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   Undertoad  Wednesday Mar 1 11:37 AM

3/1/2006: Poisoned elephants die



Terrible one today. Six rare wild elephants were found dead in a remote Sumatran jungle. It was determined that they were intentionally poisoned with potassium cyanide.

the only full story I could find on it says that the one male had its tusks removed, but didn't say whether that was the motive or what the motive would be. It does say that killing the elephants was a crime. And that the bodies above are a week old.



Emrikol  Wednesday Mar 1 12:07 PM

That's just horrible.

I don't think there's much more available to describe it...just horrible.



Trilby  Wednesday Mar 1 12:40 PM

what do you expect of people who CANE women?

Pretty bloody typical.



glatt  Wednesday Mar 1 12:43 PM

I look at this, and just don't get it. Somebody thought this would be a good idea. Somebody, somewhere was given a certain set of facts, and using those facts, came to the conclusion that the best course of action would be to kill these creatures. I don't get it. Most human behavior is understandable on some level, but I don't really understand this one.

Well, I guess after thinking about it, I do know what this is about. The person(s) who did this want money. The elephant tusks are worth money. Poison is cheap. They may or may not care that they killed 6 elephants and only one of them had tusks to steal. It's a lot easier to poison all the elephants than to try to take down just one and deal with the other living ones as you try to cut the tusks off the body of the dead one.

This is about money and laziness. It makes perfect sense.

I think of the people who did this as horrible monsters, but I wonder if I'm capable of doing it? If I was a desperate villager with a dying child who needed food or expensive medicine, I'd kill 6 elephants without hesitation if it would get me what I needed. Especially if I was fairly sure I wouldn't get caught.

But sitting here safely behind my clean desk, I think the people who did this are monsters.



Trilby  Wednesday Mar 1 01:03 PM

I do not have to go thru all the machinations that glatt does. A people who would cane a woman for loving (or, boinking) a man would do this to it's own animals. Once again, Gandhi serves as an example.



Elspode  Wednesday Mar 1 01:18 PM

People suck. Sure glad I'm not a person.



Kitsune  Wednesday Mar 1 01:27 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by glatt
I look at this, and just don't get it. Somebody thought this would be a good idea. Somebody, somewhere was given a certain set of facts, and using those facts, came to the conclusion that the best course of action would be to kill these creatures. I don't get it. Most human behavior is understandable on some level, but I don't really understand this one.
My question: If the elephants had been shot instead of poisoned, would it have made a difference in your opinion of the hunter(s)? Would it have even made IotD?


Happy Monkey  Wednesday Mar 1 01:41 PM

Elephants, plural? If the poacher had used a gun, the elephant with tusks would probably have been the only one killed, since they obviously didn't want anything else from the bodies. Five fewer dead would have been a bit better. And one dead elephant might not have made IOTD.



glatt  Wednesday Mar 1 02:02 PM

You know what I just realized this picture is? It's a very vivid and graphic portrayal of Tragedy of the Commons in its extreme.



barefoot serpent  Wednesday Mar 1 02:31 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by glatt
You know what I just realized this picture is? It's a very vivid and graphic portrayal of Tragedy of the Commons in its extreme.
Yes, I was just going to say that elephants are often considered a nuisance in Asia and Africa for trampling on or eating farmers crops. The local solution is often as depicted above.


busterb  Wednesday Mar 1 02:44 PM

I'm guessing there's not a lot of firearms (legal) in Sumatra because of the unrest. It still sucks!



xoxoxoBruce  Wednesday Mar 1 06:05 PM

I'm glad they took the tusks from the male. If they try to sell them or even if they just keep them, someone(s) going to find out. Hopefully there will be a reward large enough to cause her/him/them to be caught.



Pancake Man  Wednesday Mar 1 07:03 PM

They can't get their country sorted out, but they can buy and effectively use cyanide? Sounds to me that their priorities are not in order.



Happy Monkey  Wednesday Mar 1 07:20 PM

I'm not sure dumping poison in a water hole requires much organization.



capnhowdy  Wednesday Mar 1 09:13 PM

Sad picture. Pisses me right on off.

I'd like to see a video of these people CANING AN ELEPHANT. Bet that wouldn't last long. Ground Sumatri. I hope they get caught.

Wait till Leah hears about this one.



xoxoxoBruce  Wednesday Mar 1 09:23 PM

She has. I sent it to her before I came to the Cellar today and saw it was the IOtD.



Leah  Wednesday Mar 1 09:23 PM

Ok it's my say now, Bruce did forward the photo to me this morning, cheers Bruce, but I've just logged on and saw the whole story.
Everyone who knows me knows that I love elephants and go to Thailand once a year to be with them, train with them and indeed help them (I'm going again in June for 3 weeks).
All I can say is that I hope the remaining elephants in that park/reserve have the courage and the will to find those responsible and take out revenge, big revenge.
Elephants are very clever animals, they will know who did this by the smell and the tracks of the hunters. They will, in time hunt those hunters responsible for this and trample them to death. I want to read about the revenge plot taken out. You go girls, you go. Take your revenge, I have no sympathy for anyone who does this kind of crime. Cowards, bastards, monsters.



capnhowdy  Wednesday Mar 1 09:38 PM

I told you.



