I want tw's thoughts on...
 

...the tension between Turkey and the US, considering the potential genocide resolution and Turkish anger over the Kurds.

Thank you.

Well they're potentially days away from an invasion of Iraq... turns out, they want to fight the kurdish terrorists over there so they don't have to fight them at home.

I just want to see how he balances this: one of our strongest allies in the Middle East (particularly militarily) against a horrible atrocity committed during WW1.

1915 - GET OVER IT!
The Turks are only whiskers away from being Arabs themselves, and it shows. It's obviously the heat that sends people fruitloop.

Sigh. We may be able to civilise them if we get them in the EU, trouble is - they have to become civilised before we let them in. Catch 22.

Wolf put it in a very good way on the Bosque the other day...a way in which I hadn't thought about it:

I can understand the ire, for Armenians denying the deaths at the hands of the Turks as being genocide is like denying the Holocaust for Jews.

Apparently, 1.5 million Armenians died...that's nothing to throw a stick at. And to me, calling it a genocide just ain't that big of a deal. Look at what the Germans did to the Jews. And we love them again.

[tw]Top management determines that ME must be in rubble by a tuesday in November. Not enough to have KGB angry must be against Turkish secret police as well. Mental midgets run up score instead of kneeling with 32 seconds left.[/tw]

You left out brown shirts TW.

I still don't know what "big dic" means.

it means tw is against k's.

It's time for the Armenians, and the Jews, to get over it.

If we can tell the Armenians to "get over" the deaths of 1.5 million, and the Jews to "get over" around 6 million ... Bruce, can you tell me what it will take for the US to "be over" September 11?

This is a serious question:
when will it be "time" for the US to "get over" September 11?

I was thinking about this when I saw the recent thread of the 9-11 memorial motorbike ride.

Yes, it was shocking, a dreadful crime that killed around 3,000 people. I agree that some action was justified and necessary. Since then, we've (I say "we" despite being Australian) knocked over the Talleban, chased AQ into the caves, hanged Saddam ... are we done yet? Surely this cannot be used as a grounds for unilaterally attacking countries indefinitely.
I repeat, this is a serious question. What is it going to take for the US to give that grim nod of satisfaction, dust off the hands, and decide it has been dealt with? I guess the capture or death of Osama would be on the list ... what else?

I want to know how far this ride is going to go.

PS: I'm trying to make this as non-inflammatory as possible. Let me emphasize: I believe strong action was appropriate in response to September 11. I am asking for people to try to spell out what goals we need to achieve so that we are satisfied.

When will Australians be over the Bali bombings? Our people still flock there in droves every year to remember. Fair enough. What about when Amrosi is finally shot? Will that be enough for us do you think Zen?

Edit: Personally, I'm over it, but lots of Australians aren't. Maybe I'm over it because I didn't have anyone I loved killed there. Who knows. Maybe I just realize that you can't live in the past forever. At some point you have to start looking ahead instead.

Touche!

For me, I'm over it. The perpetrators have been caught, tried, convicted, and sentenced. I'm satisfied. I don't need to see the executions. Anyway, I'm opposed to the death penalty and would rather see life in prison. So I consider it settled. How about you?

Personally I object very strongly to Australians using the number 88 in reference to this. There were (at least) 202 people killed, of whom 88 were Australians. I've read and heard people complaining "they murdered 88 Australians". This seems to me to imply that the speaker doesn't give a damn about the 114 non-Australians.
Likewise I have read reports about an Indonesian anti-terrorist department called "Squadron 88", which was supposedly set up with Australian support, and acts without due process or proper oversight. I don't know if this is true or not and haven't been able to find out. Again, if there is such a thing, it should be called Squadron 202.
We should count people, not passports.

EDIT: Just saw your edit. Response noted.
There's a difference between remembering as we do with Gallipoli and the Somme, and being motivated to take action about it.

Yes, I consider it settled. I too am against the death penalty and would prefer to see him and his cohorts imprisoned for life however, we all know how 'secure' Indonesian prisons are, so that's the only issue I have.

I think it's terrible that people refer to the number 88. I agree that it's insensitive to the other people who were killed.

I think Bruce's remark was a misfired joke, myself. Bruce, hon, you know where the smilies page is...