High powered jobs

[jaguar]

I don't think you should feel guilty at all unless you are not doing as good a job as you can. Screw the self-rightous, judgemental, idealistic bullshit that some would spew as though they knew anything about the real world and be true to yourself.

While I`m *sure* that was not *at all* directed at me in the slightest I have two things to say.

My first statement was meant, to a degree, to be hyperbolic. I think Catwoman got that, even if you didn't.

Secondly, don't try and tell me I don't know about advertising and media, I run and own a growing publication that is making the transition from online to the real world, I've also worked with graphic design firms that do branding campaigns. I dance with that devil all too often.

In my mind there are two types of advertising, reasonable, tollerable types that I am resigned to and the real scum. Very few organisations have the guts to pick and choose their advertisers but if you deal with certain markets, you realize it's in your interest to make sure that the people you sell space to aren't utter assholes, brand association works both ways.

She not the first, nor the last (and correct me if I'm wrong in this assessment) to be...bedeviled by the amorality of her profession, there have been plenty of confessions and defections to those of us that do our best to keep some public space and by association mental space, advertising free.

[Catwoman]

Beest & Jag: I agree with you both. If it is what I really wanted to do I would do it and not give a toss what other people think. Honestly. But I'm pretty sure it is not what I want to do, for precisely the reasons that Jag states, inclusive of hyperbole.

PS. Beest - a holiday sounds like a wonderful idea... could someone e-mail me my spare time?

[OnyxCougar]

Originally posted by zippyt
this may sound weird , but take up fly fishing , it can be VERRRRY zen like , just imagen you standing out in a srping sreek in waders with a vest containing every thing you need to fish , the syenergy of a good fly cast , a fish desides to hit your fly , you pull up on the line , feel the fish pull back , you play it up and down the river , playing the fish just enough to tire it but not ware it totaly out , net it , remove the fly , admire the beauty of such a vividly live creature , take a pic , then relese it back to the river with a wave and a " see you next time " , rince off your hands and start all over again , or walk over to the bank and pull a cold beer from the stream ( they have been cooling in the water ) or smoke a "J" and start all over again .

Life is to short not to get SOME pleasure from the experence , and also if you work all the time and stress all the time when do you have time to enjoy ALL the money that you are makeing ???

Read my sig line and understand what it is saying !!

You know, if I can get past the utterly incredible lack of anything resembling proper spelling or punctuation in Zip's posts, I realize that sometimes he has something to say. The "Life is to(o) short" paragraph was spot on.

[jaguar]

If you're serious about change considering employment at an NGO or charity, they need good people and while the money won't be anywhere near as good at least you'll sleep well.

There are also plenty of organisations (and it's growin fast) for whom ethical practices are a core part of their operating charter.

[Beestie]

Originally posted by jaguar

My first statement was meant, to a degree, to be hyperbolic. I think Catwoman got that, even if you didn't.

I didn't. I also didn't think it was very polite.

I realize you have an issue with advertising (you are the one with the pocketknife, no?) but I thought you were a little harsh even so. The "anytime" followup wasn't exactly a post script smilie and my opinion was thusly formed - rightly or wrongly.

I'll withdraw my challenge of your real-world knowledge world but I will also point out that about 6 or 9 months ago you, if I recall correctly, asked a similar question (career/life/what to do). I recall that everyone was helpful to you in your moment of doubt so I considered your response here to be a lost opportunity to return the favour.

Just my $.02.

[jaguar]

Yea I understand, it was half in jest, half not. She's far from the first I've heard similar things from and in the end, it is pretty much true.

It was subtle enough that I can easily forgive you for not catching on. It wasn't too polite but if you find a nice way of making that point, tell me. I also wanted to see how she reacted, before that it was not clear whether the bigger problem was the ethics or the hours.

[Beestie]

Originally posted by jaguar

I also wanted to see how she reacted, before that it was not clear whether the bigger problem was the ethics or the hours.

I'll confess a certain degree of ignorance regarding the profession. Perhaps it would have been better had I just stayed out of it.

[jaguar]

selling people things they don't need by showing them things that they don't want to see, oftening targetting kids to nag parents, preying on people's insecurities or targetting disadvantaged people with false hope, join the dots.

That said, not all advertising is the spawn of the devil nor are most of the people that work in it.

A person's job consumes about a third of their life if they work 8 hours a day. I for one always wanted to feel that I was doing something that was a contribution to society, not a taking. I felt so fortunate to be granted the chance for my education and I wanted to give something back in exchange. Early on in my career I had the choice between two job offers. One was a high paying civil service job for the department of defense running the research library in Los Alamos, New Mexico. The other was a far humbler, lower paying job as a science librarian at a little college which had an outreach program for Native American students down in Durango, Colorado. I really agonized over the choice, but in the end I took the Durango job and never regretted having done so.

