Old Flames
 

Thirty-two years ago, I was a 17-year old high school senior, headed for my first apartment and a taste of what unfettered life had to offer. My girlfriend at the time was a Sophomore, 16 years old, slim as a rail, bright, cute, the child of very forward-thinking parents who had been around the world with the Air Force. I was really, really full of myself, having been a chubby kid who blossomed in my teen years, suddenly finding myself with a lot of unsolicited interest from a variety of young ladies and not handling it very well. I wasn't used to the attention, and apparently thought I was all of that and a bag of chips to boot. My ego couldn't have been hauled in a Terex Titan dump truck.

We dated for almost a year, and toward the end of our relationship, I impregnated Liz. She and I, with her parent's total and unflagging support, agreed that abortion was the best option, and it proceeded normally. It was only a couple of months afterward that I met someone else, and rather unceremoniously dumped Liz.

I was a jackass, and to this day, it is one of the most hurtful things I've ever done to another person. I was utterly selfish and not very kind about it. I've spent years trying to be a better person, largely because of this immature slight I dealt to a person who seriously did not deserve such treatment. I knew that the guy who did that was not the guy I wanted to be for the rest of my life.

Yesterday, when I got home from work, I found in my mailbox a letter from Liz. I opened it with much trepidation, expecting to have my head taken off in some angst-clearing salvo, which I undoubtedly would deserve, even after all these years (I literally have had *no* contact of any kind with her since 1975). To my surprise, it was a thoroughly pleasant "hi", a brief update of her status in life, and a few pictures from back in the day thrown in to bring a fond smile to my face.

Things like this always throw me for a loop. Believing as I do that things happen for a reason, and coming closely on the heels of hearing from my father for the first time in many years, I am now a bit scrambled, and looking for a clue. I sent Liz an exceedingly brief email of appreciation *and* apology, explaining that I felt like I owed her a great deal of contrition for having been an immense jerk. The email was brief enough that I would like to follow up with some catchup.

I guess what I'm looking for here is this: my wife carefully and lovingly explained to me that no happily married woman looks up old boyfriends and contacts them out of the blue, so I need to watch my ass (Liz describes herself as married to a musician in LA, Liz having had a career as a very successful stage lighting designer, a career which I helped set her upon as my lighting assistant back in high school).

She really was one of my favorite people from my youth, and I really would like to have some contact with her, but I recognize that there is some truth in what Mrs. Elspode tells me. So...what says The Cellar? Is it harmless for me to communicate with Liz, or should I just leave it at "thanks for the pics?" and avoid any possible danger or muddying of the current marital pond that might occur? And has this situation ever arisen for any of you all? What did you do?

I ( :female: ) have contacted old flames in two modes:
1 - with the confused and unacknowledged intention of seeing if there was any chance of getting back together
2 - to warn that I have moved back into the neighbourhood and that we might meet up; which was interpreted as 1) above by the recipient.

Depending on how your wife feels about this, you and your wife could arrange to meet with old flame. This should give you the chance to catch up, your wife the chance to learn more about you (maybe more than you'd like :mg: !) and give a message to old flame that you are not available (which I presume to be the case).

Well, Liz is in LA and I in KC, so not much of a problem there. It isn't seeing the person that is on the table, but rather some innocuous email communication.

As far as I am aware, I am not available... :worried:

I suppose its possible that this woman has been pining away for you for 32 years and has decided that now is the right time to make her move to get you back, but I think its more likely that she was struck by a sense of nostalgia/mortality and reached out to you as an old friend. I think that was really nice of you to respond to her positively, that's probably all she was looking for.

feel out the situation and proceed with kid gloves.
[hijackish] not an old flame by any means but there is a lady here in the office building that's been after me for about a week now. she found out my g/f isn't around right now and she doesn't get any at home yadayadayada. i've explained to her "no" but she keeps on. [/hijackish]

Jinx: yeah, that's kind of the way I see it. She saw my name in a HS directory, couldn't find a current email addy for me, and sent a "hi" letter.

The question really is...if this sort of thing happened to Jim, would you feel the same way?

