help me?
 

i have been looking for information on the national best public transportation. where is it? i guess my google skills suck because i haven't found much. anyone know of a site like this? i am looking to move.

Re: help me?
 

I've heard unofficially that DC's Metro is the country best public transport ... though I'm not sure how the buses are.

The T in Boston has also been rated very highly.

I still think the sheer size of NYC's MTA tops any other city. It runs 60-70% on time, and carries a fuckload of commuters and passengers daily. Also has the highest penetration rate in the sense that New Yorkers are more likely to use mass transit than in any other city in the country.

Really really shitty ones include:
Philly's SEPTA
Atlanta's MARTA

I don't have much experience with the West, but Denver's bus system, though small, fucking rocks.

I just realized what you're asking (that you're looking to move).

I would check Natl Highway and Transportation Safety ADministration - that would lead to some good stats.

i suppose i should be more specific. i am looking to base my location on whether or not i can live and support my children without driving. dc is out as is nyc....i was thinking philly but now i wonder....and minneapolis/st. paul. i've been to their public transportation websites, but i suppose i wasn't looking for propaganda on the matter....moreso the laymans view, you dig?

what makes philly's so bad? this distresses me...i thought i was making progress.

Well I've been on SEPTA for the past 3 years.

It's not "horrid" but it's nothing amazing. The delays are frequent on the EL and buses. The Regional on the other hand is clean and fast (but twice as expensive).

Worse yet, there are homeless all over the EL, in addition to characters that make you feel a bit uneasy.

Sucky thing is that SEPTA does have a policy which says that if a ride is delayed you ride free. Well the catch is that since almost everyone has a monthly pass you get nothing...

so it is an honest to god transportation system that i can sorta rely on? thanks. philly is ranking pretty high on my lists of possibilities.

Metro DC train (MetroRail) is great. Buses not so good -- DC considers them an adjunct to the train rather than a system in themselves. (besides, buses suck by nature)

Philly (SEPTA) has very comprehensive public transportation which will get you there. Eventually. Uncomfortably. And probably with a few bus changes in bad neighborhoods. But it will get you there.

Atlanta's got pretty much nothing.

Philly public transit...
 

Is not bad. IF you are going from one train station to another on the same line. If you have to involve the buses, or transfer between different trains, you'll probably have trouble.

That's my experience, anyway.

What do you do / want to do for work?

umm..i have out of the job market for a little over 2 yrs but before that i was running a pizza joint, before that the navy...oh and i'm a pretty good waitress, done some bar work...nothing stellar. i figure that there's restaurant everywhere prolly a good place to start and look for a better job from there.

What other needs for the young uns?

just daycare and in a couple years, a good school system. i saw that philly had a zoo and my girls would love that...OOH! and a good library system, that is a definite need.

OK. I b'lieve our Mr. Sycamore is best suited to work out exactly where you should live. You could follow him to East Falls but I'll wager the schools aren't up to snuff. There are a whole set of cheap apartment places out Ridge Ave., just after the border, which busses serve a lot. That could get you a suburban school system, mobility into town if you want to work there.

(edit) You could go to the main line and pay 1350 for an apartment, and walk to the train, but the kids would be in Lower Merion school district (which is for example where Kobe Bryant went).

thanks, UT. i appreciate it:)

I'm down on the zoo. Their reason for existence appears to be to find ever more inventive ways to separate parents from cash--the latest is a hot-air balloon ride . The Franklin Institute, for example (also worth a visit), certainly has restaurants and gifts shops that they like people to spend $$$ at. But once you're in the exhibits, you're in the exhibits. You can't walk 10 feet at the zoo without encountering a concession stand or some kind of overpriced (IMHO) extra attraction.

But that's just me. YMMV.

Toad's right. And you can probably find cheaper apartments than Lower Merion, with almost-as-good schools, and easy access to the trains. For instance, I know you have to add in 10 years of inflation, but we rented a two-floor townhouse with a finished basement for $750 until we bought our house in 1994. It was half a block down from the Morton station on the R3 regional rail, and in the Springfield school district.

