Kidnapped girl found 18 years later - Page 2

hackhelios · 08-28-2009, 12:10 PM

Followup--I just said as much to my wife, and she laid some wisdom on me.

"So let's say the 29-year-old woman turns around and kidnaps a child. Does the same thing to him that was done to her. Do we kill her?"

"That's a different situation," I replied. "This guy inflicted a lot of suffering on this girl for a long time."

She smiled. "How do you know what happened to him when he was a kid?"

I had no reply.

classicman · 08-28-2009, 12:29 PM

Who cares what happened to him as a child? What difference does that make.

If he was treated horribly perhaps he should know how that felt and NOT inflict that on another?

Remove them both from the planet - next.

Clodfobble · 08-28-2009, 12:34 PM

Quote:

Followup--I just said as much to my wife, and she laid some wisdom on me.

"So let's say the 29-year-old woman turns around and kidnaps a child. Does the same thing to him that was done to her. Do we kill her?"

"That's a different situation," I replied. "This guy inflicted a lot of suffering on this girl for a long time."

She smiled. "How do you know what happened to him when he was a kid?"

I had no reply.

That's because you gave the wrong answer to her question.

Quote:

Originally Posted by hackhelios

"So let's say the 29-year-old woman turns around and kidnaps a child. Does the same thing to him that was done to her. Do we kill her?"

Kill her, no. Lock her up permanently? Sorry, but yes. The only thing that makes her situation different is maybe she gets put in minimum security, with as many perks as they can reasonably give her along the lines of library privileges, etc. The fact that you have a valid mental excuse for something wrong doesn't mean you should be allowed to keep doing it.

This guy was a registered sex offender. Recidivism rates for this type of criminal are staggering. They need to start accepting that there is no psychological recovery for most of them, and stop letting them out just so they can do it again and again.

hackhelios · 08-28-2009, 12:41 PM

Permanent lock-up was my wife's suggestion, as well. She certainly doesn't feel sorry for them, but her P.O.V. is that killing them is going too far.

Sadistic behavior likes this makes me sick, so my gut reaction is to kill the offender and be done with it--but she suggested that it may truly be sickness resulting from something that was done to him, so locking him up permanently is the only solution.

classicman: like i said, that's my gut reaction--but consider this: kids who are abused by their parents are 10 times as likely to abuse their own children. These horrible acts don't teach their victims not to do it; rather, it corrupts them, makes them think that such harmful abuse is normal behavior.

piercehawkeye45 · 08-28-2009, 12:55 PM

Ah...the idea of the philosophy of justice in a world where it seems that justice does not truly exist.

I strongly do not believe in purely genetically good or bad people but that we are all products of a mix of genetic and more prominent environmental influences. That means for the most part, who we are as people is largely out of our control but this argument is meaningless when attempting to form a stable and civil society.

Cloud · 08-28-2009, 12:56 PM

Jodie Foster is a religion?

Clodfobble · 08-28-2009, 01:04 PM

A guy tried to assassinate Ronald Reagan because he was obsessed with Jodie Foster and thought in his delusions that it was what she wanted. The point is, it's not religion's fault that some retards are drawn to it.

classicman · 08-28-2009, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hackhelios

Permanent lock-up was my wife's P.O.V. is that killing them is going too far.

my gut reaction is to kill the offender and be done with it

These horrible acts don't teach their victims not to do it; rather, it corrupts them.

there is no real solution - thats the problem.

DanaC · 08-28-2009, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clodfobble

That's because you gave the wrong answer to her question.

Kill her, no. Lock her up permanently? Sorry, but yes. The only thing that makes her situation different is maybe she gets put in minimum security, with as many perks as they can reasonably give her along the lines of library privileges, etc. The fact that you have a valid mental excuse for something wrong doesn't mean you should be allowed to keep doing it.

This guy was a registered sex offender. Recidivism rates for this type of criminal are staggering. They need to start accepting that there is no psychological recovery for most of them, and stop letting them out just so they can do it again and again.

I completely agree. I am absolutely not in favour of the death penalty. But nor am I in favour of allowing people who are driven to do harm, just continue to do it. Burglars can be reformed. Even violent killers can (and sometimes are) reformed. But paedophilia is a compulsion. If someone has proved unable to resist that compulsion then they will always be a risk.

I don't believe in 'punishment' for damaged people. I don't think it helps society and I don;t think it helps the perps either. I think there's a strong argument for compassionate but permanent incarceration.

classicman · 08-28-2009, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DanaC

I think there's a strong argument for compassionate but permanent incarceration.

No compassion deserved.

DanaC · 08-28-2009, 04:34 PM

So, if this woman was to repeat the crimes against her, because she's basically been warped by the things done to her, she deserves no compassion?