Leah  Wednesday Mar 1 09:45 PM

Ah, you know me well. If I had known it came from the Cellar, I would have been on earlier. Work could have waited, this is much more important then borning work.
Bruce always keeps me up-to-date with things he finds, especially anything he finds about elephants, Sorry Bruce if I've told everyone about your soft spot. Love that guy heaps, he looks after me.
Still pissed about the elephants murdered, just wait for the revenge.



wolf  Thursday Mar 2 01:35 AM

I sincerely hope that in this case karma works in the most people misunderstand it to work. (i.e., immediate, fitting retribution in this lifetime)



York  Thursday Mar 2 02:59 AM

I hope they cath the killers and pull out their teeth one by one and than leave them without water or food...



lumberjim  Thursday Mar 2 06:33 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by glatt

I think of the people who did this as horrible monsters, but I wonder if I'm capable of doing it? If I was a desperate villager with a dying child who needed food or expensive medicine, I'd kill 6 elephants without hesitation if it would get me what I needed. Especially if I was fairly sure I wouldn't get caught.

But sitting here safely behind my clean desk, I think the people who did this are monsters.
I started to go with you there glatt, and imagine myself in that place, but then it started to seem like i was imagining what shit might taste like. there are other ways.


chrisinhouston  Thursday Mar 2 08:44 AM

Interesting that they used potassium cyanide, this is what is typically used to kill off coyotes. The farmer or rancher places a type of gun in the ground and loads it with a dose of potassium cyanide and attaches a form of bait. The unsuspecting coyote comes along, starts sniffing the bait and the gun is triped and fires the dose of poison into the nostrils of the animal, killing them within a few minutes in a painful way. I used to goose hunt in rice fields west of Houston and it was a common practice in some areas so we had to be real careful if using retrievers to get downed birds. Farmers were required to post lots of warning signs.

I would wonder if they did something like this for the elephants as I don't think potassium cyanide has a particulary good taste so it needs to be administired in a way like this. I wonder how much you need to kill an elephant?



Griff  Thursday Mar 2 08:56 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisinhouston
The farmer or rancher places a type of gun in the ground and loads it with a dose of potassium cyanide and attaches a form of bait. The unsuspecting coyote comes along, starts sniffing the bait and the gun is triped and fires the dose of poison into the nostrils of the animal, killing them within a few minutes in a painful way.
Wow, that is so stupid in so many ways.


Kitsune  Thursday Mar 2 09:05 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy Monkey
Elephants, plural? If the poacher had used a gun, the elephant with tusks would probably have been the only one killed, since they obviously didn't want anything else from the bodies. Five fewer dead would have been a bit better. And one dead elephant might not have made IOTD.
From The David Sheldrick Wildlife Trust:

Quote:
In residence at the time was Tsavo's "DIKA", a little Elephant who at 3 months old had witnessed the brutal massacre of his entire family by Somali poacher/bandits, and whose grieving had spanned four long months.
I've always been under the impression that poachers tend to wipe out everything possible, guns or not. I've seen documentaries that detailed the destruction of entire herds, baby elephants and all, with any weapon that would permit it by groups of people. Guns are the norm, but so are deep pits with sharp spikes. The means vary, but the end is always the same.

I find it very sad, but the emotional reaction to it is interesting. I could grab a semi automatic rifle, walk into the woods, and slaughter deer for nothing but fun and be praised as a great sportsman. Posion some elephants to get ivory to make some cash in a country where the economy has all but died and people somehow draw a parallel to domestic abuse.


xoxoxoBruce  Thursday Mar 2 07:08 PM

Quote:
I could grab a semi automatic rifle, walk into the woods, and slaughter deer for nothing but fun and be praised as a great sportsman.
Praised as a great sportsman? No. Accepted as a hunter? Yes.
Because;
It's legal.
You're killing one.
You're not killing babies
Deer are more than abundant.
Presumably,either you or someone else would eat it. Although that's not required, it is expected.


tw  Thursday Mar 2 08:08 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by glatt
I look at this, and just don't get it. ...

Well, I guess after thinking about it, I do know what this is about. The person(s) who did this want money. ...

This is about money and laziness. It makes perfect sense. ...

But sitting here safely behind my clean desk, I think the people who did this are monsters.
One need only go back to the mid 1800s and what the white man did to buffalo. One scene in 'Dances with Wolves' demonstrates the inhumanity.

Elephants are rather intelligent creatures. Park Rangers has determined that elephants somehow knew where park boundaries were. The elephants would sneak off the park at night to go on feeding raids. And then get back inside the park before sun up.

Unfortunately, in some locations, the elephant population has become too large. Too many in the wrong place - too few elsewhere.


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