Cats and Buttered Toast
 

As you digest your turkey, lolling back in your chair, desktop monitor strangely distant because of this unfamiliar seating position, or else hunched forward, trying to stop that nervous trembling in your legs as you perch your laptop on the place it is named after while you squint at its screen which seems to be full of vibrating letters, maybe, just maybe the following topic will cause your erstwhile slumbering brain cells to awaken with interest and enthusiasm.

A subject we have discussed at some length in days gone by, when Margaret Thatcher reined supreme. Maybe it has touched Cellarites past, I would not know, but still the question irritates:

If you strap a slice of toast, butter side up, to the back of a cat, and then drop that selfsame harnessed cat from the first floor bedroom window, does the cat land on its feet, or the toast land butter side down. Be not hasty with your decision or theoretical equation. There are the very foundations of quantum physics to be shaken here and possibly the solution for powerless flight to be discovered.....

Be sure to have the Rennies close at hand.....

Cat lands feet first in the hedge, loses footing and thuds onto the ground on the toast.

Cats need enough room to flip over.

Sorry, Wolf, I did warn you not to be too hasty with your reply.

You have overlooked the opposing force of the toast which will be insisting on landing butter-side down...

While your answer may apply in some instances (or will it?) - perhaps one could argue that if the slice was too small to counter the cat's insistance on landing on its feet, then the cat would, shall we say, win, but what if the slice was a large one? Or does relevant/respective size matter to such an extent....?

Ah--they did the 'butter-side down' experiment on MythBusters! The made toast, buttered it, and made a machine to drop it to the floor without bias. In their experiment, the toast actually landed butter side UP a few more times than down! I know, I couldn't believe it, either!

*can't wait to eat! Must wait until 4 o'clock! Starving!*

I heard about that too, but the problem there was that the conditions weren't being correctly reproduced. Relying on a machine to replace the human element which is so important to this conundrum quite clearly affected the results. Also the 'toast-alone' conditions are insufficient to replicate the alternative that is described, involving a feline. Let alone the possibility (which seems quite likley given the outcome) that the toast was buttered too soon allowing the butter to seep far into the toast so as to disturb the delicate balance between the two sides.

This is not a question that is really suited to practical resolution in any event, there being a live creature involved - I believe you have an organisation or body known as PETA that could be counted on to sabotage any such experimental activity. Rather, this is for careful consideration and debate where ventured outcomes are proposed and supported by logical argument, only to be countered and tested by those who cannot be swayed to accept, and think otherwise.

I would suggest that both cat and toast would disappear in a flash of quantum probabilities.

I see where you are coming from Elspode, and I think there is some merit in your deduction. However, I am more inclined to follow the ponderings of some who propose that, in fact, the cat doesn't actually reach the ground. Provided that the correct balance between cat size, toast size and butter content is achieved the cat will hover, rotating in a clockwise direction in the northern hemisphere (counter-clockwise, naturally, in the southern hemisphere) as the opposing forces counter-balance each other, and thereby also gravity.

It may precipitate a stochastic ooze.

Heaven forbid that it does, that could take days to clear up. What makes you think that this could happen anyway, given that these are such rare occurences these days....?

I took that into consideration in my equations.

Well considering the wait period for a stochastic ooze is theoretically longer than the universe has been in existance it's hard to judge when one might naturally occur, but since the quantum forces involved are supposed to result in something resembling teleportation it would make it logical that actually seeing it occur is impossible using current methods.

If "ya'll" stopped by and helped me clean the damn kitchen, you wouldn't give a damn about the toast or cat.

I'm going with the cat landing on it's feet. Now if the toast had peanut butter on it instead of butter, I might have to reconsider.

No, sorry , can't agree about the teleportation link - not with live animals and all. For teleportation you need something like an Everyman Portable Demogriphicating Alien Transportation Device although these can be quite tricky to set up, especially in the co-ordinates department.

And the likelihood of the combination of cat and toast therefore starting one of these events - given their extreme infrequency - becomes all the more difficult to accept (let alone prove). A shade more head-scratching needed, I think....

