The Cellar - Clearly liberals are promoting durg addiction again

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Clearly liberals are promoting durg addiction again

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in another discussion, Schrodinger's Cat wrote:
Guess this means the invasion of Canada is a "GO"!

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from The Economist of 12 Feb 2005
Little by litte, Canda is groping towards a distinctive approach to drugs, one that focuses on harm reduction rather than the repression favoured by the United States. The federal government is mulling over a bill to decriminalise possession of marijuana. North America's first trial of heroin maintenance- givinga ddicts free heroin on condition that they accept treatment- got under way on February 10th in Vancouver. Later this spring, it will expand to Toronto and Montreal.

An otherwise idyllic city, Vancourver has the worst drug problem in Canada. For years, addiction has been rising, and with it gang killings, violent robberies, and break-ins. In 2002, fed-up citizens swept in a reformist city council dedicated to an alternative drug strategy, resting on "four pillars": harm reduction, treatment, enforcement, and prevention.

Its first move was to open North America's first safe heroin-injection site, a pilot project which, it is claimed, is curbing disease and deaths among addicts. Now comes the North American Opiate Medication Initiative (NAOMI), a two year C$8m study funded by the Canadian Institutes of Health Research, a federal agency. In the three cities, the project will enrol 470 "treatment-resistant" addicts (meaning they have been addicted for at least five years and have at least twice had treatment without success). Half will receive methadone, an artificial opiate; the others will get a daily injection of heroin. After a year, those who have not broken their drug habit will be referred for further treatment. ...

One aim is to determine whether heroin maintenance, which is used in Switzerland and the Netherlands, will work in North America. ...

Researchers in three American cities were keen to take part in the study found it too controversial for them to obtain funding.

don't do durgs, mmmmkay? durgs are bad, mmmkay?

Actually, the reason I think we should invade Canada is to obtain universal health insurance! :p

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Originally Posted by Schrodinger's Cat

Actually, the reason I think we should invade Canada is to obtain universal health insurance!

The new American way. We no longer innovate to solve problems. Instead, we send in the military to take it.

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Originally Posted by Schrodinger's Cat

Actually, the reason I think we should invade Canada is to obtain universal health insurance! :p

And cheaper prescription drugs!

Maybe we can force them to take GWB as prime minister in exchange for Paul Edgar Philippe Martin as president.

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Originally Posted by richlevy

And cheaper prescription drugs!

Maybe we can force them to take GWB as prime minister in exchange for Paul Edgar Philippe Martin as president.

Nah, I think we should just send Junior to N. Korea in exchange for a micro-wave machine. Or possibly a WMD - whichever they can most spare.

Canadian health care sucks.

Socialism sucks.

Canada's tax system sucks.

Canada's military sucks.

Canadian weed, however, does not suck.

And how many miracle drugs that America bashing Americans take for granted are actually invented in Canada?

You guys crack me up.

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Originally Posted by Beestie

No Canadian goes without needed medical treatment. 43 million or so Americans do.

What does socialism have to do with Canada? The last I heard, they were capitalist just like the US.

Canada's military has not just lost over 1,000 of its members fighting a war of questionable legality. Nor could the highest-ranking Canadian Generals potentially face a war crimes tribunal in The Hague. American Generals could. The Canadian military acquitted itself with great honor in the last major engagement Canada was involved in - WWII. Perhaps you feel the need to go give them pointers drawn from the US Vietnam or Iraqi experiences?

Keep smoking that Canadian weed. Apparently, it does wonders for your analytical abilities as well as your respect for one of the US's closest allies. In fact, why don't you visit Toronto, toke up, and make your sentiments re Canada known to its citizens in person? I'm betting that our Canadian friends are starting to lose their sense of humor about now. The experiment should prove interesting for you.

Do you know how many life-saving drugs are available in Canada that aren't in the US?

Are you on crack?

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Originally Posted by Schrodinger's Cat

No Canadian goes without needed medical treatment.

That comment clearly indicates that you, sir, are the Cellar crackhead. In theory (which, apparently, is all you understand), no Canadian is "denied" healthcare. In practice, however, the quality is abysmal for the poor and the wait time for needed treatment and surgery can be debilitating if not life threatening.

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Originally Posted by Schrodinger's Cat

What does socialism have to do with Canada?

Ohhh, nothing. Nothing at all.

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The Canadian military acquitted itself with great honor in the last major engagement Canada was involved in - WWII.

I sure as hell don't need a lecture from the likes of you about the valor of Canadian military veterans past and present. My comment addresses the fact that Canada's military is practically if not definitely the most underfunded military in the civilized world. It can barely function.

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Keep smoking that Canadian weed... In fact, why don't you visit Toronto, toke up, and make your sentiments re Canada known to its citizens in person?

I don't smoke weed. The original post was about weed. It was a joke. Half my family lives in Toronto and none of them smoke it either. My information comes first hand from the Canadian media and from Canadian citizens. I spend enough time in Toronto to know the difference between theory and practice. Oh, and my wife's best friend is a practicing physician in Toronto. But, I'm sure you know volumes more than she does.

