Merry F'in Christmas - I want a divorce.

[chimmichunga]

I read your posts lookout, and my heart goes out to you seriously. I hope she goes through with the tests, cause from what you say it does sound like chemical imbalance. I am distant and sometimes cold to my husband to steel myself for the coming heartache. And she is doing her best to push you away, cause she can't leave herself. If she could(and what you say of her she sounds like she very well could) she would have and settled everything else from a friends house. IMHO, she is disappointed in herself, something she has thought or been thinking as changed her outlook on her "life". It feels inadequate, not up to the "good" life she has been dreaming of, and it sucks. It is prime midlife crisis age, the omg so many things ive missed out on, so many things left to do. Don't smother her, it will only make it worse. Just love her the way you did when things were fine. There is nothing worse than when your trying to hack your way through some heavy shit, than having your SO throw his damn feelings in the mix too, as if you didn't know how he felt about loosing you. She didn't come to the decision lightly, and it probably took some effort to bring it up. This is going to sound strange but RELAX, enjoy the time you have with her. Continue to encourage the therapist options, but don't freak on her, she needs you to be strong, cause at this point in time she isn't she looks and sounds the part, but she probably isn't. That is the best I can give. I hope i don't sound stupid, and I hope it helps. I wish you the best.

[chimmichunga]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

Welcome to the Cellar, chimmichunga.
I’m curious, why did you marry him? Pregnant? Bored? Escaping a bad environment? Everyone else was getting married? You were in love, then? You thought you were in love, then? None of the above?
I’m not alone in wondering what brings a woman/wife/mother to this point.
All too often I hear, “Well, he picks his teeth”, only to find out later when they were engaged she thought him picking his teeth was cute/macho/whatever.

I’m also curious how this situation affects you outside the home. You said careers, plural, so I assume you work outside the home. Does this make you more receptive to flirting at work? Have you had an affair? Have you thought about having an affair? Do you live near me? Kidding, just kidding. But I do wonder how this affects your “public deportment”?

About me huh. My parents seperated when I was 3, my dad visited every weekend and him and my mom slept in the same bed until he died when I was 13. They never leagaly divorced, and neither one ever got a steady bf or gf and never remarried. Our therapist finds this strange also. I am a pleaser, I love to please and I love to know that I am pleasing someone. Thereby making me a flirtatious person, I am however a very shy girl around new people. I have only loved 2 people in this world(besides family), including Mr. Chimmi.

How do you get to that point. I am at my best when I'm alone. I am emotional but in 10 yrs(6 married) my husband has seen me "emotionally open" maybe 3 times(his words). I have had no drug use(serious drug use) or never been in an abusive relationship. Mr. Chimms would say I am emotionally unavailable. My philosphy on men, I love you and would really like you to stay but I don't need you. Men enrich my life they don't make my life. My husbands is the opposite in his words, I am his world. My husband bends to my will and whim with barely a fight or an effort. I don't know if you can understand how horrible this is to me. Its like having a relationship with myself. I am a child with no boundries. I could talk him into most anything, and he would give it to me to please me. He gives me things to keep me when he was never in danger of me leaving. Now we wonder can that change? Was he always like this, with me yes for the most part, no one else though. I want him to have the comfort in our marriage that I have, and I want the love he feels for me to be what I feel for him. He is a great husband and father, I am not what he deserves, and he is a glutton for pain, so it falls on me to make it quick or prolong it.

My outside life, hmm. We do things, go places, things like that, we don't just sit around and do nothing. Our therapist says to get out and do things so we are trying. Does this trouble make me more receptive to outside influence, I would be lying if i said no. I am not an idiot who can be easily persuaded by shiny things, so it won't be a he said I have a firm apple heiney, so fuck it lets make it, kinda thing. Have I had an affair, no, but its not for lack of trying, no i'm fucking with you, or am I? No I haven't but it makes it easier for me to justify it, and to feel a lot less guilt over it. I also made a promise, that I would stay faithful to him until the day I stop being his wife. Believe me its hard men smell a wounded relationship like cougars smell sick animals, and it always seems like the reasons not to continue on, are the only reasons you see and are given. Like you have to work to find and see the good stuff.

He isn't the main source of trouble I have played my part, I have given in when I should have stood firm. I should have been more open, instead I hardened my heart and went into survival mode. I should have helped him through his fears, his feelings of inadequacies(sp?) instead I ridculed them and debased them.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Thanks, chimmichunga! I truly appreciate your trying to help me understand this. If nothing else, is confirms my theory about why one of my serious relationships foundered. She married a guy that she will never be able to completely please.

