Republicans find proof of voter fraud in Florida - Page 2

classicman · 10-09-2012, 12:09 AM

As for the fraud in Florida ... Who reported it?
The Republicans.

orthodoc · 10-09-2012, 06:53 AM

Umm, yeah ... why are people pointing fingers and claiming Republican voter fraud? They (the local Republicans) hired a company to do a legitimate job (sign up unregistered voters), then outed and fired them when they turned in fraudulent voter registration lists. What's the problem?

I agree with Bruce - in my experience working poll booths in a heavily Democratic town (back when I was a registered Republican - now I'm an Independent), all the election officials were Democrats. Fine, except they refused to work within the rules. There was immense hostility to the 2 of us Republican observers even turning up (they hadn't had to cope with our bothersome presence for some years, having run off Repub volunteers previously). I'm not accusing them of voter fraud, but procedures weren't followed and the local judge and inspector of elections didn't care. I think voter fraud is far more common than arrest and conviction stats show. Just like taking office supplies home.

footfootfoot · 10-09-2012, 08:51 AM

When I was a Democrat I would show up at the polls and routinely the Republican poll workers couldn't find my name on the rolls, directed me to the wrong district, etc. I changed my registration to Republican and since then I've had no trouble at the polls. Funny that.

I don't really see the point of registering anyway. It's not like the primaries matter. It's bad enough we have a two party system, but the choices within either party are Hobson's choice.

Stormieweather · 10-09-2012, 09:12 AM

Heh. Yeah, that's what the Republicans are running around telling everyone..."we discovered and reported it". Bull.

Cheryl Johnson, Lee County's voter registration director, noticed irregularities and asked for an explanation from Strategic Allied Consulting (and actually met with them and a Republican official), who never got back to her with a response. She notified law enforcement. After the media broke the story, the RNC fired SAC and "reported" it to election officials.

To top it all off, the founder of SAC, Nathan Sproul, is notorious for having done the EXACT SAME THING back in 2004 (changing registrations, ripping up Democratic registrations, etc). He told the LA Times he was specifically asked by the RNC to create Strategic Allied Consulting in order to distance themselves from his previous actions. Clearly, they knew who and what they were hiring. And why.

LA Times

I really hate when the truth gets twisted around.

orthodoc · 10-09-2012, 09:32 AM

Fair enough. We all have our experiences with polls and local political parties, and it's not news that political misbehavior gets misreported. Neither party has the corner on it; they both stink enough that I refuse to have anything to do with either anymore.

eta - thanks for the extra info, Stormie. And foot3 - yep, Hobson's choice. As for primaries, don't even get me started. During the time I was registered, the candidate had always been decided on before PA got to vote. There wasn't even the insult of a Hobson's choice.

Spexxvet · 10-09-2012, 09:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by orthodoc

Fair enough. We all have our experiences with polls and local political parties, and it's not news that political misbehavior gets misreported. Neither party has the corner on it; they both stink enough that I refuse to have anything to do with either anymore.

Um... I've never run across a report like this about the Bull Moose party, or the The Rent is Too Damn High party. But those Whigs ....

Stormieweather · 10-09-2012, 10:33 AM

I agree, Orthodoc. Neither party is without blemish or misbehavior.

But I don't think this excuses whitewashing or manipulating the facts. By either party. I'm an intelligent person, just give the the facts and I'll decide where to go from there.

footfootfoot · 10-09-2012, 03:48 PM

Whitewashing the facts? Oh. I thought you said fence.

Adak · 10-11-2012, 07:22 AM

Let's mention the hot case in Voter Fraud in Minnesota.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/billfrez...-to-reduce-it/

Democrat Al Franken won his senate seat, by a mere 312 votes, out of 3 million+ votes cast. Now, there are 243 people who have been convicted, or charged with voter fraud in this election.

If Al Franken had lost the election, then Obama's health care bill would not have passed.

Al Gore lost the Presidential election because he lost the state of Florida. He lost Florida by less than 500 votes.
Damn right voter fraud is an important issue!

BigV · 10-11-2012, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adak

snip--

If Al Franken had lost the election, then Obama's health care bill would not have passed.