I do agree with you, but we must not overlook the fact that the introduction of peanut butter changes the whole dynamics of the event which will obviously effect the supporting equation - over to Wolf to explain I think, she seems to have a good grasp of the mathematics here, although I do have reservations regarding the 9th and 10th stages of her earlier calculations....

The whole thing is impossible.

You show me a cat that will allow you to strap anything to its back, let alone a piece of food. At best, the cat would thrash as soon as you let go of it, shaking the toast free and allowing both the cat-on-its-feet and the butter-on-the-floor outcomes.

My dog would eat the toast AND the cat long before they reached the ground.

If you put toast on BOTH sides of the cat with the butter facing the cat's body then.... uh... you'd have a cat sammich. Let's eat.

Schodinger's Cat would do a double twist in mid air, thus ridding itself of the toast, and land on its feet in the 3rd parallel universe over. The toast would land butter side down in this one.

If I know cats, and I think I do ... by the time the cat was dropped, there wouldn't be any butter left on the bread, so there wouldn't be a butter-side anymore.

T'Pau, Queen of the Universe, wishes to comment that she has performed this experiment in my kitchen several times and the answer is obvious: a cat weighing more than the slice of buttered bread will supercede any metaphysical efforts of said bread. She therefore concludes that the experiment should be attempted with a slice weighing more than her weight of 8 pounds, and she volunteers to demonstrate this. She has requested that everybody send Colombo's San Francisco Sourdough only, with cinnamon-honey butter since she is going to all this inconvenience for us :yum:

Wolf;
Good point.

So does buttered bread (either the butter itself, or the bread with butter on it) that has been licked by a cat land face side up or down?

Such dedication! Sadly anything containing honey would not be permissible as, being a bee extract, it inherantly contains gravity resistant enzymes (everyone knows that it is mathematically impossible for a bee to fly given the weight to lift ratio and the whole, well one can hardly call them dynamics but I suppose one has to, of the creature, and therefore it must achieve flight through other properties of its metabolism). This would confound the result.

Regarding the weight issue, I ask you to recall the works of the sadly passed, Sir Isaac Newton (the mere mention of his name brings a lump to my throat - such a loss, such a loss...) in honour of his name and contribution to the world of physics, please think a while, does a pebble fall any faster than a boulder?

Sorry, but I detect just the teensiest, weensiest morsel of a little fib..... I sincerely hope that the Queen of the Universe (God bless you ma'am, your regal highness whom no-one should offend - I, your humblest of servants, beg your mercy for this poor, misguided individual who clearly neither means nor meant any harm or insolence) doesn't take offence at your inference and that the rest of your life is not adversely affected. I have done what I can to help in this respect.

Clodfobble's thrashing cat and Wolf's toast-licking feline are interesting diversions, but you should neither be swayed nor influenced by such brain-controlling injections. It is just that your mind, sensing the enormity of the task placed before it to concentrate its processes so singulalry, is introducing these diversions, in a rather impish mood, I venture to add and observe.

Fight them soundly let your brain know who is in control, threaten it with the deterent (make sure you read that word properly - it is easy to see it, mistakenly, as detergent, and a sudden on-rush of soap-suds will get us nowhere - certainly not forwards, they will take an age to clear up, the toast will go all soggy and the cat will probably do a runner!) of recalled Osmond songs or, even worse, the Waltons (hope that second one hasn't offended any country folk, but I really can't believe it takes so bloody long just to say goodnight!)

I'm not sure whether you have considered pathos as a variable in your equations?

If you use the last piece of bread in the house for the toast, on the day before payday, where you have already raided the back of the sofa for coins, where you are hungry and craving toast and your kitchen floor is overdue a clean..... I think you'll find the toast will land butter side down 99.9% of the time.

Not sure how you could replicate this in your experiment though, as in order to conduct it you have to choose to waste the toast. Perhaps if you sneak into someone else's house, tie them up & force them to watch their last hot snack being commandeered in the name of Science?