Plt...don't do it! Taking up with women who "aren't getting any at home" is a short cut to misery.

Hmmmm...

As a woman, I find her gesture towards you rather surprising, given that she's married and all. Mrs. E. may have a point.

Tell me something. Did she mention ever having children of her own?

An abortion can be a difficult experience for a woman, especially if she is subsequently childless. She may be replaying old tapes, wondering where she went wrong, coming to terms with some things. Maybe she contacted you as some sort of reality check. Like "Who was this guy all those years ago? Am I remembering things clearly? Did I do the right thing?"

I live in the same town as my exhusband of 20 years. He has since remarried. We were friends up to the time of his remarriage. Since then, he has wisely, I think, retreated. He is with his second wife now, and I am part of his past and he, mine. Sometimes we chance upon one another at the post office or where-ever. We exchange polite hello's, maybe comment on the weather, and go our seperate ways.

Just some thoughts for what they're worth...

Yeah, I think so. Sending emails/letters to say hi/catch up etc. doesn't set off any alarms for me.

not only no but hell no. i have someone that is my sig. other. she may be away but i am faithful. period. i may flirt here and there but when all is said and done, my heart, soul and body are my g/f's.

I admit I have a double-standard about this. If an ex-girlfriend contacted my husband, even in a friendly nostalgia kind of way, I'd be extremely leery. But part of that may be that I've heard stories about all of his exes and I am not impressed. However, I myself think fondly of several of my exes in a "though it obviously didn't work out, it was right for us at the time, and I wish him happiness in life" kind of way, and would contact any of them out of the blue if I were in the right mood, purely for nostalgia. Well, I take it back--I would contact them out of the blue if I happened across contact information. I wouldn't go looking for them.

Anyway, my advice is this: email back and forth is fine, laced with the occasional subtle sentence about your wife and/or kids, but at the first sign that she's trying to establish something more serious (keep in mind she knows your address,) I'd firmly but politely distance yourself.

Maybe you should listen to Mrs. E, not only because she is probably right, but also because she is your wife and it obviously set off an alarm in HER head. I think you risk making her feel weird by keeping in contact with this girl/woman from your distant past. Would it really be worth it?

I had a similar situation when a guy I last saw over 20 years ago emailed me through Classmates. I tried to put myself in my fiance's shoes and thought, if he got a similar email from a long-ago ex, how would I feel if he contacted her? I thought I would probably feel a little uncomfortable, so I didn't even respond and trashed the email.

Go for it. She’s far enough away that things can’t get out of hand without considerable expense and logistics. As long as you are up front and honest with both ladies, it shouldn’t be a problem. You’ll be able to tell after a couple of communications where it’s headed, and can change tack at any time.

She may have had a recent traumatic experience that’s causing her to review, reflect and/or reevaluate her past. :2cents:

when confronted with life's little mysteries and conundrums, i often look to the user title repository for sage wisdom and advice. In this case, we could look to xoxoxoxbruce who tellls us that "the future is unwritten", which is true, but not terribly helpful. No, in this case, mrnoodle seems to offer the best advice:

"don't pick at it. It'll just get infected."

At this point, I have answered with thanks for the pictures and addressing my knowledge of mutual acquaintances Liz mentioned in her letter. She hasn't responded (I sent email) as of yet, but my gut feeling is that this is simply innocent reconnection, as suggested by Jinx.

No one understands wanting perspective on one's past and the sense of impending mortality that growing older brings better than I do. The vague melancholy experienced when I look at the old pictures of my misspent youth has something of an addictive quality, as if the memories dredged back up are able to affect me physiologically. It is at once a depressant and a stimulant, the 8-ball of interpersonal experiences.

It is difficult to explain, really, how it makes me feel. The best I can do is to characterize it as exuberant and depressed at the same time.

Given the opportunity to apologize for an ancient wrong, he feels fortunate.
Released from its long hardened sheath of guilt, the seed of pain germinates.
A flower erupts. A beautiful, bitter weed.
To eat this weed, or let it die in the sun, he wonders.

