girl was stoned to death for loving the wrong boy

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by Kitsune

They don't do it but it is fair, then, to condemn the book that states that is what should be done?

Where does it state in the Bible that we should do that? The Old testament is out, except for Jews. That's a history of their doings, but I don't see them doing that now.

The bible says many things, describes many customs and remedies for social ills that were applied at the time. There are plenty of sections of the Bible that are all kissy, lovey, forgive everyone, too.

But the Moslems still practice these atrocities by social custom and the interpretations by their clerics of the Koran. What does that have to do with the Bible?

[Kitsune]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

The Old testament is out, except for Jews.

Well, plenty of people I've spoken with say Matthew 5:17 proves that statement wrong.

Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.

I'm no biblical scholar, though, so I wouldn't know. This is the passage often used in defense of the actions and beliefs of the more "hard line" believers.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by Kitsune

Well, plenty of people I've spoken with say Matthew 5:17 proves that statement wrong.



I'm no biblical scholar, though, so I wouldn't know. This is the passage often used in defense of the actions and beliefs of the more "hard line" believers.

Hello... he was talking to the Jews, telling them he wasn't going to spoil their party and they could do as they had in the past. And he didn't change the Jewish religion.

[Spexxvet]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

...The Old testament is out, except for Jews. ...

Where do you get that idea? Christianity is based on the old testament.

I'm disgusted when people take what suits them from their religion and dump the rest.

[jinx]

Yeah.... what do you mean out? It's the same god regardless. I mean, I realize there are 3 of him, but its still the same god. So, either god thinks stoning is a good idea - or god used to think stoning was a good idea but changed his mind. Which is it?

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by jinx

Yeah.... what do you mean out? It's the same god regardless. I mean, I realize there are 3 of him, but its still the same god. So, either god thinks stoning is a good idea - or god used to think stoning was a good idea but changed his mind. Which is it?

What part of ancient Jewish history that has no bearing on anyone today don't you understand? Nothing in the Old testament is rules for Christians or moslems, nothing. And the Jews have pretty well relegated it to a record of their trials and tribulations.

It's amazing so many people harp on the Bible when they have no clue about how it is structured or applies to different groups. You've been watching too many old movies where the one suspendered, one tooth, moron says, "The Bible says an eye for an eye". Yes it does, so fucking what? It doesn't apply to you or me, or anyone else today. That's Hollywood, get over it.

[jinx]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

What part of ancient Jewish history that has no bearing on anyone today don't you understand? Nothing in the Old testament is rules for Christians or moslems, nothing. And the Jews have pretty well relegated it to a record of their trials and tribulations.

It's amazing so many people harp on the Bible when they have no clue about how it is structured or applies to different groups. You've been watching too many old movies where the one suspendered, one tooth, moron says, "The Bible says an eye for an eye". Yes it does, so fucking what? It doesn't apply to you or me, or anyone else today. That's Hollywood, get over it.

Ok, so help me get a clue here Bruce. Are you saying that christians believe the old testament wasn't the word of god? That doesn't make any sense to me. You're saying that the stories of Noah, Cain & Abel, Lott, Adam & Eve, etc... aren't taught as truth in christian sunday schools?

Doesn't really matter for my question though - I'm asking more about the god than the followers.

So, either god thinks stoning is a good idea - or god used to think stoning was a good idea but changed his mind. Which is it?

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by jinx

Ok, so help me get a clue here Bruce. Are you saying that christians believe the old testament wasn't the word of god? That doesn't make any sense to me. You're saying that the stories of Noah, Cain & Abel, Lott, Adam & Eve, etc... aren't taught as truth in christian Sunday schools?

Doesn't really matter for my question though - I'm asking more about the god than the followers.

Look at a Bible, there are no chapters. The Bible is a collection of books, a library. Books that were written by different people over hundreds of years, and apply to a particular group at a particular time. The earliest were written many hundreds or even thousands of years after the fact. Written down oral histories of the Jewish tribes and what they perceived to be their relationship with God was.... which was on again, off again. Until the covenant was finally broken for good.

So Jesus comes along and offers a new deal to everyone, but even this wasn't written down for many years after because it was illegal. That new deal consisted of one commandment, not instructions on your day to day.

You can't put the Bible together into one continuous story, it's many stories, and most points of view expressed in any book have a diametrically opposed point of view in a different book. To quote a chapter/verse and say that's that is silly, because somewhere else it will say something else that doesn't agree or directly contradicts.

If you read the whole bible you still will have questions. The Bible scholars have wrestled with translations and interpretations forever. You can take it or leave it. It's called free will. But I still believe, "Love thy neighbor as thy self", is a good message and worthy of anyones consideration as a personal goal. I don't believe any group should be judged by the extremists every group has, or condemning the whole group unjustly.

Look at Wolfs thread about the wacko football fan. Does that mean all football fans should be condemned? Of course not, except Dallas fans.

[jinx]

I agree that the golden rule is a good one.... but why do you need all the rest of the crap in the bible to go along with it? All the rest of the stuff that seems to cause so much trouble in the world. Do unto others is much older and more universal than the christian bible.
As far as condeming others - I strongly agree with something Beestie said in a thread you started Bruce; Lawyers.... Yuk. Just exchange laywer for christian (or any other religious person for that matter).

Originally Posted by Beestie

Some smart guy a while back said something to the effect that: all that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing.

So all the Good Lawyers who fail to reign in their unethical professional colleagues are, in my opinion, just as guilty. I mean, if anybody can make it hard for someone to do something its a lawyer. So the inaction of the so-called Good Lawyers is especially troublesome.

Until the good ones step up to the plate and enforce their own code of ethics then they might just as well be bad. Which brings us back to Bruce's original point.