I live in Minneapolis/st paul (on the border between) and have a car, but could easily survive without one. I bike, walk to work.
Longer distances are more of a challenge, but light rail is starting to root. Ive lived elsewhere but wanted to move back here. I like it quite a lot. It is not too hard to find excellent public schools in either twin city and you have choice within the districts. If you'd like more detail, feel free to PM me.

Don't completely write DC off...it just depends on where you live in the area. There are several nice neighborhoods on the east side of the red line--particularly Brookline in DC, Takoma Park on the DC/MD border, and Silver Spring in Montgomery County, MD. The green line will give you Hyattsville and College Park in Prince Georges County, MD. And the orange and yellow lines will give you Arlington and Alexandria in VA, which are still decent price-wise (though not as cheap as the other two).

And you could probably do NYC--Queens or Staten Island.

Chicago has an excellent public transit system: CTA subways and buses, Pace suburban buses, and Metra regional rail. Cost of living is decent, though I don't know about the job market there right now...I would imagine it's pretty decent.

You may also want to consider Baltimore. Decent transportation access in the city, low cost of living and easy access to Washington via MARC.

Now, let's talk about Philadelphia.

The cost of living here is pretty good, compared to most cities. Job market seems to be picking up again. SEPTA is decent for getting around. Lots of history and culture. Good healthcare systems.

Now, the drawbacks:

--The City of Philadelphia has one of the highest wage taxes in the US. For city residents, it runs at about 4.7%; a percent or so less for those that just work in the city.

--SEPTA is one of the most expensive transit systems in the country. $2 for a ride on the bus or subways, 60 cents for a transfer. Tokens (which you can buy at many places) are $1.30. Regional rail fares depend on where you live: I pay $127 a month to ride one of the regional rail lines from the edge of the city to Center City (3 zones according to SEPTA)...and that also lets me ride the buses and trains as often as I want (up to 3 zones).

--SEPTA is threatening to make substantial service cuts unless it gets more state funding soon...if the proposed cuts go through, it's going to be ugly: 4 regional rail lines within the city will be slashed as well as several bus routes. Fares for the rails will go up, and the number of trips the transit vehicles make will probably decrease.

--The El and Subway are horrible. Disgusting. Stay away from them as much as possible. Try to do regional rail close to home or a bus/rail connection.

(Incidentally, FNF...SEPTA is supposedly talking about doing away with that guarantee.)

--Thank God you won't have a car...car insurance in this state is ridiculous, especially in the city.

--School system is improving, but currently under state control. Not recommended unless you live in one of the better neighborhoods...and even then, I'd be leery.

--In some neighborhoods, you're damned near an enemy to the residents, especially if you live in an apartment. It may take some time for people to adjust to you, if ever.

So, having said all this, where are good places to live in the area that might meet your needs?

City of Philadelphia:
--East Falls
--Mt. Airy
--Torresdale/Morrell Park (where I currently live)
--Holmesburg
--Modena Park
--Parkview
--Somerton
--Bustleton
--Eastwick
--Queen Village

Montgomery County
--Abington
--Glenside
--Jenkintown
--Cheltenham
--Bala Cynwyd

Bucks County
--Bensalem
--Langhorne

Delaware County
--Upper Darby
--Springfield
--Media

Camden County, NJ
--Mount Laurel
--Lindenwold
--Pennsauken

New Castle County, DE
--New Castle
--Claymont
--Newark
--Wilmington (some parts...not many, but some are nice)

I would recommend checking out philly.com, which covers our two local daily papers, our main weekly paper, and our ABC affiliate. Also good to look at is Digital City's Philadelphia page.

Rho and I have lived here for 3 years now, all at the same place here in the city--it's not paradise, but it's not bad.

I'm in Minneapolis too. The buses are pretty good here, and if you've seen the website, you know they have a nifty online trip planner, which I've had a lot of success with.

