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   Undertoad  Thursday Dec 13 02:01 PM

12/13: Sydney brothel and signage



It's the inevitable reaction of what to do about every single possible problem that might arise from granting people controlversial freedoms. I don't know how much controversy surrounded the idea of permitting brothels, but now there's a controversy over the signs. On one side, people want to feel that the whole thing is being managed somehow so they feel safer. On the other hand, they don't want a bunch of advertising which may stir up undesirable effect.

So, as far as I can tell, the problem seems to be addressed with massive amounts of bureaucracy. I found one PDF that referenced not only safe sex but zoning, parking of cars, discreet appearances, linen (!), storage and handling of contaminated waste (!), and much more.

All of this pushing against the fact that people <i>pretty much do what they want to do anyway</i>.



dave  Thursday Dec 13 02:46 PM

I still seriously think that legalizing prostitution would be a great idea here in the US. People are going to do what they want to do. Some people like to fuck for money. Some people can't get fucked unless they give up some money. No reason that should be illegal, 'cause no one is getting hurt. Yes, I do think it should be protected sex. I think that licensed prostitutes should be checked for disease every 30 days. I think the government could tax it and make a shitload of money. Plus, prices for the services could go down. People would feel better about spending the money. It's all good, all around. I don't see the problem with it. Seriously. I don't see why it's so taboo. People have sex. People fuck. You wouldn't be here if dad didn't stick his penis in mom, so why do you think it's so bad? Why is a sign such a big deal?



MaggieL  Thursday Dec 13 03:02 PM

Well, it certainly provides the local authorities with some marvelous new opportunities for graft, doesn't it? ;-)

This is the country with a "national continence management strategy", including an interactive Public Toilet Map . I suppose if I was older I might find this governement service to be a blessing. As it is, I'm just bemused by it.



juju2112  Thursday Dec 13 04:39 PM

Personally, I find the idea of "random inspections" kinda creepy.

I mean, you're having your way with some prostitute and then all of a sudden Joe Cop wants to come in and inspect you and make sure you've got your raincoat on? What is that about??

New campaign slogain for Sydney: "Keep the government out of our bedrooms!"



dave  Thursday Dec 13 04:53 PM

I would imagine "random inspections" would be the authorities showing up at the place to make sure they have plenty of condoms, are clean, they take out the "soiled" goods, etc. Just like the restaurant business. I doubt they'd be busting into fuckrooms and demanding proof of protection.



alleycat  Thursday Dec 13 04:54 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by MaggieL
This is the country with a "national continence management strategy", including an interactive Public Toilet Map . I suppose if I was older I might find this governement service to be a blessing. As it is, I'm just bemused by it.
LOL - thanks. that made my afternoon.

and i guess i can see the utility of this, but my oh my, who comes up with these things?

traffic will be easier to take - i'll probably still be chuckling.


dave  Thursday Dec 13 05:09 PM

I didn't want to make a smartass comment about it 'cause I try not to troll, and Jaggypoo might get offended. But... it is pretty humorous I actually went and checked it out. It's godawfully slow for me, but I still got to see it and play around with it.

It's funny to think - will this be built into Australian cars in 10 years?

"Need to piss! Where do I go?"

"Well mate, turn left at this here street up here, and go down 3 blocks. There's a public toilet just on the right."



Whit  Thursday Dec 13 05:29 PM

&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Whoa, at this point we're 6 replies and 62 views into it and no one has protested against publicly licensed prostitution. Didn't expect it to go so one-sided. Doesn't anyone object to this anymore?

&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;For myself I didn't have an opinion on this subject either way untill I was influenced by the words of George Carlin. He said, "If selling is legal and fucking is legal then why isn't selling fucking legal?"

&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;I couldn't argue with that. It just makes sense to me. Of course, I've always leaned towards letting the law protect us from physical harm and leave the morality to individual choice.



Griff  Thursday Dec 13 06:08 PM

Speaking of Jag isn't that the back of his head in the photo? I wonder why he's acting so cool?



Bitman  Thursday Dec 13 10:26 PM

The picture makes it look like the sign is 30 feet up in the air! Who can even read the thing??

What I find truly strange is that the sign is posed in the middle of the street. Why do drivers and passers-by need to know this? Are they worried about streams of fluids running out into the street? Take a hint from the restaurant business, and put the sign in a window of the establishment.