I'm all for introducing varianbles, but as with any experimentation there has to be a control methodolgy as well to ensure a stable point of reference. I do like your propsal though, and, come to think of it, my neighbour HAS just acquired a cat, and it IS getting close to the end of the month. Now, if I can remember where I put that rope....

It doesn't actually matter anymore, does it?

Well then what drugs are we all on this weekend??? :D

Unless I have missed something, which is entirely possible since I am PWD, you guys are allowing for the option that the toast manages to get buttered at all...in my household, the cat will consume the butter before the toast pops out of the toaster. Said cat will fall off the kitchen counter in a fit of cholesterol OD, do the typical mid-air roll-over and land kitty-knees first.

I say let's eat the cat sammich.

Anything but turkey.

Wolf - excellent point.

:lol: :lol: :lol2: :lol2: :lol2: :lol2: :lol2: :lol2:

I haven't been here in awhile, and I missed you guys. I haven't laughed that hard since I saw a cat in a bikkini!! (I will have to post the picture when I get home)

This thread should say NSFW! My coworkers thought I was crazy with all the laughing...

By the way, if this experiment were to be performed with my kitten, Rikki Tikki Tabby, the toast would lose every time, and Rikki would land on all 4 feet. I have never met as agile a cat as Rikki or one with a greater penchant for mischief. In fact, I feel quite safe in assuring scientists everywhere that if you strapped TWO peices of buttered toast to him, he would still land on his feet with all butter mysteriously licked clean! ;)

In fact, here you go:

Note to scientists and members of PETA: Toast was allowed to cool before being placed on cat's back. Cat was also given a substantial reward of butter prior to experiment to reduce feline induced errors.

I could not get a picture of Rikki in mid-air, since the kitchen counter is the highest I feel comfortable inducing him to jump from. You will notice, however, that the toast is butter side down and Rikki is licking his paws!

Well THAT settles it!

Beautiful cat, Marichiko. :love:

CAREFUL!
PETA says paws have feelings too. ;)

I am T'Pau, Queen of the Universe. Women worship me and small rubber mice fear me.

We deign to respond to Sir France's doubts as to the validity of our experiments concerning the metaphysics of buttered toast. Although we perceive that he is a man of some erudition and has the breeding to greet us with due respect, Sir France is nonetheless not at our level. He does not leap tall entertainment centers with a single bound or see dead people, ergo his powers of observation are obviously rather limited. Whereas his inquiring mind is admirable for his species, we have a witness who observed us to halt in mid-air and precisely execute a reverse to a leap when we realized that the bathroom sink we were aiming for was full of soapy water and nylons. Our powers are awesome, it is absurd to imply that we could be bested by a mere blob of gluten, chicken embryos, and dairy byproducts. But since we are regally indifferent to anything with which the inferior species occupy themselves, we will generously overlook your limitations. Felis oblige.

As there is nothing more, we wish a cordial good evening to Sir France and his minions here present.

Hang on a minute!.... queen or no queen, let's get a few things straight:

1. I once knew a 6'3" female trapeze artist and acrobat, called Betty, who ran a one woman-show and with whom I played leap-frog regularly. Never had any trouble!

2. My best friend, whom I meet at work when we go for a drink quite often (that last word can be applied correctly both to the meeting and the drinking btw) is a mortician

3. Thanks to my wife I have several pairs of strength 2.5 glasses (spectacles that is - in case you were trying to see a connection here with the previous sentence), even though I only need strength 2.

Hasty, hasty, hasty - no wonder the universe is in the state it's- hey, wait a minute, what's that you're holding there, doesn't look very pleasant, in fact looks as though it could be quite fatal.... I sort of recognise it - what's that writing on the side. I've got a pair of 2.5's handy as it happens... just pop them on. Let me see...., hmmm, oh yeah, can just about make it out now..... 'Omega Fully Patented Spacetime Distillation Blas-'* ....... ooops!

(btw does anyone know how I can get rid of these onions that seem to be attached permanently to my right leg....?)

*

With the proper writeup, you could probably get a venture capitalist to fund that experiment.