--snip

Well, of course you have zero evidence to support such a scary fantasy, but you do clearly point out the absolute intransigence of the Republicans in Congress. They had every opportunity to back this winner, but they chose instead to abdicate their sworn duty to do the best for the country and instead stood in opposition to both their President and the good of the country in the interest of ideological purity.

They could have compromised, but they didn't. They *chose* to exclude themselves.

ZenGum · 10-11-2012, 07:16 PM

Dear America,

WTF is wrong with you idiots?
You let registered members of political parties staff the bloody ballot station and run the sodding election???
That's like leaving John Dillinger in charge of the cash box, or letting Wall Street regulate itself. (... oh, wait...)

OK, listen up and take notes. There will be a test.

Elections are to be run by the ~~Australian~~American Electoral Commission, hereafter AEC. The AEC only employs citizens who are not, and have not been for five years, a member of a political party.

The AEC begins by setting electorate boundaries, keeping them all about the same population, trying to keep them roughly convex in shape, and IGNORING ("let the chips fall where they may") the political interests involved in doing this.

The AEC creates the electoral rolls. All adults' names are on a list somewhere, and when you vote, your name gets marked. Afterwards, these are checked to make sure everyone voted once and once only.

The AEC is in total control of the ballot station: queuing to vote, name checking, ballot issuing and collecting, security, and counting.
All registered political parties (yeah, I know ... both of them) are entitled to have properly accredited observers inside the polling place, during set-up (to check the ballot boxes are empty at the start), all day, and during counting ... but they are not allowed to touch a bloody thing nor approach any voters. If they have concerns, they call one of the officials.

Party members are allowed outside the poling place, but not within six metres (twenty of your quaint "feet") of any entrance or window. This is where they display their banners and offer last minute "how to vote for us" cards.

Any questions?

It's not bloody rocket surgery, people. A high school civics class could have come up with this.

Love,

Cousin Australia

P.S. Say hi to Canada for us, thanks.

Adak · 10-11-2012, 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigV

Well, of course you have zero evidence to support such a scary fantasy, but you do clearly point out the absolute intransigence of the Republicans in Congress. They had every opportunity to back this winner, but they chose instead to abdicate their sworn duty to do the best for the country and instead stood in opposition to both their President and the good of the country in the interest of ideological purity.

They could have compromised, but they didn't. They *chose* to exclude themselves.

Just Google it, BigV - it's not a fantasy, it's been reported in many newspapers and magazines, and the court documents in the convictions for voter fraud, are public records.

We did not CHOOSE to have anyone from either party, commit voter fraud.

Are the facts not good enough to convince you?

orthodoc · 10-11-2012, 07:29 PM

*waves hand* Can I come live in Australia? Pretty please?? I've been swept off my feet by the magnificent logic of your electoral practices.

P.S. Thanks, Canada says hi back. Incidentally, Canada's electoral/voting practices are just as messed up as America's. Different details, same result.

Adak · 10-11-2012, 07:36 PM

Hey ZenGum,

It's a special American disease I believe. It's either:

* We truly believe everybody is pure as the driven snow, and would NEVER think to commit voter fraud.

* The dead need to be represented and vote, too!

* Zombies are REALLY good at voter fraud, and we're helpless against their cunning, rotting flesh stink, and great make up!

* Once is never enough, when it comes to good voting, by golly!

* Yeah, we're as dumb as it gets on this - and God alone knows why.

Hello, Canada. Glad you caught your Russian spy!

Lamplighter · 10-11-2012, 07:44 PM

Z, all State and Federal elections in Oregon are via mail-in ballot.
(County-only measures are usually timed to go out on the same ballot,
and are only rarely a stand-alone election... because it's too expensive)

Our Secretary of State's office is in charge creating (truthful bill titles and descriptions,
and mailing our Voter Information Pamphlet, of mailing ballots to registered voters,
receiving marked ballots, checking the ballot envelope signatures against the registered signatures,
tracking changes of address, counting the ballots, and certifying the results.

There are volunteer "political observers" present at the opening and counting of the mail-in ballots,
but the Sec of State employees have primary say over the validity of ballots,
unless an issue actually goes to court for a legal decision.

Oregon is sort of famous for NOT having voter fraud or dirty politics.