It's true longer distances are a hassle. I took the bus to school once (from NE Mpls to Mendota Heights) and it took three transfers and two hours. It is normally a half hour drive. I see you're in Louisiana... it gets cold here and most of our bus stops are unsheltered. I'm really wimpy for a Minnesotan, so I don't use the buses very regularly.

The Twin Cities are catching up to the rest of the modern world. Soon there will be a light rail system spanning from downtown Minneapolis to the Mall of America and the MSP airport. Also a commuter line is planned to go from St Cloud MN to connect with the light rail. This commuter line will go straight through my neighborhood (NE Mpls) and connect up with the Light Rail. So one of these years, I'll be able to take the train system all the way to Mall of America or the airport. Pretty cool. :D

Also, I think DC is definitely the cleanest Subway system I have ever seen (well, it would tie with Singapore). I also like the Boston train system, and Chicago is pretty good too.

We're clean here on the DC Metro because they will ARREST you for eating, drinking or chewing gum on it. I kid you not.

(There was an uproar a few years ago 'cause they detained a five year old girl for eating something. They are ruthless.)

The only real problem with Metrorail right now is that the original system is starting to show its age...there were quite a few broken down trains, elevators and other issues when I lived there in 1999-2000.

I have a few horror stories, but nothing compared to SEPTA. I love Metrorail...one of the few things I miss about DC.

Rho and I tried twice to cover all 87 stations (at the time) in one day...the one time, we only missed the last 3 stops on the green line to Greenbelt b/c at the time, Metrorail still shut down at midnight on the weekends. The second time, we wound up stopping at this great Chinese sit-down restaurant in Arlington, then said fuck it.

I'm going to have to try it again soon.

The funniest thing about it is that you can do it pretty freaking cheap, so long as you get on and get off at the same stop. :)

I can add a few to syc's list . A very nice list, might i add. You know, no one writes a list like sycamore....except maybe george carlin....and Santa. any way:


City of Philadelphia:
--East Falls
--Mt. Airy
--Torresdale/Morrell Park (where I currently live)
--Holmesburg
--Modena Park
--Parkview
--Somerton
--Bustleton
--Eastwick
--Queen Village

Montgomery County
--Abington
--Glenside
--Jenkintown
--Cheltenham
--Bala Cynwyd

Bucks County
--Bensalem
--Langhorne

Delaware County
--Upper Darby
--Springfield
--Media

aston
clifton heights
newtown square


*Chester County
**exton
**downingtown
**paoli
**malvern
**Thorndale/Coatesville(stay east of 13th ave)


Camden County, NJ
--Mount Laurel
--Lindenwold
--Pennsauken

New Castle County, DE
--New Castle
--Claymont
--Newark
--Wilmington (some parts...not many, but some are nice)

thanks everyone. it's a pretty daunting decision but i think that it is now between philly and boston....minneapolis is a little too far from where my mom is living...not that i want to be close...just not far. i don't know anything about the areas of either. i suppose i have alot of research to do but i do appreciate anything you want to pass my way:) i've been looking for a ranking of the nations public schools to see were PA and MA fall but i am not having much luck.:rolleyes: thanks again for the info.

MA is expensive. Very expensive.:)

That's true, Dave, though I'd rather buy the all day pass for $5 (or whatever it costs now), so that I can leave the stations and take breaks when needed.

do yourself a favor and go visit both places fiirst

the people in boston are nasty! worse than NY

i have a theory: the further north east you go, the nastier people get....i've traveled across ctry a few times and have noticed a marked pattern...arizona, colorado, kansas all very nice......the actual corelation might be between elbow room and nastiness.

what brings someone to move to another city based on its public transportation and schools? do you have a stalker? got a lot of unpaid parking tickets? wanted by the INS?
it's best to come clean right away and save the embarrasment of futile resistance to the truth.

vee haff vays of makking que taalk

I disagree with you, Jim...most of the people I've met in Boston are rather friendly folk...nicer than here.

NYC isn't quite as bad as some folks make it out to be...crazy drivers though.