-B



MaggieL  Thursday Dec 13 11:22 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by dhamsaic
I actually went and checked it out. It's godawfully slow for me, but I still got to see it and play around with it.)
I did too, but got bored with waiting for it to load--it does warn that it needs to cache a lot of stuff before it gets rolling. I guess the message here is get your cache loaded before you need to go.


MaggieL  Thursday Dec 13 11:23 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bitman
The picture makes it look like the sign is 30 feet up in the air!
If it wasn't it would probably be stolen for a souvenir within minutes.


elSicomoro  Friday Dec 14 12:08 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by dhamsaic
I still seriously think that legalizing prostitution would be a great idea here in the US.
I don't know the stats, but I don't hear a whole lot of squawking out of Nevada.

Kurt Schmoke proposed making Howard St. in downtown Baltimore a red-light district when he was mayor. San Francisco has the tenderloin district, which might as well be a free-for-all. Hell, we have Walnut and 13th here, along with Hunting Park. I'm all for hookers getting licensed, inspected/tested, the whole 9 yards. Why not?

Although...I still don't get the whole concept of prostitution. Truth be told, I think I could head down to Delaware Ave. or South St. right now at 12:05 am in Philadelphia on a Thursday night/Friday morning, meet a gal, shack up with her, and think nothing of it the next day. Although, that could get a bit messy (feelings).

(And for the record, I could NEVER do something like that. I don't have the cojones, nor the heart.)


lisa  Friday Dec 14 08:32 AM

A friend and I were discussing legal prostution one day and we came up with one comment regarding the conditions of legalization.

Prostitution should never be treated exactly the same as any other job. E.G. If I was collecting unemployment, they should NOT be able to say "What do you mean you can't find a job? There are lots of prostitution jobs available for a woman your age!"

If someone WANTS to do it, MAYBE that's okay. But no one should ever be put in a position of being pressured by any rules or regulations to enter that "business".



alleycat  Friday Dec 14 08:50 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by lisa
A friend and I were discussing legal prostution one day and we came up with one comment regarding the conditions of legalization.

Prostitution should never be treated exactly the same as any other job. E.G. If I was collecting unemployment, they should NOT be able to say "What do you mean you can't find a job? There are lots of prostitution jobs available for a woman your age!"

If someone WANTS to do it, MAYBE that's okay. But no one should ever be put in a position of being pressured by any rules or regulations to enter that "business".
now there's an interesting angle. i personally have no problem with legalized prostitution. but the above raises questions of "how is it different?". anyone sane knows it is, but i'm pointing up the governmental morass you'd have there. i can just imagine the friggin' talking heads now.

arghh. maybe we're better off with it being illegal <g>


Undertoad  Friday Dec 14 10:02 AM

Doesn't differ that much from every other job I've ever had where they've tried to screw me blind.



dave  Friday Dec 14 10:35 AM

Lisa -

Of course. But I seriously doubt it would ever come to that, considering how we look upon prostitution currently. We already know that forcing people into sex acts is bad. But that definitely doesn't mean that sex should be illegal "just in case".

Quote:
If someone WANTS to do it, MAYBE that's okay.
I wonder why you put the "maybe" in caps? As in "MAYBE that's okay... but probably not"? If so, I'm just curious as to how you can feel that MAYBE having sex for money is okay (but maybe restricting what someone can do with their body) but be so adamant about women's rights when it comes to abortion (shouldn't be able to tell someone what to do with their body).

Fucking for money is the same as having a maid clean your house: They provide a service, you provide them money. Yes, penetration generally isn't involved with the maid. But fundamentally, it's the same. I seriously cannot think of a good reason why prostitution is illegal. If the women wants to do it, who are we to tell her that she can't? Right, Lisa?


MaggieL  Friday Dec 14 08:14 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by lisa
A friend and I were discussing legal prostution one day...
You know, for some undefiniable reason I can't explain, that is absolutely the most *Lisa-esque* rationale I have ever heard. :-)

And I've heard a few. :-)


Whit  Friday Dec 14 09:46 PM

From Dham:

Quote:
Fucking for money is the same as having a maid clean your house: They provide a service, you provide them money.
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Um, not quite. You see regardless of if it should be legal or not there is a serious social stigma. Ever seen the movie 'Strange Days'? There's a scene where it appears that Juliet Lewis (I think...) is being raped and murdered. This chic that was a friend of a friend saw that and stated rather flatly, "She deserves it, she's a whore." I rather went ballistic, we had a major scene, not the point.