Of course, we're keeping all this secret, watching with knowing smiles
all the other State continue spending their $ all the crazy battles at each election.

10-09-2012, 12:09 AM	#16
classicman barely disguised asshole, keeper of all that is holy. Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 23,401	As for the fraud in Florida ... Who reported it? The Republicans. __________________ "like strapping a pillow on a bull in a china shop" Bullitt

10-09-2012, 06:53 AM	#17
orthodoc Not Suspicious, Merely Canadian Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 3,774	Umm, yeah ... why are people pointing fingers and claiming Republican voter fraud? They (the local Republicans) hired a company to do a legitimate job (sign up unregistered voters), then outed and fired them when they turned in fraudulent voter registration lists. What's the problem? I agree with Bruce - in my experience working poll booths in a heavily Democratic town (back when I was a registered Republican - now I'm an Independent), all the election officials were Democrats. Fine, except they refused to work within the rules. There was immense hostility to the 2 of us Republican observers even turning up (they hadn't had to cope with our bothersome presence for some years, having run off Repub volunteers previously). I'm not accusing them of voter fraud, but procedures weren't followed and the local judge and inspector of elections didn't care. I think voter fraud is far more common than arrest and conviction stats show. Just like taking office supplies home. __________________ The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated. - Ghandi

10-09-2012, 08:51 AM	#18
footfootfoot To shreds, you say? Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: in the house and on the street-how many, many feet we meet! Posts: 18,449	When I was a Democrat I would show up at the polls and routinely the Republican poll workers couldn't find my name on the rolls, directed me to the wrong district, etc. I changed my registration to Republican and since then I've had no trouble at the polls. Funny that. I don't really see the point of registering anyway. It's not like the primaries matter. It's bad enough we have a two party system, but the choices within either party are Hobson's choice. __________________ The internet is a hateful stew of vomit you can never take completely seriously. - Her Fobs

10-09-2012, 09:12 AM	#19
Stormieweather Wearing her bitch boots Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Floriduh Posts: 1,181	Heh. Yeah, that's what the Republicans are running around telling everyone..."we discovered and reported it". Bull. Cheryl Johnson, Lee County's voter registration director, noticed irregularities and asked for an explanation from Strategic Allied Consulting (and actually met with them and a Republican official), who never got back to her with a response. She notified law enforcement. After the media broke the story, the RNC fired SAC and "reported" it to election officials. To top it all off, the founder of SAC, Nathan Sproul, is notorious for having done the EXACT SAME THING back in 2004 (changing registrations, ripping up Democratic registrations, etc). He told the LA Times he was specifically asked by the RNC to create Strategic Allied Consulting in order to distance themselves from his previous actions. Clearly, they knew who and what they were hiring. And why. LA Times I really hate when the truth gets twisted around. __________________ "First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win." - Mahatma Gandhi

10-09-2012, 09:32 AM	#20
orthodoc Not Suspicious, Merely Canadian Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 3,774	Fair enough. We all have our experiences with polls and local political parties, and it's not news that political misbehavior gets misreported. Neither party has the corner on it; they both stink enough that I refuse to have anything to do with either anymore. eta - thanks for the extra info, Stormie. And foot3 - yep, Hobson's choice. As for primaries, don't even get me started. During the time I was registered, the candidate had always been decided on before PA got to vote. There wasn't even the insult of a Hobson's choice. __________________ The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated. - Ghandi Last edited by orthodoc; 10-09-2012 at 09:43 AM.

10-09-2012, 10:33 AM	#22
Stormieweather Wearing her bitch boots Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Floriduh Posts: 1,181	I agree, Orthodoc. Neither party is without blemish or misbehavior. But I don't think this excuses whitewashing or manipulating the facts. By either party. I'm an intelligent person, just give the the facts and I'll decide where to go from there. __________________ "First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win." - Mahatma Gandhi

10-09-2012, 03:48 PM	#23
footfootfoot To shreds, you say? Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: in the house and on the street-how many, many feet we meet! Posts: 18,449	Whitewashing the facts? Oh. I thought you said fence. __________________ The internet is a hateful stew of vomit you can never take completely seriously. - Her Fobs

10-11-2012, 07:22 AM	#24
Adak Lecturer Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 796	Let's mention the hot case in Voter Fraud in Minnesota. http://www.forbes.com/sites/billfrez...-to-reduce-it/ Democrat Al Franken won his senate seat, by a mere 312 votes, out of 3 million+ votes cast. Now, there are 243 people who have been convicted, or charged with voter fraud in this election. If Al Franken had lost the election, then Obama's health care bill would not have passed. Al Gore lost the Presidential election because he lost the state of Florida. He lost Florida by less than 500 votes. Damn right voter fraud is an important issue!