There is nothing worse than when your trying to hack your way through some heavy shit, than having your SO throw his damn feelings in the mix too, as if you didn't know how he felt about loosing you... He gives me things to keep me when he was never in danger of me leaving. Now we wonder can that change? Was he always like this, with me yes for the most part, no one else though. I want him to have the comfort in our marriage that I have, and I want the love he feels for me to be what I feel for him. He is a great husband and father, I am not what he deserves, and he is a glutton for pain, so it falls on me to make it quick or prolong it.

As a matter of fact, no I don't think you know how he feels about losing you. That first sentence of yours that I quoted has got to be one of the more callous things, I've ever read.

Like, "Would you please stop bothering me with the fact that I am causing you pain? This is all about MY pain! Mine, mine, mine!

And the dude WAS obviously in danger of you leaving, since you, in fact, are. You want him to have the comfort of being with someone who loves him without bothering to return the favor yourself. Your words make me think of the attitude of an ex-boyfriend of mine who was fooling around on me. "I'm fine with things the way they are. What's wrong with YOU?"

I very much doubt your husband is a glutton for pain. He is doing everything he can to make things work and have you stay around because he loves you. I'm sure he would be delighted to love you sans pain.

You come off as arrogant at best, heartless at worst.

Either decide the man and your two kids are worth it to you and give it your best shot, or else walk out and be done with it. Everyday you linger on, knowing damn well there's nothing in it for you, only increases the emotional damage to him and, possibly, the kids, as well.

My sig line refers to a man who has an outlook much like yours.

Jeez, Lookout, if you wife has this same attitude, run for the hills!

[footfootfoot]

Not that you asked Chimi, but then you did post to the cellar so, there ya go.

From your post above, your thereapist sounds like a noob. You and your husband don't need to go "do things" He needs to go do things that don't involve or consider you. not in a mean way, but in a "get a life" way.

What fucking pressure on you to be his world. jesus, who'd want that responsibility, no wonder you're emotionally unavailable.

"Gone to lunch, back as soon as you don't *need* me"

As for the guys who can smell a wounded relationship like cougars smelling a sick animal, would you really want to give up the candy to some ass who can only bag a wounded critter and hasn't got the stamina for the real chase?

But you aren't that kind of gal.

Maybe there is a middle ground where you don't have to ridicule and debase (let's face it though, who can't resist a good kick when they're down?) and you don't have to mollycoddle either.

Mostly, it sounds like you both need independance. Not liberty, nor license. My folks had a similar relationship to your folks. Inexplicable yes, but it worked for them. Not all of us fit into the disney model of interpersonal bliss.

Create your own theme park.

Also, please post pictures of your "firm apple heiney". I'm not exactly sure I've ever seen such a thing.

[Clodfobble]

Originally Posted by jaguar

The only people I know that got really fucked up by parent's divorces were either a: it was a long, bitter thing or b: they were between about 13-18, younger than that, people seem to be ok, myself included (obvious jokes aside).

To be sure, I was significantly happier and better off after my parents got divorced (I was 9,) but that's because it was no secret how miserable they made each other. It can definitely fuck up younger kids if it comes completely out of left field.

[chimmichunga]

Originally Posted by marichiko

As a matter of fact, no I don't think you know how he feels about losing you. That first sentence of yours that I quoted has got to be one of the more callous things, I've ever read.

Like, "Would you please stop bothering me with the fact that I am causing you pain? This is all about MY pain! Mine, mine, mine!

And the dude WAS obviously in danger of you leaving, since you, in fact, are. You want him to have the comfort of being with someone who loves him without bothering to return the favor yourself. Your words make me think of the attitude of an ex-boyfriend of mine who was fooling around on me. "I'm fine with things the way they are. What's wrong with YOU?"

I very much doubt your husband is a glutton for pain. He is doing everything he can to make things work and have you stay around because he loves you. I'm sure he would be delighted to love you sans pain.

You come off as arrogant at best, heartless at worst.

Either decide the man and your two kids are worth it to you and give it your best shot, or else walk out and be done with it. Everyday you linger on, knowing damn well there's nothing in it for you, only increases the emotional damage to him and, possibly, the kids, as well.

