)

Neither left nor right wing extremists represent American values. Concepts, based in first learning facts before implementing solutions, are found among patriotic Americans.

Leaving the informed voters (the moderates) painted in a corner without any choices. And so The Economist, because both Sanders and Trump are bad for America, has this on their cover:

Ahem, what is Putin, chopped liver? :eyebrow:

Oh! sorry

What are you, a Russian bot? Mentioning the Russians to sow division?

What are you, a Russian bot?

Again from The Economist. Putin for President. 24 more years.

Never ask the wrong question:

Re: tw's cartoon
I've seen that around, but from where I sit, you could replace both of them with Bloomberg... I don't think I've had Trump or Sanders screaming into my home about 2020 nearly to the extent that Bloomberg has.

Money talks.


It scales up, too.

Revision: I blame money and "moderates" for our present shit show.

Supreme Court... Citizens united.

But nobody noticed, after Obama got elected the Koch Brothers et al, spent tons of money at state level to capture a bunch of beholdin' Governors and state legislators.

Anyone who throws out solutions without first defining the problem is yelling. Any solution that does not first define a problem insults a thinking person. Only moderates and extremists exist. Extremists push solutions loudly for problems that only exist among the emotional. Loudly to camouflage their missing logical, adult reasoning.

Trump is constantly yelling. So extremists love him. The Economist: Is that a decisive informed solution? Of course not. That is Trump yelling about fictional threats. Yelling because that is what emotion (extremist) adults want to believe.

Fracking is not the problem. Some fracking companies only want to make profits. Just like The Don, they are corrupt. They create serious environmental damage - legally. Ie Cabot Oil in NE Pennsylvania. So lets punish all others because they are Donald Trump corrupt. Yelled out is that Sander's solution.

He cannot bother to first define a problem. He simply wants to throw hand grenades at everything. That is yelling.

Trump never ran a successful company. He routinely stiffs his contractors, employees, and banks. Another extremist with a slightly different agenda. To enrich and empower himself - The Don - at the expense of all others. He is an enemy of patriotic Americans - moderates. One here even lied - said he does not stiff contractors, Trump yells out attacks on others so that extremists will not see he is lying. So that extremists will even deny Trump routinely stiffs contractors.

Bernie does not want to address or define the reason for a massively overpriced health system. He only wants to throw government money at it. As if money solves all problems. Another hand grenade. To solve problems by destroying everything else. He keeps yelling that bogus solution. Yelling because he cannot promote it with deadpan reason - as a moderate.

Obama had one major problem with Obamacare. Wacko extremists on the left (ie Sanders) kept obstructing legislation. That is a leader? Of course not. That is someone similar to Trump. Yelling nonsense rather than working out a solution. Republicans were not obstructing it. Pelosi at one point, under blunt comments from a frustrated Obama, was downtrodden. At one point, sat there looking at the floor without any solution. Because she could not get yelling wacko Democrats to stop obstructing Obamacare. Sanders yells rather than logically, unemotionally, and intellectually first define a problem. He even repeatedly obstructed Obamacare.

What did I see among Sanders supporters at the 2016 Democratic convention. No grasp of reality. They even said the Federal Reserve is a private corporation for the rich. That is the type of person an extremist gets support from.

His fracking and health insurance accusations do not address / solve any problem. Only make things worse. So he yells bogus solutions - as the Economist so accurately parodies. Since that yelling makes him popular among extremists - for the same reasons Trump yells bogus solutions to his right wing extremists.

Sanders is little different than Trump. So bad, that even I must consider voting for Trump. You want Trump to win? Then keep supporting that extremist Sanders.

You want Trump to win? Even the Russians want Sanders - so that Trump will win. That I would even consider voting for Trump tells you how bad (just as dumb) Sanders is.

I do not see Bloomberg or Biden yelling. I see Sanders yelling just like Trump. If I would consider voting for Trump, then you know your Sanders support is self-destructive. You want Trump? Then support Sanders. Even the Russians see that a victory for their man.

At least Bernie's heart is in the right place. That's about all he has going for him (assuming it does not give out again).

Interesting perspective.

Is there a different perspective than this?

"McGovern lost in 1972" --48 years ago?

The time of reformation is at hand. There is no longer a center to aim for. The battle is for how the parties will be defined, to see whether their new form will hold.

Maybe "center" isn't the right word.
The question is, "is the system, as it is, basically okay" or "do we need to change anything we're doing"?

Trump has succeeded at doing a whole new thing, by just saying, "I'm different!" People WANTED that.

The DNC response is to put things exactly the way they were before Trump.

But then, why did Trump get elected? If everyone thought "the system is basically okay" ??

...


eta: how did Obama win? By promising "CHANGE." People WANTED that.

tw seems to think so?
Absolutely, there is a great re-sorting. It can't hold where it is.
Yep. The DNC actively opposes the challenge of change because the system works for $ome.

