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Current Events Help understand the world by talking about things happening in it |
View Poll Results: Do you support saving the US auto companies with tax payer money? | |||
I support saving any one or all of them. | 1 | 3.13% | |
I support assisting them for a limited time with a limited amount. | 11 | 34.38% | |
I don't support saving them. | 19 | 59.38% | |
I have another plan to save them from certain death (explain below) | 1 | 3.13% | |
Voters: 32. You may not vote on this poll |
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11-29-2008, 03:41 PM | #181 |
halve your cake and eat it too.
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Georgia.. by way of Lawrence Kansas
Posts: 1,359
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the whole thing stinks.. no one was tried to 'bail out' bennigans when they closed and 20+thousand food service workers got canned.. fuck 'em they should have seen this coming years ago. Isn't that what they pay the high-muckity-mucks multimillion dollar salaries for? geez.. I saw this coming..and when the last little news blurb about them not wanting to produce smaller more efficient cars in favor of the more expensive and higher profit trucks and suvs'... I don't know.. I've never bought a new car and if I can help it I never will. here's my little idea. offer a deal to one of the 'big 3' and the first one to jump lives.. the others can fend for themselves.. the deal is that the company has to sell all of their vehicles at a 1% profit margin(to repay the debt over god knows how many years), be subject to intense accountability where a non-profit company (ideally a german or japanese efficiency/quality control company)will scrutinize every little damn dime.. as well as hold employees accountable for their actions (the thing in the industry in which I work.. if you can't do the job.. and do it well... BLAM! you're canned so fast it'll make your head spin. then again I have stayed away from the corporate segments because they encourage (thru inaction) laziness, incompetence and a profound lack of..of.. just caring about your job..pride in your work? ) and produce cars people actually want and can afford.. the new volkswagen if you will.. anywhoo.. that's ,my little bit..
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no my child.. this is not my desire..I'm digging for fire. Last edited by cowhead; 11-29-2008 at 03:46 PM. Reason: anyway.. rambling again |
11-29-2008, 07:46 PM | #182 |
“Hypocrisy: prejudice with a halo”
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Savannah, Georgia
Posts: 21,393
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Beeigans sucks.
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Anyone but the this most fuked up President in History in 2012! |
11-30-2008, 01:27 PM | #183 |
“Hypocrisy: prejudice with a halo”
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Location: Savannah, Georgia
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We have seen a number of large dealarships start to close their doors. I think this only the beginning.
Auto Dealerships Teeter as Big Three Decline http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/30/bu.../30dealer.html
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Anyone but the this most fuked up President in History in 2012! |
11-30-2008, 03:07 PM | #184 |
barely disguised asshole, keeper of all that is holy.
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 23,401
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I think there are too many of them too. The strong shall survive the weak and poorly run will disappear. Natural selection - simple as that.
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11-30-2008, 07:31 PM | #185 |
Read? I only know how to write.
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Posts: 11,933
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Consumer Reports noted a need to eliminate dealers long ago - maybe in early 1990s. I don’t remember the numbers – maybe 20,000 dealers reduced to 7,000. Also expected to eliminate so many dealers were direct car sales via the internet and publication of dealer prices from the manufacturer. Consumer Reports routinely advocated buying a car at manufacturer's cost plus a few hundred because dealers (should) bring so little value to a sale.
Indeed, those who have prospered most in the auto industry were dealers. Ironically, GM would punish troublesome executives (ie those who advocated better quality) with an early retirement and an opportunity to quit the company by owning a dealership. |
11-30-2008, 09:20 PM | #186 |
“Hypocrisy: prejudice with a halo”
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This was interesting. From Boortz.
HAVE YOU SEEN THIS VIDEO? By Neal Boortz @ November 26, 2008 8:21 AM Permalink | Comments (44) | TrackBacks (0) We got dozens of emails yesterday to Nealz Nuze saying that I must see this video about a Ford plant. Okay you are probably thinking "big deal, Boortz." But if you watch the video it explains how Ford has created a new, innovative manufacturing plant that streamlines production and makes operations much more efficient. They can make 5 different types of vehicles at this plant. It does this by allowing Ford suppliers to be integrated into the assembly line process. So the suppliers making the seats, the dashboards, the fuel systems ... they have assembly lines right inside the Ford factory. Makes sense, rather than relying on shipments of parts. No waiting. No shipment costs or delays. Oh but there is one thing I forgot to tell you. This Ford plant is in Brazil. Yep. And do you know why it is in Brazil? Unions. The UAW is opposed to this type of innovative manufacturing. They are opposed to innovation that would actually help their employer because they stand the risk of losing jobs. And if they lose jobs, they lose power. I'm sure another reason, although it doesn't say it in the video, is tax rates. But that's a whole other issue. http://boortz.com/nealz_nuze/2008/11...his-video.html
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12-01-2008, 12:33 AM | #187 |
The future is unwritten
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What I get from that video is the parts are not made there, but shipped in and assembled into sub-assemblies, by these vendors. There is no reason why Ford couldn't use the exact same plant, and have Ford employees do the sub-assemblies. The innovation is in the design of the vehicles that allow that assembly system, and the design of the facilities that make it possible.
