Middle East erupts

[Trilby]

Of all the depressing things--the Boing Boing link Kitsune provided to the nuts waiting to be raptured is the most depressing.

[glatt]

For a reminder on just how sanitized US mass media is, go to Flickr, and do a tag search for Lebanon. Some pretty horrific images. Only do the search if you are numb to pictures of dead kids in rubble.

I know Israel's philosophy has always been to strike back 10 fold or more, but it's amazing how Lebanon civilians are really taking a beating.

Makes it hard for me to sympathize much with Israel. Ally or not.

[JayMcGee]

Both the beeb and ITN have been showing the kids with shrapnel wounds all over them..... ITN claimed tonight that 1/3rd of fatalaties on both sides are children. Are you getting this in the US?

[Undertoad]

I get it perfectly, Jay.

By the way, Saudi clerics are harder on Hisballah than you are

[JayMcGee]

I'm harder on the IDF than on Hezbollah......

I'm kinda intrigued though by the american mindset that can condemm Hezbollah yet fund the IRA.

[tw]

In the meantime, innocent Maronites, Shi'ites, and Druze are murdered because Israel blames everyone else - and somehow that murder of the innocents is justified as if protecting Jews. Clearly they are also evil only because they live in the same region.

How to end it? For every arab murdered, also murder a jew. Make sure that every race suffers in equal numbers. Even better, smuggle arms to all parties. Guess what. Extremists are not so smart anymore.

This conflict will not end until as least 10% from all sides are murdered. The more gross those deaths, then the better. Sorry. But history demonstrates this is the only way to drive intelligent people from the ranks of extremists. Make sure all arms are distributes so that deaths are equal on all sides. The faster we murder, then the faster peace will happen.

Shameful that no one even in the US Congress has any respect for the innocent citizens of Lebanon. But then America is no longer an honest broker. It is no accident that George Jr destroyed the Oslo Accords.

[Trilby]

Originally Posted by JayMcGee

american mindset that can condemm Hezbollah yet fund the IRA.

I always found that to be a problem, too. When Bush said there's a war on terror, I immediately wondered when the US was going to invade Ireland and fight the IRA...

[Aliantha]

Originally Posted by MaggieL

"Semantics" isn't an argument. Semantics is the study of the meaning of words; if "semantics" is a reason to dismiss an argument then there's no point in arguing.

It is semantics to question the 'usage' of a particular word when the actual word in isolation has naught to do with the actual message which was that Hezbollah is a legitimate political party in Lebanon.

BTW, if you felt your argument was being dismissed I'm sorry about that. What is your argument?

[Aliantha]

Brianna...I wondered the same thing.

[Undertoad]

Headline: Hezbollah leader apologizes for attack's child victims

But not all children:

Hezbollah leader Sheik Hassan Nasrallah apologized for an attack that killed two Israeli Arab children in northern Israel, saying the youngsters were "martyrs for Palestine."

In a Thursday interview with Arabic-language news network Al-Jazeera, Nasrallah accepted responsibility for the Wednesday attack, while conceding that an apology to the family was not sufficient.

In a later interview, Nasrallah said, "OK, we weren't supposed to totally admit that we really only want to kill Jews, so to keep the world's 'anti-zionist' story straight. But in all this confusion, we just plum forgot. Hey it was Al-Jazeera, so the infidels weren't supposed to notice anyway. Thanks to CNN for at least correcting the mistake in the headline."

[MaggieL]

Originally Posted by Aliantha

It is semantics to question the 'usage' of a particular word when the actual word in isolation has naught to do with the actual message which was that Hezbollah is a legitimate political party in Lebanon.

BTW, if you felt your argument was being dismissed I'm sorry about that. What is your argument?

If the actual message was that Hezbollah is a political party (not at all what was said), then I have no argument; having run candidates it is obviously a political party.

If the actual message was that it was a branch of government (which would seem to be the meaning of what was said), then I call bullshit; it is no such thing.

If the actual message was that it's "legitimate" (which seems to be the intended spin: to cast Hezbollah as something somehow "legitimate" rather than a gang of terrorists), then we come back to:

Originally Posted by Maggiel

Then what would constitute an *illigitimate* political party? Foreign funding?

Are you so anxious to hang the (as far as I can see undeserved) "legitimate" tag on them that what noun the adjective modifies has become unimportant "semantics"?

[MaggieL]

Originally Posted by Brianna

I always found that to be a problem, too. When Bush said there's a war on terror, I immediately wondered when the US was going to invade Ireland and fight the IRA...

According to the IRA, the UK had already done that, no?

[Aliantha]

Whether the party is legitimate or not doesn't negate their illegal actions, so no, I'm not anxious to hang the tag on them. The legitimacy of Hezbollah doesn't change the number of lives that've been lost due to their actions, nor does it change the course of events which has surely changed history, especially if what has been reported here is true in that the US is funding/supplying Israel during the course of these events.

Considering that Hezbollah is, if not officially then certainly unofficially, supported by the likes of Iran and Syria, I would say that this will legitimize the US intent to drop something on Iran sooner or later during the course of this conflict, which of course, would enable the Bush government to feel quite justified I'm sure.

With this thought in mind, I'd suggest that Hezbollah has played straight into the hands of the US government.

[tw]

Originally Posted by Aliantha

Whether the party is legitimate or not doesn't negate their illegal actions, so no, I'm not anxious to hang the tag on them.

Which is really quite irrelevant. Hezbollah exists only because of Sharon's 'consolidation of positions' all the way to Beruit, the massacre of 5000 Palestinians arranged by Sharon, and the resulting Lebanon civil war. Hezbollah was created by Lebanonese as the only defense that Lebanon had against Israel. Hezbollah simply has not changed its founding and strategic objectives. An example of how one creates its own enemies.

They don't talk to one another. Therefore war is the only alternative. Make it real bad. Make the losses on all sides equal and high. Only then will parties in dispute finally decide that maybe talk (conducted by empowered centrists) is the only intelligent alternative. Currently everyone directly involved - including the US - only wants war. Don't fool yourself. Everyone is operating with illegal motives. Everyone directly involved only wants war - and is looking for cover to justify that war.

Originally Posted by glatt

For a reminder on just how sanitized US mass media is, go to Flickr, and do a tag search for Lebanon. Some pretty horrific images. Only do the search if you are numb to pictures of dead kids in rubble.

I know Israel's philosophy has always been to strike back 10 fold or more, but it's amazing how Lebanon civilians are really taking a beating.

Makes it hard for me to sympathize much with Israel. Ally or not.

All they had to do was give the soldiers back.