Some people just want a change of scenery...that's why I moved to Washington, DC, then here. And since she'll need to get around by public transit and put her kids in school, those issues are going to be critical factors in her decision.

i am seperating. i don't drive. i have two girls. no family really *shrugs*

Go for it...Rho and I will probably make at least one more move...hopefully to Chicago in the next 2-3 years.

also, jim? visiting isn't really an issue. kinda can't.

Eh, I actually have to agree with him on that. You really don't want to move somewhere just based on what you've heard. You have to experience the sights, sounds, smells, etc.

(Oh sure, you can do it...it'll add excitement to the experience. But you don't want to take other people's words for it...you'll wind up hating them later if things don't pan out.)

yeah, i understand, but i don't really have that option :( that's kinda why i appreciate everything ya'll are passing on.:D

well, if you DO decide to move to philly, and you need a place to crash, sycamore will be glad to put you up for a month or two. he's always doing shit like that

isn't it great to have really great friends

i think it's just great

just great

i'm sure he'll be glad you offered;)

ok. yeah. I was generalizing based on a couple of isolated incidents. here's my other theory on the matter:

regardless of where you live, the average will work out. the following ratio applies to 94.2%* of the nations cities. towns, and boroughs:

the populace will be divided as follows:

15% cool people

60% stems ( people who could get through their life with only their medula)

15% assholes

5% unconsious

5% psychotic assholes





* 47% of all statistics are made up on the spot

that's all i have to say about that

Jim, put the crack pipe down.

Turn around.

Walk away.

Don't look back...

close, but no cigar

Ah. So they take the same approach as Singapore. Seems to work well for both places. ;)

Uhm... well, they don't cane you for chewing the gum, but yeah... I think it's the same, but on a <i>less severe</i> scale. :P

Try:
SchoolMatch Now!
or try Google and type in "national school reports" in the search box. :)
Hope that helps!!

thanks....that was very informative.

This is probably an inconsequential antecdote, but I recently visited DC on a business trip and LOVED the metro. I actually felt safe travelling as a 20-something female (thought I may be delusional.) I stayed in Greenbelt, which is the end of the green line, past College Park. Seemed like a nice area. I don't know much about DC as a city, though.

MAY be? :)

Well, I felt you were safe there, and never worried about you being on public transportation. So I guess that says a lot about it too.

Rho and I lived not too terribly far from Greenbelt. Greenbelt is nice, but if you're not within walking distance of Greenbelt Road, you're in trouble.

College Park is very cool, particularly if you live near the UMD campus.

You can go anywhere on Metro and be safe. Of course, you're on your own outside the stations...

The scariest moment I've had riding the Metro was an escalator that must have been 6 blocks long/tall. Got dizzy going up and down that.

As I understand it, because of the swamp ground below the surface, Metro had to be built rather deep. The Forest Glen station (on the red line, near Silver Spring) is the deepest--196 feet (60 m). And I believe the escalator at Wheaton (also near Silver Spring) is the longest in the world, though they don't have that tidbit on the Metro site anymore.

One day, the escalators were out of service at Bethesda. So, it was either wait forever to take the elevator or walk up the non-moving escalator. And Bethesda is another deep station--Goddamn...that hike up the escalator was a sonofabitch. Some people were stopping at various points to take a break. I somehow made it without stopping...and nearly collapsed upon reaching the surface.

Wheaton .

The whole site is quite interesting and sort of relevant to the thread.

I can't remember which scary escalator I was on last time I was DC (2000?), but it may have been Wheaton. I do seem to remember it was working on the way up, then when we came back to it, it was out of service. So we climbed down the thing. My mother with her bum knee, me with my fear of tumbling for long distances.

The one at Foggy Bottom/GWU on the Orange Line is a real kicker. (Might be the one you're talking about. It's nuts.)

i appreciate all the input, but i grew up in the DC area and i do not want to return...just don't...can't explain why. boston is growing on me because the crime in philly leaves something to be desired. it's rather expensive but thats what i'm looking at right now. of course, it is subject to change.