Oh, ouch. Okay, calm down, its not as bad as you took it. If I sounded callous that is what my truth usually sounds like (I felt no need to sugar coat it). I simply meant that it's understood that shes causing heartache to him and and in my situation,I regret it to the very core of me, If I could forget and lose myself in him I would, in a heartbeat. But If you let him throw all his emotion into yours someones going to break. By either saying fine anything to make it stop, I will concede, or fuck it anything is better than this psycho person. I was not saying suffer in silence, just to find self comfort, try and have conversations always, if you feel like your spinning your wheels, end conversation and try later on. Thats all I meant, you will probably think that is horrible too but that's ok, I've been called worse( but heartless did hurt a little bit, even from a stranger). When I said danger of losing me, that was throughout the relationship, not about what is happening now. I never said I was a genius at explaining things, but I am much better at it in person(IMHO).

Therapy was more than "do stuff" I just didn't go into full details, it would be boring, but then again there was some sex talk, and a midget. I do want to keep my marriage, I am giving it my best, and Mr. chimm does need some independence from me, he might find that I am a callous stuck up bitch, and he could do better. No I don't want a "fling" but I will not be marrying again, at least not from where I stand now. I just met you so no heiney photos, that takes at least 2 weeks

As Footfootfoot noted, you did post to the Cellar and not some touchy, feely support group. Rock on, and you don't need to send ME any pictures of ANYTHING.

[xoxoxoBruce]

chimmichunga, thanks again for your honesty.
Do you think if you doted a little he might feel more secure and back off a little with the smothering behavior?
Or maybe flat out say, "look, I love you, I'm not leaving, so relax and stop smothering me".
Possible?

Bruce, I've been around the marriage/LTR block more than once - to the point where I'm weary of making the trip. I've been on both sides of the equation we've been talking about. What I've noticed is that when a couple begins to get this polarized, its almost impossible to undo the damage. All that happens is that they get further and further into their opposite corners. The one who is feeling smothered is afraid to let the walls down for a second for fear the other's emotion will pour in like the ocean through the break and they'll end up drowned. The one who needs some reassurance feels that if they let go, their partner will vanish never to be seen again. It takes two very self aware people to work this impasse through. We pick partners (subconsciously) who will have the greatest difficulty giving us what we most need. Our partners demand from us the one thing that we feel it impossible to give. Until we do some inner work and begin to figure out why we place ourselves in these spots over and over again, we'll never be able to resolve anything with the people we chose as partners.

[xoxoxoBruce]

I've been around the block a few times myself. I was asking questions to get a better insight into the baggage issue, because being a man, I don't have any.

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

I've been around the block a few times myself. I was asking questions to get a better insight into the baggage issue, because being a man, I don't have any.

Yeah, you men just carry OUR luggage!

[yesman065]

Wow I go away for a couple weeks and look what happens. 1st, Lookout - I am really sorry for all your pain, but after going through something sort of similar, I say get your son and take care of him and ask her to leave. If she wants her freedom or to sperad her "wings" let her. JUst not with him or you or your home. It is so important at this time for him to feel comfortable and to be in "his" normal surroundings. The worst thing would be to make changes in his living environment because your wife is blankin nuts or whatever. I remember vividly what my father told me when I explianed that I was getting divorced. "You guys are adults and frankly I don't care about how you mess up your lives. The kids are the only thing I care about right now." From that and in the subsequent weeks and months, I realized how right he was!!!! Concentrate on what is most important - YOUR SON! Take care of him and move on. Good luck & God Bless!

[chimmichunga]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

chimmichunga, thanks again for your honesty.
Do you think if you doted a little he might feel more secure and back off a little with the smothering behavior?
Or maybe flat out say, "look, I love you, I'm not leaving, so relax and stop smothering me".
Possible?

I have said this very sentence and still the panic, and questions. I have said to him all I can say. At least in my mind I have, I don't know what else to do other than saying what i have to say listening to his side and looking for common ground. I am not a touchy, feely person exactly. So I probably don't dote on him enough, physically. Good suggestion, and I don't mind.

The one who is feeling smothered is afraid to let the walls down for a second for fear the other's emotion will pour in like the ocean through the break and they'll end up drowned-Marchiko

Yeah, something like that.

[Elspode]

You cannot fill a bottomless pit. I understand this better than I wish I did. Sometimes, two people are just wired so differently, there's no way to stay sufficiently connected to keep one or the other happy or secure. It is a painful struggle.