&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Point is, people take offense to anyone that provides such a 'service'. I don't agree nor do I know why, doesn't matter really. The stigma exists so we should acknowledge it. It's not the same, not even close.

&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;By the by, prostitution is obviously a dangerous job. Last I heard the unemployment office couldn't demand that a high risk job was accepted. I can't give any specific code or such, maybe I'm wrong. I do feel pretty sure about this though.


dave  Friday Dec 14 10:18 PM

You are missing my point.

Break it down. Service for money. That is what it is.

50 years ago, there was a social stigma around interracial sex. Did that make it any different from sex? No. It was still sex.

What I am saying is that the social stigma is unjust, and if people would open their fucking eyes, they would see that, at its most basic, prostitution is providing a service and getting paid for it.



Whit  Friday Dec 14 10:52 PM

&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;I understood your point. Hell, I even agree with you. I just think you're oversimplifying. Today it's a major issue and it really doesn't matter if the stigma is stupid or old fashion. If you trade cash for sex alot of assholes will think you're lower than dirt for it and treat you worse. Particularly if you are a woman. I don't get it myself, but it is true. If you break it down to simple function you're ignoring the after effects recieved from others. I don't think that's legit.
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Not to sound condescending but did you read my posts? I obviously think the stigma is unjust. I even stated that I previously had a problem with someone of (ahem) a differing view point. The stigma exists, it won't go away just because we ignore it. It's not the same. Even if it should be.



serge  Saturday Dec 15 02:29 PM

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/wor...00/1712557.stm



dave  Saturday Dec 15 05:33 PM

Aye.

Of course I read your posts. And I included the interracial thing for a reason:

If you work against it, eventually it will go away.

If we legalized prostitution now, it would seem absolutely normal in 50 years. There would be no stigma around it. Maybe with a few, but the vast majority of people would be down with it. I guess maybe I didn't explain that enough, but I figured you would catch it (and I think I was short on time, too). But that was my point there - of course there will be a problem right now. "All new truths begin as heresy." Just saying, I don't think that we should let that stop us.



jaguar  Saturday Dec 15 09:35 PM

There is a brothel less than 200m from my school. It was allowed to stay because it was older than the schoool. Which was the first in the state....

Afterschool activicy - Bag clients as they come out, endless fun of redred faces.

Griff - i live in melbourne =p

and have red hair.
hmph =p

Now i have to agree iwth MaggieL, that would be a very cool sign to screw to your bedroom door.



elSicomoro  Saturday Dec 15 10:16 PM

For some reason, this reminds me of an incident that happened in Philadelphia over the summer.

This storefront in Tacony (a neighborhood in NE Philadelphia) was raided over the summer. Apparently, the folks that were renting it were into sado-masochistic kinda stuff. If I recall correctly, they were charged with soliciting prostitution, but they claimed that that was not the case.

And what were those folks fronting as a storefront? A place called S & M Computers.



elSicomoro  Saturday Dec 15 10:20 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by dhamsaic
50 years ago, there was a social stigma around interracial sex. Did that make it any different from sex? No. It was still sex.
There is STILL a social stigma about interracial sex. Not nearly bad as before, but bad still.

Of course, it can depend on where you live. If Rho and I lived in St. Louis, we might have been greeted with a burning cross on our lawn.


juju2112  Saturday Dec 15 10:47 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by dhamsaic

Fucking for money is the same as having a maid clean your house: They provide a service, you provide them money. Yes, penetration generally isn't involved with the maid. But fundamentally, it's the same.
Hey, now THERE's a cool business plan. A nice-looking lady comes to your house, cleans it, and then fucks you. It could be called the "Full Service Plan".
<br><br>It'd be great for people who didn't want to get married.
<br><br>


MaggieL  Saturday Dec 15 11:08 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by juju2112

Hey, now THERE's a cool business plan. A nice-looking lady comes to your house, cleans it, and then fucks you. It could be called the "Full Service Plan".
It'd be great for people who didn't want to get married.
It would certainly be a more honest expression of what some guys expect when they get married. :-)

All things considered, I'd say the sex should come before the housework, though.


dave  Sunday Dec 16 01:48 PM

Well syc, the world is definitely opening up. Give it some more time. Location does have a big part in it - if you lived in Carroll County, MD, you probably *would* have been greeted with a great number of burning crosses on your front lawn "Where the men are men and the sheep are scared", they say. Well. I do, anyway. God. Fucking rhymed again.