There is a place in life for mercy.

monster · 08-28-2009, 04:49 PM

poor woman. She just got freed and you all have her guilty and incarcerated again! if you are jailed awaiting trial it counts as time served, so surely she'd be freed anyway

DanaC · 08-28-2009, 05:24 PM

Good point Monnie :P

but...@ Classic: to my mind, mercy and compassion aren't about what the recipients of them deserve; they're about what the giver is prepared to give. And for justice truly to be justice it needs both, else it's just vengeance. And I'd like to think most of us are better than that. Better than the murderers or the paedophiles or the rapists. Better than those who are devoid of compassion and who have no mercy.

[eta] that's not to say , by the way, that I see no place in life for vengeance. I just don't think its place is in our justice system. As individuals, if hurt we may well want vengeance. But I want my society to be a just one, not a vengeful one. I want a justice system that tempers its judgements with mercy and compassion, even if I as an individual might prefer vengeance.

morethanpretty · 08-28-2009, 10:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by depmats

Sick sick bastards. For those of you who don't believe there is a place for torture in our "civilized" society, I present you with *drumroll* kidnappers.

Kidnappers, abusers, drunk drivers, ect: all have no place in civilized society, and neither does torture.

classicman · 08-28-2009, 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DanaC

So, if this woman was to repeat the crimes against her, because she's basically been warped by the things done to her, she deserves no compassion?

There is a place in life for mercy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by monster

poor woman. She just got freed and you all have her guilty and incarcerated again! if you are jailed awaiting trial it counts as time served, so surely she'd be freed anyway

I was referring to the wife of the shitbag kidnapper - not the girl. Sheesh!

08-28-2009, 12:10 PM	#16
hackhelios Sun Hacker Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Silver Spring, MD Posts: 48	Followup--I just said as much to my wife, and she laid some wisdom on me. "So let's say the 29-year-old woman turns around and kidnaps a child. Does the same thing to him that was done to her. Do we kill her?" "That's a different situation," I replied. "This guy inflicted a lot of suffering on this girl for a long time." She smiled. "How do you know what happened to him when he was a kid?" I had no reply. __________________ Burn the land and boil the sea, You can't take the sky from me.

08-28-2009, 12:29 PM	#17
classicman barely disguised asshole, keeper of all that is holy. Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 23,401	Who cares what happened to him as a child? What difference does that make. If he was treated horribly perhaps he should know how that felt and NOT inflict that on another? Remove them both from the planet - next. __________________ "like strapping a pillow on a bull in a china shop" Bullitt

08-28-2009, 12:41 PM	#19
hackhelios Sun Hacker Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Silver Spring, MD Posts: 48	Permanent lock-up was my wife's suggestion, as well. She certainly doesn't feel sorry for them, but her P.O.V. is that killing them is going too far. Sadistic behavior likes this makes me sick, so my gut reaction is to kill the offender and be done with it--but she suggested that it may truly be sickness resulting from something that was done to him, so locking him up permanently is the only solution. classicman: like i said, that's my gut reaction--but consider this: kids who are abused by their parents are 10 times as likely to abuse their own children. These horrible acts don't teach their victims not to do it; rather, it corrupts them, makes them think that such harmful abuse is normal behavior. __________________ Burn the land and boil the sea, You can't take the sky from me.

08-28-2009, 12:55 PM	#20
piercehawkeye45 Franklin Pierce Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Minnesota Posts: 3,695	Ah...the idea of the philosophy of justice in a world where it seems that justice does not truly exist. I strongly do not believe in purely genetically good or bad people but that we are all products of a mix of genetic and more prominent environmental influences. That means for the most part, who we are as people is largely out of our control but this argument is meaningless when attempting to form a stable and civil society. __________________ I like my perspectives like I like my baseball caps: one size fits all.

08-28-2009, 12:56 PM	#21
Cloud ... Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 8,360	Jodie Foster is a religion? __________________ "Guard your honor. Let your reputation fall where it will. And outlive the bastards!"

08-28-2009, 01:04 PM	#22
Clodfobble UNDER CONDITIONAL MITIGATION Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 20,012	A guy tried to assassinate Ronald Reagan because he was obsessed with Jodie Foster and thought in his delusions that it was what she wanted. The point is, it's not religion's fault that some retards are drawn to it. __________________ My book My other book My spirit animal

08-28-2009, 04:49 PM	#27
monster I hear them call the tide Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Perpetual Chaos Posts: 30,852	poor woman. She just got freed and you all have her guilty and incarcerated again! if you are jailed awaiting trial it counts as time served, so surely she'd be freed anyway __________________ The most difficult thing is the decision to act, the rest is merely tenacity Amelia Earhart

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