The 2008 Republican Ticket?
 

I wouldn't put it past them to run Jeb in 2008. But I find it absolutely incredible that the Bush family would want to ask Colin Powell to carry any more water for them, and that he'd actually agree to do it. Maybe in this case a cigar really is just a cigar.

I think it'd be the other way around. After the last four years, I bet it would have to be really satisfying to Powell to have a Bush as his bit...err, boy, err, you know what I mean.

.

McCain / Rice 2008
 

I found Bill Safire assertion on this week's Meet the press, pretty interesting. John McCain and Condi Rice in 2008. As far as Powell or Jeb Bush is concerned, well both are out in my opinion.

Jeb Bush has even more dirty laundry than GW ever did. Jeb is neck deep in Iran-Contra era entanglements as well as 1980's S&L dirt. That's one of the biggest reasons they ran GW, he was the least dirty, if you can belive that. Unlike the Kennedy's the Bush family's standard bearer didn't die in combat, he got chewed up with bad business deals in the backwater, backslapping, drug politics of Florida, no way can they run him. Powell on the other hand is avoiding personal ruin by not stepping into that spotlight, as exhibited in the early 90's when moderate Republicans begged him to run. If John McCain can stay healthy and avoid being dragged into a neo-con co-opt I belive he could serve as the top component of a strong ticket.

My hope is that the neo-con movement is destroyed and/or banished from the Republican party. As exhibited by the realease of Christie Todd Whitman's new book, I'ts my party too, the moderate Republican's aren't going to take this wild adventure in spending and war lying down. Being from NJ, I can't say I'm the biggest fan, but....maybe she can help galvanize a movement away from these neo-con freaks. I'd rather Barry Goldwater was leading the party, it's turned into a real nightmare, and john and jane Q citizen are left holding the bill for outlandish, grandiose schemes of democritization to save the precious sands of the holy land for rich re-born philanthripists and secular american jews who would hate to see the animals in Palestine defoul the land of milk and honey.

It's all but for a few. My dream is that McCain appears to tend to neo-con interests and then deep sixes the mfers. I'ts about time McCain acts like TR and stands up to greedy global capitalists and eccentrentic billonaires with Wilsonian nightmares.

-Walrus

Good thoughts Walrus. McCain/Rice depends entirely on Rice's performance as Secy of State. She doesn't appear to have the temperament to be VP at the present time. Seems nervous, doesn't have a very natural delivery. Keeps talking about what she wants to do once she's out of government. As a voter I don't want to be "sold" the "perfect ticket", I want the VP choice to be a carefully considered thing and not result in something like Dan Quayle.

Sounds a bit like the fellow occupying the White House right now, and he's won two elections. Hmmmm.

I'm no Condi Rice fan, that's for sure, but I still think the fact that she's a woman would hold back the ticket. I don't think the Average Joe would vote in a female VP yet. :yelsick:

I think a black women with conservative credentials would sweep the election. If the republicans pull even 5% of the african american vote away from the Dems, they sweep every state. In fact, I think the republican party is the only place a minority could come from to win the office.

They've done an excellent job of being prone so far.

smoothmoniker, I won't argue with the principle of what you say... but the application of it in Rice? Do you really think she's electable after the last 4 years? Even a lot of Republicans don't seem to be impressed. I guess a lot depends on what she does for the next 4 years

i would probably vote for rice as prez, but not VP. that is just asking for someone to pop the president to shoe in the first black/female president. if she is on the ticket, her name should appear first.

But how much of their core would they lose among the "I'm not really a racist" Southern conservatives?

None.

1) I think you seriously overestimate the racism of the southern conservatives.

And B) Who else are they going to vote for? The gay-lovin' Dems? doubtful. That's like saying that Kerry lost the environment vote for not taking a stronger line against big oil. They may not have been happy with him, but they sure as hell voted for him.

Do you really think that would slow Rove down? Jeb's out there getting International exposure as we speak. ;)

I don't think it's overstated at all. I live in the south (I'm not a native) and have spent a bit of time in rural North Carolina for weekend getaways. I am still appalled by the open (and seemingly accepted) racism here. Somebody makes a blatantly racist comment and nobody blinks an eye. There are bars that have "black only" nights and whites don't go near the place on those nights. No, it's not posted on the signs, it's just known and accepted. Segregation and racism is alive and well in lots of places in the south--and more common than you think.

do they have "white only" nights where blacks aren't allowed? it doesn't seem like that would be allowed for to long without a spotlight being directed at it.

They don't come out and say blacks are "not allowed"--of course that would be illegal. But it is well-known which bars cater to black crowds, and whites don't go there (the same is true of the bars that cater to white crowds). I was at a very popular local bar on Friday night that cateres to the middle class working type, not a redneck place at all. There were about 100 people in the place, yet not one black person, at least not that I saw. And the population where I live is about 30-40% black. It is very common here, particularly in more rural areas, and people seem to accept it.

First, that's not a uniquely Southern phenomenon. There are plenty of neighborhoods/bars in the north that cater to or are frequented by exclusively one race or another.

And second, you're right, a bar called "El Norte" with Tejano music thumping through the walls isn't exactly multi-cultural--but that doesn't mean, for example, that those people are racist and that they would vote against a ticket just because a candidate is a certain color.

Have you been to rural North Carolina? It's not Los Angeles. People make racist comments all the time (even "educated" people), and yes, that leads me to believe that those particular people would not vote for a black woman to be president. No, the entire south is not racist, but certain parts certainly are.

The base
 

Racist or not, courting women voters and the African-American vote is a much smarter strategy. The Dems are retooling right now and by 2008 they may running there own woman candiate. I made the Rice comment based off Bill Safire's comment on MTP this past Sunday, the reality of it is: McCain seems to be a top pick, but one must take into consdieration such a possiblity.

Sure racism still runs deep in the deep south, lets be honest here, but....political strategy by 2008 would appear to not factor them in as much, due to the dwindling minority of segregatioists left in this country. Strong political planning should take into consideration rising numbers of other populations, racist protestants in the south is a decling cultue of hate, and noticibly not really courted by Bush this time around.

In 2000 the Bush Bob Jones visit raised hell. Between that and his DWI, it was looking ominous for the Bushwhacker, but with some spin and the fumblings of Al Gore, a win was had by the GOP and the Bushies. This last election was more about faith, fear, and aleigence than anything else. 2008 may well require some fancy footwork, especially given that the Dems are looking to bump the Repubs in 2008. Counting somebody like Condi Rice out due to racisim is a bit too limitied, lets face it: by any means necessary. I think the conservatives, and the neo-cons are more intrested in seeing somebody with a principled vision, and if GW likes her enough, then she must be all right. I think her experience, her loyalty to GW, and her outlook trumps racism at this stage in America. If people consider Hillary a viable candidate then why not Condi.

- Walrus

Because the party is playing to the right, not the moderates. The Bob Jones and Phyllis Schlafly camps of the party are not ready to support a minority woman on the ticket. If the Democrats put forward a centrist candidate, than the Republicans will not be able to risk alienating the right wing unless they want to bank on a no-other-choice position.