He puzzles at the motive. Is it his chance to be absolved for his wrongs?
Or is it her attempt to revenge her pain by reminding him of them?
Which does he deserve? Shall he suffer the guilt again, or the bliss?
She certainly doesn't owe him forgiveness, yet she seems to offer it.
Why?

Very poetic, LJ. Mrs Elspode says that the two unexpected communications I have recently received from significant persons from my youth is just the Cosmos giving me a chance to work out some of the shit I still carry around inside me.

Mrs Elspode is a lot smarter than I am. Of course, there are rocks that are smarter than I am, but she's *really* smart.

yeah, well. I think we should all post in ONLY poetry for the rest of the day. whaddya think? get some culture and shit.

Eeeew, culture! :bolt:

Glad to have been there....pretty sure I could handle it better given a second chance......glad I don't have to prove it.
Mixed emotions.....a common malady, methinks.

Maybe she's on Step 9?

wolf--i think you're brilliant! :lol:

I just realized I've overlooked a couple of really good points from Mari. Sorry, Mari.

She didn't mention it, but a bit of 'Net scouring reveals a web page which shows a couple of pictures of a female child.

She did not mention this aspect of our relationship, but I would think it must be somewhere in her mind. It has been in mine for over 30 years, and I've often wondered how she felt about the event after the passage of time.

So.... Is your name Earl?

No, but what a *great* show!

well, i think it's a fucking shame
that no one wants to play my game
you're all a bunch of whining turds
if i met you i'd flip you the bird....s

Well, two emails have been exchanged. All is well, and no hint of any interest beyond being old friends who shared a pretty energetic and formative time of their young lives just trying to catch up and reminisce.

Update
 

Well, most of you probably don't care, but I thought I'd mention that Liz and I have exchanged a few emails over a couple of weeks, and so far no one seems to be poised on the edge of leaving their spouse or anything. I knew you'd all be relieved to know this. :rolleyes:

It has been interesting catching up. My assumption that the kid pic on the web was of one of hers was incorrect. It is her niece, child of her husband's sister. Interestingly, her husband's sister has been married to David Carradine since early this year, making Liz officially David Carradine's sister in law. I asked her what it was like going to family gatherings with Caine. :D Also on the cool side is the fact that Liz's husband is currently the sound design and recording engineer for the Kronos String Quartet.

Anyway, it looks like this is turning out to be a nice, serendipitous occurance for both of us as we catch up on 30 years of history.

My history all sounds so tawdry, now that I find myself repeating it back to someone who wasn't here to experience it in the first person...

Dear Elspode:

I have read your histories, both those written in the first person and those written in the third person, and I must say that tawdry is not how they come across to this reader. They are all uniformly eloquent and articulate. They are highly readable, emotionally engaging and filled with intelligent humor. This current serial essay is no different.

I do not find your situation, your history or your writing tawdry. I find it courageous. Not only for your confidence to bare yourself to the wide world, but also for your ability to face your own story so truthfully. I would dare to suggest that the sensation you are reading as tawdriness is actually your bare humanity showing through. It is based on an awareness, a sensitivity to the impact of your actions, your successes and your mistakes, your victories and your failures. Not just how things turned out, but more importantly, how they affected other people. And that is fundamentally a good thing. And you are fundamentally a good person.

Please don't give any more attention to those negative thoughts than you positively have to. The balance holds, but it is delicate. Do not contribute to the negative side when it is so clearly unwarranted.

Tawdry? Yeah, like John Steinbeck, Jack london, Robert Service, Papa, et al... :notworthy

Your history sounds real. Embrace it.

No woman does something that thinking without an agenda. With regards to relationships, both old and new, women have a depth that men just don't have. Now, I know people (especially juju) think i'm sexist..and that's true. But there's a reason.. either...
she wants you, els, or there are unresolved abortion issues (i HATE that word) or something i'm not smart enough to get.

run EVERY BIT of communication past mrs. els, both from and to. keep her very informed, ask her what she thinks. i know you know that's important...but i'm telling you again.

maybe dar, but age and maturity can walk hand in hand. perhaps she is sincere and just wants to catch up. wouldn't be the first time something like that happened.