Its just a matter of where you heart is. There would have been nothing wrong with working for Los Alamos had I believed in its mission, but I am completely anti-war; so I would have been miserable there. Someone else who believed that Los Alamos was doing the right thing would have prospered and been happy.

[TheLorax]

That’s a tough one and you are the only one who can decide what is best for you.

I got laid off from my power job a couple of years ago. I worked a lot, somewhere between 60 and 70 hours a week. After I got laid off and spent four months realizing that I had precious little going on in my life other than work, I decided not to go for the power job ever again. It was a little strange at first to be home at 6:00 on a Tuesday night, what do people do at 6:00 on a Tuesday if they’re not working – turns out they play with their dogs, duffer around in the yard, practice the piano, work out… I enjoy not having to carry a picture of my husband around so I remember what he looks like. I have turned down two power jobs since then, one of them for a considerable amount of money – screw the money I don’t care. I don’t want to look back on my life one day and see that all I did was work.

[Catwoman]

Originally posted by jaguar:
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My first statement was meant, to a degree, to be hyperbolic. I think Catwoman got that, even if you didn't.
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Originally posted by Beestie I didn't. I also didn't think it was very polite.

Boys, boys. Beestie your concern is very much appreciated , but if I were to take offence at what jag said it would be much the same as if I worked for an exploitative, sweat shop owning multinat, and then complained when people told me I was unethical. OK so my job is a lot smaller scale and less influential but the principles remain the same. I am in the business of making people feel bad.

I put a product in front of you that I tell you will make you feel good. You buy it with your maxed out credit card, and it makes you feel worse. There is already a new version to replace the old version and now you can't afford to go on holiday or send little Mary to college. I teach you that if you buy those mints you will look as good as the airbrushed (and physically unachievable) model in the advert, and if you buy that sofa your home life will be as functional and contented as the family on your screen. It's all a myth that you buy into because there is something lacking in your life, and I tell you I can replace it. OK, maybe it's your fault for believing me. But I'm very good at my job. It takes some strength of mind to resist, and I have already made sure I eliminated that by ensuring my flashing screens and ubiquitous billboards play up to your insecurity, self-doubt and curiosity. You don't stand a chance.

I hope this clears up the world of advertising for anyone still sympathetic to it, and while I am not so arrogant or 'high-powered' to assume that I make all that much of a difference, in a few years time I may be, so I figure now's as good a time as any to start pursuing something real.



edited to amend improbably difficult syntax... now you know why I don't work in IT

[Catwoman]

Well, I have handed my notice in. Leave on the 30th July. And then I'm (hopefully) going camper vanning around England for a month with my housemate (yes, that one). Have been offered a job with my old company for £10K more than what I'm earning now. I could do the job with my eyes closed but I will most likely hate every minute of it. However it will give me an opportunity to save up, pay of debts etc. and hopefully finance the start of a new way of life ie freelance writing/copywriting. Just not sure if I can take another year or two of this mindless bullshit. Do I take the job and put up with the moral/intellectual conflict while thinking of the future, or do I live for now and start up my freelance thing even though it may fall on its head and make me more and more in debt?

[glatt]

Originally posted by Catwoman
And then I'm (hopefully) going camper vanning around England for a month with my housemate (yes, that one).

Catwoman,
every time you post more information on your situation with this guy, you seem to have changed your direction with him. Last time you posted, you said you realize he doesn't love you, and you were moving out. What happened to make you want to spend a month traveling around with him?

Has he said that the relationship is an exclusive one now?

[Catwoman]

Originally posted by glatt


Catwoman,
every time you post more information on your situation with this guy, you seem to have changed your direction with him. Last time you posted, you said you realize he doesn't love you, and you were moving out. What happened to make you want to spend a month traveling around with him?

Has he said that the relationship is an exclusive one now?

No, he hasn't, and I didn't really want to go into this one to save everyone's boredom! I have accepted there's not going to be a relationship, we're going away as friends, and there's no way I can afford to move out right now, esp. after quitting work. It's ok, I'll deal with it, I'm not the first person to suffer from unrequited love. Although we went to a party last week and he took me outside for a joint and said 'I love you' and then I didn't say anything just looked at him so he said 'oops'. Never know if he's joking or not. Whatever. I'd rather still be friends than nothing at all anyway.

[wolf]

You can always put him out of the camper van. It's not like you'd be abandoning him in another country. There are busses and things.