You can get change from them, chump change.

Big letters do not quantify knowledge or honesty. Since it is a soundbyte, then it is probably a lie.

Facts: Gore lost to another candidate also campaigning as a centrist - barely. So that proves centrists can win.

Kerry lost to an incumbent president who used war to be even more popular. And became a victim of something new - numerous internet lies - ie swift boating. Kerry lost by a small margin.

Obama ran as a centrist. And successfully recruited left wing extremist support to his campaign. He defeated another centrist - McCain. Proving your point? McCain could not win because he was a centrist? But Obama won because he was a centrist.

Obama did same in the next election to defeat another centrist - Romney. So Romney lost because he was a centrist?

Only relevant is who is presidential material. Centrist or not is clearly irrelevant.

Relevant are facts that define a responsible president. Facts (demonstrated in his book before he was elected) said George Jr would not be. So he was not.

One need only view over 3500 contractors that Trump stiffed to know he would be the crappy lying asshole that he is. Then view lies even in the Cellar that deny such facts. Even his supporters will lie - because that is the man he really is. Not only is Trump a bad president. His history said he would be. His supporters even lie about how he stiffs contractors, employees, and bankers.

Bernie hypes solutions that ignore the problem AND that will not work. He is also lying.

Relevant is only how a presidential candidate thinks. An honest man defines a problem long before hyping solutions. Sanders solutions do not solve problems; may make things worse; and exist by completely ignoring what the problem really is. Defines a bad leader.

Meanwhile, everyone can see that the American economy is going into recession - because of Trump. Tax cuts for the rich were a first destructive blow. The Fed, for the fourth time, has been forced to lower rates. This time, even before their usual meeting. And by twice as much as all other rate cuts. After three rate cuts, things were still getting worse.

The Fed sees a recession that may cause major job losses in four years.

A recession created by someone with only a 30 second attention span.
Using defective reasoning similar to what Sanders demonstrates. Neither man demonstrates enough integrity to be a responsible leader. Well, at least Sanders has more than a 30 second attention span.

Only relevant question. Which one identifies a problem BEFORE advocating a solution? Neither.

Even the best Democratic presidential candidate can identify only one perceived problem … having a Republican President. So it comes down to proposed solutions. MAGA wins.

I blame the system as a whole. This sorry state of affairs was inevitable. It was on rails.

This is why it's funny when people say we need to return to constitutional values. These are constitutional values.

I look at it this way, The Dems have grabbed the Center and Moderate Right. This leaves the GOP with the Right, Hard Right, and Right Populists. This means without control of 2 Houses and the Presidency Every compromise will be to the right from a starting position of Center Right, while the Left and Left Populists have no seat at the table. This is not a stable situation. This assumes that any of these labels still function. It would be kinda cool to sit and watch if I hadn't brought children into this world.

We shall wait for the next survey to show that, but, from the highly respected Pew organization:

https://www.people-press.org/interac...ion-1994-2017/

Please click on "Animate data from 1994-2017". In 2011 the Rs move right; in 2017 the Ds match and move left. We wind up with partisan polarization.

If you click on "Overall" and "General public" and animate, you see that polarization is happening, but there is still a big middle. There is an overall trend towards liberalism (which we should expect over generations) but also, a bubble developing near the "consistently liberal". I believe that bubble reflects progressivism, and in particular, the intersectionality/political correctness mind virus*, a wildly fast cultural swing, as seen in this NY Times word frequency chart:

http://cellar.org/img/nytwordusage-small.jpg

(click here for a really big version.)

Part of the Trump phenomenon is a rejection of this virus and this is what Jonathan Pie pointed out 3.5 years ago.

*Yeah it is

As you noted in a previous post, number of moderates was decreasing. Number of extreme left and right was increasing.

Sociologists suggest why. With a wider diversity of choices, many are only listening to what their emotions want to believe. They no longer learn multiple viewpoints and perspectives. That, for example, explains Rush Limbaugh.

Rush, in his earliest days in Pittsburgh, said the news to too complicated. And that he would tell us what to believe. That works on people who do not want to first learn facts. And who know only what their reptilian brain likes. Moving on the WABC in New York made his "we are the central committee of the communist party" propaganda popular. Many only want to be told what to believe - by one source.

Extremism became especially obvious during the Mission Accomplished war. When honest facts were more often replaced by diatribes, lies, and hate.

That tribal attitude has increased, in part, because so many can now hear what their emotions (repitlian brain) want to hear. And no longer need hear other perspectives.

We know from history, for example, that same resulted in a Nazi power grab. Suddenly, that was almost all that could be learned. Even news from outside Germany (ie international broadcasters - BBC) was only new and almost never heard. So Nazi propaganda was only what so many in 1930s Germany heard.