Having been a polyamorous couple a couple of different times now (but not at present), Mrs. Elspode and I share info on a pretty free basis when it comes to our interactions with the opposite sex, so no worries there.

Liz has outright said, in response to a direct question, that she "doesn't remember being particularly traumatized" by either the end of our relationship or the abortion that preceded it. I have to take her at her word.

So far, we're just swapping interesting stories of our lives back and forth. Believe me, hers is by far the more interesting. She had quite a stellar career in her chosen field (stage lighting design in LA), and she's got some stories to tell about it. Takes some coaxing, though, as she's as sanguine about people she's met and places she's been as you or I would be about our 9-5 grind.

At the risk of stating the obvious, we women are individuals first, members of the feminine persuasion, second.

I had a similar experience with a boyfriend in my misbegotten youth. Had to have an abortion, we broke up, blah, blah. I looked him up on the internet a couple years back just out of curiosity. I thought about contacting him, but then thought "What for?"

But that's just me. I don't go to high school reunions either. Obviously, other people do, otherwise there wouldn't be any.

And men are just as capable of looking up old flames with an ulterior motive. I had an ex boyfriend contact me after I hadn't heard from him in several years. I wasn't kept in doubt very long of his reason. He had just broken up with his most recent partner and was at lose ends, casting around to see what might come up. Not interested. If it didn't work back when, it wasn't going to work a few years down the road, either.

People of BOTH sexes are going to have their reasons for contacting an old flame. Sounds like Patrick is being cool about it, not hiding anything from the Mrs., and she's cool about it, so no big deal.

If she suddenly starts whining about how awful her marriage is or something, then there might be a good reason to question her motives. But until and unless...

well, crap. individuals first?

what the hell was *I* thinking?
oh yeah... we women, i was thinking, are sneaky bitches with ulterior motives, who can generally see things that men wouldn't see unless the things in question were stapled to a pair of silicone beauties or some free beer.

but like i said...i'm NOT sexist. i know some women like silicone beauties too...

=)


and yes, i know it's generalizing. it's not specific. please don't flame me or put me into a catsuit next to a microwave oven.

This may have to become my next tagline, assuming that darclauz lets me attribute it properly.

BigV, I have another Hall of Fame nominee for you, here.

Please be my guest.

I think I've adequately demonstrated the form. I always intended for others to share in the population of the thread.

Hear hear!

Aw, shucks, you guys... :blush:

But how do you know I'm not just a cunning fiction writing sociopath seeking external approval from faceless names, a vile bastard stalking the Internet in order to bolster a fantasy existence to supplant his isolated, dreary reality?

I'm not...but how do you know? :lol:

Doesn't matter. It's still more interesting than work.

If I've brought a little time wasting into your workaday world, I can die fulfilled... :)

don't die yet! there's still tomorrow!! :D

Who cares? It's still a damn good read!


(This :worm: is a propos of nothing at all except I saw him on the smilie page and had to let him out!)

Bullseye. :thumb:

yeah, well, we already have someone that provides that service. you'll have to find a different niche.

And Now for Something Somewhat Different...
 

Once upon a time, I would have tossed this out here under a subject like Creative Half-Assed Ravings. However, since it has relative relevance to a previous topic, I'll put it here. This is what will appear in my monthly President's Letter in the Heartland Spiritual Alliance's monthly newsletter for December of 2005. Please wrap all stones and squishy thrown objects in tissue for easy identification and disposal...

----------------------------------------
A couple of months ago, I found in my mailbox a completely unexpected and most pleasant surprise. It was a letter and some photos from a girl I had dated when I was a senior in high school, back in the dim recesses of 1974. Since receiving that letter, Liz had I have had an occasional correspondence via email, catching up on the 30-plus intervening years, sharing our family stories and talking about the directions our lives have taken. What I have found out about Liz has given me to pondering a bit. When she and I were dating, I was actively involved in our high school theater department as the light crew chief, doing all the stage lighting work for our various productions. Liz worked with me, and she stayed with it after I left high school (and our relationship) behind. I remember hearing later that she worked at Worlds of Fun for a couple of seasons doing lighting for their shows, and then moved back to California, but that was all I really knew.