10-11-2012, 07:16 PM	#26
ZenGum Doctor Wtf Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Badelaide, Baustralia Posts: 12,861	Dear America, WTF is wrong with you idiots? You let registered members of political parties staff the bloody ballot station and run the sodding election??? That's like leaving John Dillinger in charge of the cash box, or letting Wall Street regulate itself. (... oh, wait...) OK, listen up and take notes. There will be a test. Elections are to be run by the ~~Australian~~American Electoral Commission, hereafter AEC. The AEC only employs citizens who are not, and have not been for five years, a member of a political party. The AEC begins by setting electorate boundaries, keeping them all about the same population, trying to keep them roughly convex in shape, and IGNORING ("let the chips fall where they may") the political interests involved in doing this. The AEC creates the electoral rolls. All adults' names are on a list somewhere, and when you vote, your name gets marked. Afterwards, these are checked to make sure everyone voted once and once only. The AEC is in total control of the ballot station: queuing to vote, name checking, ballot issuing and collecting, security, and counting. All registered political parties (yeah, I know ... both of them) are entitled to have properly accredited observers inside the polling place, during set-up (to check the ballot boxes are empty at the start), all day, and during counting ... but they are not allowed to touch a bloody thing nor approach any voters. If they have concerns, they call one of the officials. Party members are allowed outside the poling place, but not within six metres (twenty of your quaint "feet") of any entrance or window. This is where they display their banners and offer last minute "how to vote for us" cards. Any questions? It's not bloody rocket surgery, people. A high school civics class could have come up with this. Love, Cousin Australia P.S. Say hi to Canada for us, thanks. __________________ Shut up and hug. MoreThanPretty, Nov 5, 2008. Just because I'm nominally polite, does not make me a pussy. Sundae Girl.

10-11-2012, 07:29 PM	#28
orthodoc Not Suspicious, Merely Canadian Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 3,774	waves hand Can I come live in Australia? Pretty please?? I've been swept off my feet by the magnificent logic of your electoral practices. P.S. Thanks, Canada says hi back. Incidentally, Canada's electoral/voting practices are just as messed up as America's. Different details, same result. __________________ The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated. - Ghandi

10-11-2012, 07:36 PM	#29
Adak Lecturer Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 796	Hey ZenGum, It's a special American disease I believe. It's either: * We truly believe everybody is pure as the driven snow, and would NEVER think to commit voter fraud. * The dead need to be represented and vote, too! * Zombies are REALLY good at voter fraud, and we're helpless against their cunning, rotting flesh stink, and great make up! * Once is never enough, when it comes to good voting, by golly! * Yeah, we're as dumb as it gets on this - and God alone knows why. Hello, Canada. Glad you caught your Russian spy!

10-11-2012, 07:44 PM	#30
Lamplighter Person who doesn't update the user title Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Bottom lands of the Missoula floods Posts: 6,402	Z, all State and Federal elections in Oregon are via mail-in ballot. (County-only measures are usually timed to go out on the same ballot, and are only rarely a stand-alone election... because it's too expensive) Our Secretary of State's office is in charge creating (truthful bill titles and descriptions, and mailing our Voter Information Pamphlet, of mailing ballots to registered voters, receiving marked ballots, checking the ballot envelope signatures against the registered signatures, tracking changes of address, counting the ballots, and certifying the results. There are volunteer "political observers" present at the opening and counting of the mail-in ballots, but the Sec of State employees have primary say over the validity of ballots, unless an issue actually goes to court for a legal decision. Oregon is sort of famous for NOT having voter fraud or dirty politics. Of course, we're keeping all this secret, watching with knowing smiles all the other State continue spending their $ all the crazy battles at each election.

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