Wego Kite Tube of Death Accident - Page 8

xoxoxoBruce · 07-10-2006, 09:25 PM

Welcome to the Cellar, Ollie.

Quote:

What 12 year old has sufficient judgement to evaluate the warnings properly and accordingly accept the risk?

Who's driving the boat?

Elspode · 07-10-2006, 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ollie_Lindy

What 12 year old has sufficient judgement to evaluate the warnings properly and accordingly accept the risk?

What 12 year old has unsupervised access to a Wego Kite Tube and a boat to pull it? Duh.

Another question. If you got zapped on the first ride, why did anyone ever take the second ride?

Next contestant, please...

jinx · 07-10-2006, 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ollie_Lindy

Almost all products have liability warnings on them (remember McDonald's hot coffee...). It is sometimes impossible to tell if a product is truly dangerous or if the manufacturer is simply issuing warnings to protect against litigation in the event something should happen (even if chances are remote).

The McDonalds hot coffee lady received 3rd degree burns over 6% of her body, which required debridement and skin grafts because she was served coffee that was 180-190 degrees. Since most people drink coffee at 140 or so, no one should be expected assume that they'll be disfigured if they spill. I'm glad she got a settlement.

If you hurt yourself hot-dogging around a lake on a flying tube with warnings and skulls all over it, pulled behind a speed boat, I think you should be on your own with that.

velocityboy · 07-10-2006, 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

Welcome to the Cellar, Ollie.

Who's driving the boat?

Exactly. I wouldn't let anyone under 18 use mine; my own kid or anyone else's.

I tore my rotator cuff messing around with a power kite. Does that mean nobody should use them? I still do. If you can't take being beaten up a little, then don't use a toy that can beat you up :-)

dar512 · 07-10-2006, 10:17 PM

Maybe it's different now, but I was driving a speedboat when I was 13. I drove while my brother skied and vice versa.

Ibby · 07-10-2006, 10:22 PM

I think VB totally summed this all up in one sentence.

Quote:

If you can't take being beaten up a little, then don't use a toy that can beat you up

Ollie_Lindy · 07-10-2006, 10:45 PM

The driver read the warnings. Age limit = 12 yrs. Driver assumes okay for 12 yr old to try. Finds out too late (after injury) that 12 year old cannot control the tube. Driver has nothing to do with rider's control if boat is going at prescribed speed. Wind gust can suddenly throw 12 yr old 40 ft into the air. 12 year old does not have sufficient body strength to combat wind gust. Split second incident.

Regarding second rider. It is reasonable to assume that one bad experience does not predict all future experiences. Hence, try again with younger, more athletic rider. It is imperative to understand that two bad experiences in a row, with capable adult riders & boat driver = lesson learned. Third try would be inviting disaster...

Water skiing can be dangerous but typically danger increases with rider's pre-meditated decision to risk maneuvors. Rider does not have ability to make decision regarding maneuvors on kite tube. Rider makes the decision to lift into the air, and wind conditions determine subsequent height in a split second process. Rider can be 2 feet in the air and, with a sudden unexpected wind gust, can suddenly be 40 feet in the air with no balance control & subsequently slammed into the water with the kite tube on top of rider. Trust me, the instructional video does not show this type of occurance. When you watch the video, riders are perfectly balanced and only a few feet in the air. The warnings are there in writing, but one assumes, after watching the video, that they reference possibilities, not every ride probability.

Ibby · 07-10-2006, 10:49 PM

If I were to buy a gun (yeah right), and the label on the gun said "WARNING, THIS WEAPON MAY UNINTENTIONALLY DISCHARGE EXCERSISE CAUTION ETC ETC ETC", and I put it in my mouth, or against my leg, or pointed it at myself or anyone else, and it went off, would "Well I didnt think it really MEANT that it could go off, I thought it was just SAYING that!" be a valid excuse? Sure, all the videos of cops and soldiers and people training with them dont show anyone getting hurt! When they point them where they shouldnt, the guns dont go off all by themselves! That warning is totally bogus!