Oh, and the biggest innovation is someone running the show that doesn't have their head up their ass.
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12-01-2008, 03:20 AM | #188 | |
Read? I only know how to write.
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Quote:
Cars were assembled from many individual parts all attached to one frame, one part at a time. Drop an engine into that frame somewhere during assembly. Even the very first Hondas did it differently. For example, engine, front suspension, steering, and drive train were assembled elsewhere, merged into a sub assembly, and then pushed up from underneath the car in one integrated assembly - that even eliminated wheel alignment. (By this point, everyone should understand why an engineer designed car never needs wheel alignment.) Even dashboards were designed and installed as a complete assembly rather than assembled part by part inside vehicle frames. When GM did this (only because everyone else was already doing it), well, the world had long moved on to other innovative assembly processes. Therefore GM, et al had what (according to The Economist in 2002)? Only 3% ROI. Described above was how suppliers delivered parts directly to the assembly line. Twenty years later, GM addressed the same problem using part delivery robots - throwing money at a problem rather than fixing the problem. About the same time, car companies without bean counter management had now advanced to whole subassemblies delivered 'just in time'. That Boortz video simply describes it; what was well known even six years ago even in The Economist on 21 Feb 2002. It’s not about outside suppliers. It’s about integrating whole assemblies long before the final assembly plant. Performing assembly work in parallel; not in series. And it's about working as a team with suppliers; not beating them up and down. What was GM’s solution? Well the Chevy sold in Thailand is actually made by someone else in Korea. GM management solved the manufacturing problem by having someone else to do all innovating. But that is really all that a MBA manager understands. Paying bills and selling something. Rather than innovate, GM used grossly overpriced SUVs to mask 1968 technology engines and obsolete manufacturing methods. GM's problems are very old, known, and ignored. Boortz video manufacturing methods were international standards - innovation kept out of America by business school manager using cost controls. What was necessary to make that innovation possible? W E Deming taught this stuff to Japan in the 1950s. Only MBA management beats on employees and suppliers like they were the enemy. The solution is not about having outsiders assemble cars or blaming the unions. It's about having suppliers provide what is necessary on the assembly line as even exampled here on 18 November. Who asked a silly question of why tw hates MBAs? Common knowledge makes that contempt obvious. Boortz video only demonstrates that MBAs (like George Jr) stifle solutions for 20 years. Boortz video does not say it. But the Boortz video again demonstrates that Americans are finally doing today what was innovative 20 years ago. A boss who stifles innovation must then blame unions, unfair competition, legacy costs, government, environmental laws, greedy suppliers, fuel economy standards, tax structures, the education system ... everything but the few grossly overpaid executives who are 99% responsible for those problems. Boortz video demonstrates what can happen once suppliers are trusted – no longer the greedy enemy. |
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12-01-2008, 08:47 PM | #189 |
“Hypocrisy: prejudice with a halo”
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Savannah, Georgia
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tw = letter bomber = Theodore John Kaczynski.
I have a Manefesto. Hear me Roar!
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12-02-2008, 04:24 PM | #191 |
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Now wait just a damn minute. It is a well know fact that 85% of all problems are directly traceable to top management. Google it if you don't believe me.
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12-02-2008, 04:29 PM | #192 |
trying hard to be a better person
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I thought it was only 76%...
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12-02-2008, 06:50 PM | #193 |
Read? I only know how to write.
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85% of all problems are directly traceable to top management. And when management says there is plenty of blame to go around, then 99% of problems are directly traceable to that manager. Any decent manager knows who is responsible. The most irresponsible (or ignorant - same thing) managers want to blame others or just call it an accident.
Meanwhile, post #188 demonstrates how much one need know to understand how anti-innovative GM has been. Whereas the Boortz video shows a ‘new’ production method, The Economist Feb 2002 articles says those manufacturing techniques were standard in both Europe and Japan even many years earlier. What the Boortz commentary forget to mention: just another example of how much innovation has so long been stifled by MBAs – or why patriotic Americans who believe in free markets have been buying foreign cars. In my inventory are so many more examples of why GM has been making so many crappy products for 30 years. Facts that get lost where fools promote ‘buy American’ or recommended GM products. TheMercenary’s Boortz video simply forgets to mention that the innovative manufacturing techniques were being used 10 and 20 years earlier where top management are car guys. It demonstrates why GM cannot fix itself until Rick Wagoner is removed. In his case, 99% of all problems are directly traceable to … a man who did more to destroy America than Saddam Hussein. |
12-02-2008, 07:50 PM | #194 |
changed his status to single
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In all seriousness, what to you get out of your endless diatribes against gm?
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12-02-2008, 08:48 PM | #195 |
barely disguised asshole, keeper of all that is holy.
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We need a poll to see how many people actually read post #188. I for one am curious. Are there cliff notes available?
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