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   Undertoad  Thursday May 30 01:01 PM

5/20/2002: Earth First tactics

The dude is Redge Peterson. Along with the rest of his friends in Earth First!, he is blocking the entrance to a Forst Service building in Montana. Why: they want to stop the practice of logging of burned trees in a particular national forest.

Their point, I think, is that burned logs are supposed to be heathy for a natural forest. A forest, it turns out, enjoys having some of its bunch burned up every once in a while. Something about the natural decay providing a lush decaying material for future growth -- you know, nature's way and all that.

When they have sit-ins, I'm sure the cops just come and cart their limp bodies off for processing or whatever; so Redge has decided to stick his forearms into drums filled with wet cement.

What do they do with him now?

dave  Thursday May 30 01:25 PM

First, you fudged the date in the topic.

Second... what a dumbass. Is that shit gonna dry? Are his forearms going to be cemented in there? Seems kinda like a lame sacrifice. He should Thich Quang Duc it.

Undertoad  Thursday May 30 01:26 PM

Yikes - I'll fix that date, thanx.

juju2112  Thursday May 30 01:52 PM

What if he gets hungry or has to go to the bathroom? I guess he's just screwed.

Also, what's to stop people from just going around him?

dave  Thursday May 30 01:54 PM

Heh. That was kinda my point, but it got lost in my realization of the absurdity of his method.

I hope, for his sake, that his arms don't end up cemented in there. 'Cause that would <b>really</b> suck.

Nic Name  Thursday May 30 02:09 PM

Nic Name  Thursday May 30 02:25 PM

He looks pretty stupid, but the trick is to set the concrete with arm holes and a metal bar inside for him to grab onto, making it appear that he is set in concrete, until he releases his grip.

How to get him out of it?

Let's play ... Fear Factor.

Joe  Thursday May 30 02:30 PM

how to get him to let go

I saw a show once called "Fire in the Eyes" where the police would approach these protesters who were doing the very same thing, hold the protesters eyelids open and swab pepper spray directly onto their eyeballs with a Q-tip.

It still didn't work.

dave  Thursday May 30 03:14 PM

How do you recommend getting concrete to set with arm holes? What do you recommend putting in there such that it could be removed and still have that area for bar grippage?

Joe  Thursday May 30 03:50 PM


I think they just use something simple like 4" PVC, with a bar inside to grab. A better design would be to have a way you could jam your hand into some kind of constriction so you don't have to rely on muscle strength to hold on, but you could let go if you wished.

These devices are effective. There is no way to make the person let go without harming them. You can't get inside the tubes to pry their fingers loose. The reality of TV coverage makes is such that no police agency will go so far as to break the nonviolent protesters arm or beat them unconcious, though they will use other nonlethal means until the cows come home.

The demonstrators train for this, learning from every protest what works and what does not.

If I were the one that had to move that guy, I'd get a couple dollies or some such device, and cart the drums away together. The guy would come along free of charge.

Tobiasly  Thursday May 30 04:19 PM

Tie a 100-foot coiled chain to one of the barrels. Tie the other end to the back of a pickup truck.

Neutral-drop the pickup, and peel out doing about 4000 RPM. In the time it takes to pick up the slack in the chain, I bet the guy lets go of the bar. :-)

Joe  Thursday May 30 04:27 PM


Everyone thinks like that at first! It's the media coverage that blocks the maneuver. I recall an incident where a guy had used a tube and a car in much the same way, he was under the vehicle and there was no way to get him out. The cops tried everything and he held fast. Finally one became so frustrated he ordered the car towed, with the man still attached. Cooler heads fortunatly prevailed and they got him out some other way.

The idea of these protests is to get on the 6:00 o'clock news, so their story can be told. Once that is accomplished, the mission is accomplished. The people that do this know in advance they will be tortured to some degree and then jailed, they volunteer anyway because they feel so strongly for their cause.

Hubris Boy  Thursday May 30 05:33 PM

I'm thinkin' a Stryker autopsy saw would be just the thing for a situation like this:

Stupid hippie.

Nic Name  Thursday May 30 05:48 PM

How do you recommend getting concrete to set with arm holes? What do you recommend putting in there such that it could be removed and still have that area for bar grippage?
Cardboard or fibre sonotube keeps the concrete from setting in the arm holes. Balled up newspaper around a metal rebar can be wire lashed to the end of the sonotube and then picked out after the concrete sets, to create a void around the rebar grip ... or the rebar can just be pegged through the tubing at arm's length, which is the better idea.

or ... you could just try sticking your arms into wet concrete as originally suggested. Whatever works for you.

Joe  Thursday May 30 06:00 PM

that would work

You could also just leave the rebar in the mix, the ridges would make a perfect roughened surface to grab onto as your corneas are gently annointed with various nonlethal salves and balms.

Attached to the rebar grip handles you could also have momentary switches wired to a couple hundred pounds of TNT cast into the concrete in each barrel, but you'd seriously be pushing the "nutbar" limit then.

Griff  Thursday May 30 09:26 PM

Re: that would work

Originally posted by Joe
... as your corneas are gently annointed with various nonlethal salves and balms.
Nice imagery there.

elSicomoro  Friday May 31 06:12 PM

That's not some guy named Redge Peterson...that's Al Jourgensen of Ministry during one of his heroin-induced psychoses.

zeet  Sunday Jun 2 11:13 AM

In case you want to read the story

It says what happened here:

juju2112  Sunday Jun 2 11:52 AM

Lol... they arrested the poor guy when he went to the bathroom!

Slight  Sunday Jun 2 12:25 PM

Thanks zeet. That article was good.

It reminds me of how protesters have good intentions but tend to think with their hearts. Joe is right about the media coverage angle.

They seem to give up when they don't encounter resistance. Case in point: My mother is pro animal research and is on an animal ethics commitee. She takes it very seriously. Word came that protesters were going to picket our house. My mom used reverse psychology. When they showed, my mother went outside with me, and my sister and our dog and welcomed the protesters. She told them she was happy to let them protest their cause. They did not stay for long. Why protest someone who is not angered by your presence?

This dude seems pretty hoky, if you go to that much trouble (two cemment barrels) giving up after one day cheapens your dignity. Although I guess soiling yourself would do the same.

Seems like you could get them to let go of the bar by simply tickling them. I know one spot that always tickles.

Griff  Sunday Jun 2 08:16 PM

Forgot his protester check list. 1) Depends brand undergarments

CharlieG  Monday Jun 3 08:00 AM

Nice non leathal gas

Simple - Nice tank of Nitrous gas, or an injection - Guy goes to sleep. - Move barrel

Less simple - get a jackhammer, and let him listen as I jackhammer the concrete out of the drum

More fun? As someone said - three dollys and a crane - gently lift

No media around? Chainsaw

No media REALLY around? C4

Best method for GOOD publicity? One feather, one domatrix

spinningfetus  Monday Jun 3 05:38 PM

Even better, use nature against them. Fireants would have him out in a jiffy...

Joe  Monday Jun 3 05:48 PM


Yeah, about half a coffee can full, right down the back of the shirt! He'd be out of there at 90mph, steels drums or no.

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