I dont care if you're going five, fifty, or five hundred miles an hour, if you're riding a big piece of plastic, on the water, behind a boat, that is designed to fly, then it is YOUR decision to get on the big INFLATABLE PLASTIC TOY and ride it. If you cant control it, well, you should have thought of that before you got on.

velocityboy · 07-10-2006, 10:52 PM

I've had one outing on the Manta Ray (the Wego's competitor) with a friend. He fell off once, I fell off once. Both times we were fine. We used the tube in low, steady wind (as recommended) and nobody suddenly zoomed 40 feet in the air. If you had that experience, then the wind was too gusty. Constant boat speed + constant wind speed = constant airspeed = constant lift (since you can't really control the angle of attack too much). That's just physics.

Elspode · 07-10-2006, 10:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ibram

If you cant control it, well, you should have thought of that before you got on.

And should have thought about it *twice* before putting a 12 year old on it.

Ollie_Lindy · 07-10-2006, 10:58 PM

CPSC Warns Consumers about Dangers of Tube Kiting
Two Deaths over the Past 3 Months Attributed to New Water Sport
WASHINGTON, D.C. – In advance of the July 4th holiday weekend, the U.S. Consumer Product Safety Commission (CPSC) is warning consumers about the possible dangers associated with a new type of water recreation known as “tube kiting.”

CPSC is concerned about death and injury reports associated with tube kiting. It is currently investigating two versions of these products to determine if there is a significant product hazard.

Tube kiting is a relatively new form of extreme water sport which is fast growing in popularity, but also extremely dangerous. CPSC is aware of at least two deaths associated with tube kiting this year. A 33-year-old Texas man was killed in late April 2006 while tube kiting, and a 42-year-old man died from injuries associated with tube kiting on June 26, 2006 in Wisconsin.

CPSC is also aware of 12 serious injuries associated with tube kiting. The injuries include a broken neck, punctured lung, broken ribs, broken femur, chest and back injuries, and facial injuries, such as jaw fractures. A 14-year-old girl who was tube kiting lost consciousness when it fell about 15 feet and struck the water.

Tube kites are very large, sometimes round, inflatable water devices that can be more than 10 feet in diameter. The tube is hooked to the back of a boat by a tow rope, and the tube rider pulls back on a rope as the boat travels at speeds between 25 and 35 miles per hour. The ride begins when the tube is lifted into the air trailing the boat. Possible reasons for incidents and injuries include: 1) rider’s difficulty in controlling the tube, 2) boat operator inexperience, and 3) how the tube reacts in certain weather conditions. The conditions of highest concern are wind gusts that can cause the tube to spin out of control, or sudden slowing or stopping by the boat operator, which can cause the tube to nose dive into the water. In some cases, the sudden stopping of the boat might cause the tube rider to continue past the boat and hit it or hit other boats or stationary objects, such as a bridge.

The National Park Service has banned the inflatable devices in at least one of its parks, Glen Canyon National Recreation Area, which includes Lake Powell where there have been at least four serious injuries.

Ibby · 07-10-2006, 11:03 PM

...And? None of us are saying they arent dangerous. What we ARE saying is that it's not the COMPANY's fault that ANYONE is stupid enough to ride a piece of PLASTIC intended to FLY behind a boat and NOT expect to bail and possibly get hurt, even AFTER all the warnings packaged with the TOY.

velocityboy · 07-10-2006, 11:11 PM

And, if you read the thread a little farther back, this very news item was already discussed, in terms of whether or not it's the right of government to protect citizens from themselves. You can guess where I stand.

Ollie_Lindy · 07-10-2006, 11:24 PM

Everyone knows cigarette smoking causes lung cancer. But we don't let 12 year old's buy tobacco (legally) and we don't actively promote tobacco to minors through TV ads, magazines, etc as a "fun but dangerous" product.

This product is being actively promoted as a "fun but dangerous" toy that can easily lure an inexperienced boat driver or rider into thinking that it just takes practice to master the ride.