In our infrequent emails, she told me that she had just retired from a 25-year career as a lighting designer in the Los Angeles theater scene. She was, in fact, one of the premier lighting designers in the country by the time she burned out on it, having travelled most of the United States and some of Europe in the process. Her resume would make most light tech's eyes bug out and cause legitimate theater tech wannabees to sob with envy. In the process, she had worked with several now well-known actors and actresses, and is in fact now the sister in law of a very well known pop culture icon by dint of her marriage to her husband Scott, whom she met in the business while on long road trips, paying their dues.

The newfound knowledge of Liz's admirable success started me thinking about how little we understand how our lives and our actions change the universe in which we live. 30 years ago, I taught a skinny youngster how to set up light rigs and run a monstrous old spotlight and rheostat-driven lighting board. She took that knowledge and turned it into an award-winning career in both college and the real world. In turn, her lighting realizations undoubtedly moved others to ponder their own lives and insights, perhaps bringing more season ticket purchases or donations to a struggling ballet company, which would in turn allow a young dancer to sustain themselves long enough to launch a career that would someday inspire a little girl to decide to make her career as a teacher of the Arts...and so on and so on.

*My* part in the above postulations is essentially nothing. I needed some help in 1974, and I recruited my then-girlfriend to help me. Heck, my original motivation was, likely as not, to find another way to spend time with her without being watched over by parents...nudge, nudge; wink, wink. Whatever the case, a sequence of events was set in motion that, 30 years later, has in all likelihood affected many lives and ways of thinking. Indeed, after 25 years of being a lighting designer, Liz was so burned out that she has now turned to nursing, and in another year she will begin to intimately touch the lives of thousands whom she will serve as an RN. It might even be said, then, that the sequence of events that was set in motion so many years ago which resulted in Liz's career burnout was impetus for her new career as well, and so those who will be affected by her nursing are secondary beneficiaries of her first career.

So why am I telling you this? Why am I waxing philosophical about some personal nostalgia that you could probably care less about? I do because my recent experience is but a small example of the enormous potential effect each and every one of us has on Existence. Sure, we probably understand that professional educators or athletic role models or other significant and prominent persons have such an effect on the lives of others, but do we stop to look at the things that we ourselves put into motion, even without intent? I know I sure as hell didn't. Because of that, I've spent the last couple of months second-guessing every communication I've ever had with people, every kind or harsh word, every shirked responsibility and every interaction with both friends and strangers. I've come to a realization from all of this. In short, it is simply this - we have absolutely no way of knowing whether or not some small, offhand thing we do or say today will, once cast out to find its way in the Universe, grow and multiply into something much, much bigger than its beginning form. That being the case, does it not behoove us to try and go more good and less harm in the first place?

If you understand the science of physics at all, then you understand that a stone thrown into water or a sound occurring in air results in the propagation of waves of force outward from the source. Given the right circumstances, small waves can be reinforced, amplified as they travel (think of tsunamis, which don't have to start out large to end up gigantic when they finally hit land). I suggest that this happens to us as well. We can't know exactly how our words and actions will end up when extrapolated through years and years of varying external influence, but perhaps we can assume one small, unscientific thing...that positive actions will tend to reinforce positively, resulting in larger beneficial outcomes down the road. A small good can perhaps become a great good simply because we gave it a good sendoff once upon a time.

So...next time you find yourself with an opportunity to speak or act, think for a moment about what comes Later as well as what you are about to do or say Now. You are a part of the Universe, as integral a part of it as any star or planet. The unseen energy world which lies beneath within the manifest and observable world is as reactive to your thoughts and actions as it is to the cataclysmic collapse of a dying star into a black hole or a radio wave beamed across the void. The difference is...a star can't help but collapse if it is above a certain size. A radio wave can't help but travel through the void once beamed there. But you and you alone have the power to control what you send forth into the Universe. Only you can put the original positive or negative spin on your words and deeds. Please make sure that, when you send that energy out there, that it is something that you'll be proud to see again 30 years in the future.

Good advice. Thanks for taking the time to write it. And the whole experience of reconnecting with her seems to have given you a little boost, right at the time you needed one.