I remember that S&M Computers thing - it was an IotD a long long time ago. Or was in a backlog cleaning. That was a rather humorous story

Maggie - why do you figure the sex should come before the cleaning? The "mess" created by sex, or something else?



MaggieL  Sunday Dec 16 04:15 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by dhamsaic

Maggie - why do you figure the sex should come before the cleaning? The "mess" created by sex, or something else?
Because somebody not yet worn out by housework is likely to be (and *have*) more fun in bed.


elSicomoro  Sunday Dec 16 04:35 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by dhamsaic
Well syc, the world is definitely opening up. Give it some more time. Location does have a big part in it - if you lived in Carroll County, MD, you probably *would* have been greeted with a great number of burning crosses on your front lawn "Where the men are men and the sheep are scared", they say. Well. I do, anyway. God. Fucking rhymed again.
I believe Rho refers to Carroll County as Klanland. Not like I would ever live there...there's nothing there.


dave  Sunday Dec 16 05:10 PM

Carroll County == Asshole of the World. It's a great big poopchute of a county. The populace is probably only 30% redneck or so, but they're so fucking noticeable that they pretty much ruin it. It's just about all you see - redneck here, redneck there...



MaggieL  Sunday Dec 16 05:22 PM

Well, they have a nice airport. :-)



dave  Sunday Dec 16 05:51 PM

Clearview?

My dad's Cessna used to be parked there. It was fun flying out of there. I always enjoyed that. He hasn't flown in years though...



MaggieL  Sunday Dec 16 06:52 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by dhamsaic
Clearview?
Actually, I was thinking of Carroll Counrty Regional Airport, Poage Field (DMW) . I've never been to Clearview Airpark (2W2), although it looks like a nice little place....similar to Perkiomen Valley Airport (N10), where I lerned to fly.


dave  Monday Dec 17 12:11 AM

Where is that in Carroll County? North or south? Just curious - never heard of it. Clearview is a nice little place though.



Whit  Monday Dec 17 12:38 AM

Sex before housework.

Quote:
Originaly posted by MaggieL
Because somebody not yet worn out by housework is likely to be (and *have*) more fun in bed.
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Oh, and here I thought the sex came after the housework so the woman in question would have something to do after the guy rolled over and went to sleep. J/K


CharlieG  Monday Dec 17 08:03 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by MaggieL

Because somebody not yet worn out by housework is likely to be (and *have*) more fun in bed.

Gad, now you've got the Kliensleep jingle going through my head


russotto  Monday Dec 17 01:41 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by dhamsaic
It's funny to think - will this be built into Australian cars in 10 years?

"Need to piss! Where do I go?"

"Well mate, turn left at this here street up here, and go down 3 blocks. There's a public toilet just on the right."
Of course, it'll be sponsored by the brothels, so it'll end with

"And if there's something else you'd be wanting to do with that thing, Miss Kitty's is another 2 blocks down. Her toilets are cleaner than that filthy public one too, mate."


MaggieL  Monday Dec 17 03:39 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by dhamsaic
Where is that in Carroll County? North or south? Just curious - never heard of it. Clearview is a nice little place though.
Judging by my chart, about 8 miles almost due north of Clearview, perhaps a mile or two north of Westminster.


BrianR  Tuesday Dec 18 05:16 PM

S&M Computers

A personal connection here...

And that sign can be blamed on ME!

It was my idea. But I was JOKING! I swear! Next thing you know, I drove by and there it was! I groaned loud enough to stop traffic.

Update on legal situation: none. The judge in the case has yet to decide if a trial is warranted or or not. The NCSF has gotten involved and is helping to defend the two women against the charges.

I know the older of the two and can honestly say that she deserves what she is getting. She's dangerous to her clients and is a liar, a cheat and a thief not to mention a sociopath by any definition.

I will stand by my personal conviction that prostitution should be legal and controlled (ie health inspections, BBB membership, zoning ETC).

Comments invited.

Brian



serge  Saturday Dec 22 08:43 AM

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/wor...00/1723583.stm

Quote:
Sex romps are being given out as Christmas bonuses by some of Australia's biggest retailers.
Sales staff are increasingly being offered sex parties at brothels instead of cash.



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