I certainly did not completely understand the risk until actually experiencing the ride.

Let's put it this way. Almost all rides at amusement parks have warnings, some very serious. But, I do not assume that I WILL die or be injured if I ride the ride. I understand that there is a possibility that something could go wrong, but the likelyhood of it happening is low. This is how people are viewing the instructional video and manual that comes with the kite tube.

velocityboy · 07-10-2006, 11:31 PM

You must not be dead or seriously injured, you're still posting.

I've got nothing against limiting user age to 16 or 18. We have those rules for ATV's and Jet Ski's as well. I'd much rather see that than an outright ban.

07-10-2006, 10:17 PM	#110
dar512 dar512 is now Pete Zicato Join Date: May 2003 Location: Chicago suburb Posts: 4,968	Maybe it's different now, but I was driving a speedboat when I was 13. I drove while my brother skied and vice versa. __________________ "Against stupidity the gods themselves contend in vain." -- Friedrich Schiller

07-10-2006, 10:49 PM	#113
Ibby erika Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: "the high up north" Posts: 6,127	If I were to buy a gun (yeah right), and the label on the gun said "WARNING, THIS WEAPON MAY UNINTENTIONALLY DISCHARGE EXCERSISE CAUTION ETC ETC ETC", and I put it in my mouth, or against my leg, or pointed it at myself or anyone else, and it went off, would "Well I didnt think it really MEANT that it could go off, I thought it was just SAYING that!" be a valid excuse? Sure, all the videos of cops and soldiers and people training with them dont show anyone getting hurt! When they point them where they shouldnt, the guns dont go off all by themselves! That warning is totally bogus! I dont care if you're going five, fifty, or five hundred miles an hour, if you're riding a big piece of plastic, on the water, behind a boat, that is designed to fly, then it is YOUR decision to get on the big INFLATABLE PLASTIC TOY and ride it. If you cant control it, well, you should have thought of that before you got on. __________________ not really back, you didn't see me, i was never here shhhhhh Last edited by Ibby; 07-10-2006 at 10:52 PM.

07-10-2006, 11:03 PM	#117
Ibby erika Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: "the high up north" Posts: 6,127	...And? None of us are saying they arent dangerous. What we ARE saying is that it's not the COMPANY's fault that ANYONE is stupid enough to ride a piece of PLASTIC intended to FLY behind a boat and NOT expect to bail and possibly get hurt, even AFTER all the warnings packaged with the TOY. __________________ not really back, you didn't see me, i was never here shhhhhh

07-10-2006, 10:45 PM	#112
Ollie_Lindy Non-Newbie Sort Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 6	The driver read the warnings. Age limit = 12 yrs. Driver assumes okay for 12 yr old to try. Finds out too late (after injury) that 12 year old cannot control the tube. Driver has nothing to do with rider's control if boat is going at prescribed speed. Wind gust can suddenly throw 12 yr old 40 ft into the air. 12 year old does not have sufficient body strength to combat wind gust. Split second incident. Regarding second rider. It is reasonable to assume that one bad experience does not predict all future experiences. Hence, try again with younger, more athletic rider. It is imperative to understand that two bad experiences in a row, with capable adult riders & boat driver = lesson learned. Third try would be inviting disaster... Water skiing can be dangerous but typically danger increases with rider's pre-meditated decision to risk maneuvors. Rider does not have ability to make decision regarding maneuvors on kite tube. Rider makes the decision to lift into the air, and wind conditions determine subsequent height in a split second process. Rider can be 2 feet in the air and, with a sudden unexpected wind gust, can suddenly be 40 feet in the air with no balance control & subsequently slammed into the water with the kite tube on top of rider. Trust me, the instructional video does not show this type of occurance. When you watch the video, riders are perfectly balanced and only a few feet in the air. The warnings are there in writing, but one assumes, after watching the video, that they reference possibilities, not every ride probability.