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Do you know how many life-saving drugs are available in Canada that aren't in the US?

Ok. You finally landed one.

And I find it truly ironic how much you defend all things Canadian while bashing all things American. Instead of telling me to "get to know Canada better", maybe you should climb down out of that ivory tower you live in and get to know your own country better. Or at least appreciate it enough not to despise it. And maybe it is you who should spend more time in Canada. It appears to me that everything you know about it comes from having your nose buried in a book about it and is completely void of personal experience.

You're talking out your ass.

Unless you've lived here and been a member of the Canadian military (as I have) and understand what its purpose is, stop spouting opinion as fact.

I'm a Canadian and have spent significant time in the US. I'll take Canadian health care any day.

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Originally Posted by Silent

Unless you've lived here and been a member of the Canadian military (as I have) and understand what its purpose is, stop spouting opinion as fact....I'm a Canadian and have spent significant time in the US. I'll take Canadian health care any day.

I haven't made one claim regarding the Canadian military or the Canadian health care system that I have not heard repeatedly while in Canada made by Canadians either to me personally or in Canadian media outlets.

But, if its facts you want, have at 'em....

Canada spends a paltry 1.1% of its GDP on the military which ranks it 137th out of 167 industrialized countries behind such military powerhouses as Niger, Mali, Madagascar, Camaroon and Togo. <table x:str="" style="border-collapse: collapse; width: 105pt;" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="140"> <col style="width: 105pt;" width="140"><tbody><tr style="height: 11.25pt;" height="15"></tr> </tbody></table> <table x:str="" style="border-collapse: collapse; width: 105pt;" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="140"> <col style="width: 105pt;" width="140"><tbody></tbody></table> <table x:str="" style="border-collapse: collapse; width: 105pt;" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="140"> <col style="width: 105pt;" width="140"><tbody><tr style="height: 11.25pt;" height="15"></tr> </tbody></table>

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Canada's military has withered so thoroughly the country is practically defenceless, according to a study released yesterday by the C.D. Howe Institute.

"Whether Canadians realize it or not, Canada is now all but undefended at a time of danger," Dr. Jack Granatstein writes for the institute.

...
Dr. Granatstein outlines in detail the woes that have befallen the Canadian military under successive governments since the 1960s. He said army units are operating at roughly half-strength, warships are kept in dock for want of trained sailors to run them and the air force is short of pilots and still years away from replacing its 1960s-vintage Sea King helicopters.

Dr. Granatstein is a noted York University historian and chairman of the Council for Canadian Security in the 21st Century, a non-partisan group based in Calgary that advocates a greater government emphasis on defence. Link to source

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Originally Posted by CIA Factbook

Canada's paramount political problem is meeting public demands for quality improvements in health care and education services after a decade of budget cuts.

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Long the shining beacon for the American Left, the grand example of successful socialism on North American soil, the Canadian health care system is falling apart, or so says David Gratzer in Code Blue: Revising Canada's Health Care System.

Dr. Gratzer is a journalist and recent graduate of the University of Manitoba's medical school. Canada's system, known as "Medicare," is run by provincial governments and paid for by a combination of provincial and national funds. Co-payments are not allowed, nor are people allowed to go outside the system and pay for services directly (unless one leaves the country).

The system is plagued, Gratzer writes, by long waiting lists of sick patients, overcrowded hospitals, second-rate equipment, and a stream of doctors, nurses and patients fleeing to the United States. He documents these woes not only with a host of health care horror stories from Canadian newspapers, but with a long list of studies, both official and private.

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Canada spends a paltry 1.1% of its GDP on the military

Am I the only one that thinks that's a good thing? Really?

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Originally Posted by jaguar

Am I the only one that thinks that's a good thing? Really?

You are, of course, entitled to your opinion. That's also about what Switzerland spends (1.1% of GDP/$310 per capita). But, the point is not only that Canada spends less than $10B/annually on its military but also that it is not enough simply to keep its troops and equipment in "ready to deploy" mode. France, by comparison, spends 2.6% of its GDP on its military ($663 per capita) and France isn't exactly posturing for war.

So the real problem it seems is that Canada wants a large military (as evidenced by its materiel and manpower inventory) yet it is not willing to commit to fund it to keep it operational. That is the point I was making.

If Canada wants to downsize its military to a size commenserate with its budgetary allotment then no one outside of Canada really has any right to question it. I would suspect, for example, that I would be hard pressed to find one molecule of rust on any peice of equipment in the entire inventory of Switzerland's military or any soldier who lacks the proper training or any machine without skilled and able-bodied operators. All that says is that Switerland's military budget "matches" its desired military strength. Such is far from the case in Canada. And there is a lot of concurrance with that assertion coming from within Canada's own borders.

I was wondering myself who Canada is defenseless from. Military is useless against terrorism, no nation with an army is going to attack Canada, and Canada isn't interested in attacking other countries.

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Originally Posted by Happy Monkey

I was wondering myself who Canada is defenseless from.

The United States. Read the link.

And terrorism is not the only issue. Canada has 20% of the world's fresh water supply. Not a big deal today but....