07-10-2006, 10:52 PM	#114
velocityboy Drawn Druid Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Issaquah, WA Posts: 32	I've had one outing on the Manta Ray (the Wego's competitor) with a friend. He fell off once, I fell off once. Both times we were fine. We used the tube in low, steady wind (as recommended) and nobody suddenly zoomed 40 feet in the air. If you had that experience, then the wind was too gusty. Constant boat speed + constant wind speed = constant airspeed = constant lift (since you can't really control the angle of attack too much). That's just physics.

07-10-2006, 10:58 PM	#116
Ollie_Lindy Non-Newbie Sort Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 6	CPSC Warns Consumers about Dangers of Tube Kiting Two Deaths over the Past 3 Months Attributed to New Water Sport WASHINGTON, D.C. – In advance of the July 4th holiday weekend, the U.S. Consumer Product Safety Commission (CPSC) is warning consumers about the possible dangers associated with a new type of water recreation known as “tube kiting.” CPSC is concerned about death and injury reports associated with tube kiting. It is currently investigating two versions of these products to determine if there is a significant product hazard. Tube kiting is a relatively new form of extreme water sport which is fast growing in popularity, but also extremely dangerous. CPSC is aware of at least two deaths associated with tube kiting this year. A 33-year-old Texas man was killed in late April 2006 while tube kiting, and a 42-year-old man died from injuries associated with tube kiting on June 26, 2006 in Wisconsin. CPSC is also aware of 12 serious injuries associated with tube kiting. The injuries include a broken neck, punctured lung, broken ribs, broken femur, chest and back injuries, and facial injuries, such as jaw fractures. A 14-year-old girl who was tube kiting lost consciousness when it fell about 15 feet and struck the water. Tube kites are very large, sometimes round, inflatable water devices that can be more than 10 feet in diameter. The tube is hooked to the back of a boat by a tow rope, and the tube rider pulls back on a rope as the boat travels at speeds between 25 and 35 miles per hour. The ride begins when the tube is lifted into the air trailing the boat. Possible reasons for incidents and injuries include: 1) rider’s difficulty in controlling the tube, 2) boat operator inexperience, and 3) how the tube reacts in certain weather conditions. The conditions of highest concern are wind gusts that can cause the tube to spin out of control, or sudden slowing or stopping by the boat operator, which can cause the tube to nose dive into the water. In some cases, the sudden stopping of the boat might cause the tube rider to continue past the boat and hit it or hit other boats or stationary objects, such as a bridge. The National Park Service has banned the inflatable devices in at least one of its parks, Glen Canyon National Recreation Area, which includes Lake Powell where there have been at least four serious injuries.

07-10-2006, 11:11 PM	#118
velocityboy Drawn Druid Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Issaquah, WA Posts: 32	And, if you read the thread a little farther back, this very news item was already discussed, in terms of whether or not it's the right of government to protect citizens from themselves. You can guess where I stand.

07-10-2006, 11:24 PM	#119
Ollie_Lindy Non-Newbie Sort Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 6	Everyone knows cigarette smoking causes lung cancer. But we don't let 12 year old's buy tobacco (legally) and we don't actively promote tobacco to minors through TV ads, magazines, etc as a "fun but dangerous" product. This product is being actively promoted as a "fun but dangerous" toy that can easily lure an inexperienced boat driver or rider into thinking that it just takes practice to master the ride. I certainly did not completely understand the risk until actually experiencing the ride. Let's put it this way. Almost all rides at amusement parks have warnings, some very serious. But, I do not assume that I WILL die or be injured if I ride the ride. I understand that there is a possibility that something could go wrong, but the likelyhood of it happening is low. This is how people are viewing the instructional video and manual that comes with the kite tube.

07-10-2006, 11:31 PM	#120
velocityboy Drawn Druid Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Issaquah, WA Posts: 32	You must not be dead or seriously injured, you're still posting. I've got nothing against limiting user age to 16 or 18. We have those rules for ATV's and Jet Ski's as well. I'd much rather see that than an outright ban.

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