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   Undertoad  Monday Jan 9 06:16 PM

1/9/2006: Dog fight



Sad one today. xoB/WaPo gets us this shot of a dogfight in Kabul, Afghanistan, where apparently this remains a lively hobby.



mrnoodle  Monday Jan 9 06:31 PM

I guess it's a real sign of my evilness/callousness/whatever, but for some reason that picture doesn't elicit an emotional response in me at all. I feel bad in a remote way for the dogs because they're bloodied. But are they being truly abused? Any more than a professional boxer is abused? Common sense tells me that sure, they probably are. But look at the drugs, the physical beating, the long-term neurological effects of boxing.

Holes galore in my theory, I know. But the dogfighting thing has never really triggered my animal protection instinct (and yes, I have one).



Sun_Sparkz  Monday Jan 9 06:37 PM

Boxers choose to fight. boxers wear big thick gloves and mouth guards and get paid lots of money. The dont get limbs torn off, repeatedly bitten, and often die.. for nothing. Worse than nothing.

Look at these men in the shot.. shadows of men. pathetic. I hope one day the dogs turn on them.



capnhowdy  Monday Jan 9 06:40 PM

I would be WAY more entertained if the guys watching were fighting. Talk about pass the buck.

Contraversial......to say the least.



capnhowdy  Monday Jan 9 06:42 PM

please correct my spelling.



Leah  Monday Jan 9 07:37 PM

The photo shows two more dogs in the background ready to fight. They are sick people and yes I agree let the coward men fight and we'll happily watch them pull each other apart and draw blood. Makes me sad.



footfootfoot  Monday Jan 9 09:11 PM

Totally fucked up. People can be such assholes.



busterb  Monday Jan 9 09:42 PM

[quote=
Holes galore in my theory, I know. But the dogfighting thing has never really triggered my animal protection instinct (and yes, I have one).[/QUOTE]
1st some dogs won't fight. Most dogs won't fight a bitch dog. My house dog will catch a cat, squrrel, rat or what ever. But won't fight another dog. She keeps them off my place though. I see a some replys from downunder. Do You think it was right years ago when a litter of pups were put it with sheep and the ones that didn't show any interest in sheep were took by hind legs and slammed on a fence post. Hey I love dogs and have had them as long as I can remember. I've never been to a paid dog fight, rooster or a chicken squat



xoxoxoBruce  Monday Jan 9 10:32 PM

I think they need more electronic toys, TVs, PCs and whorehouses.



gaidin  Tuesday Jan 10 12:02 AM

there are more important things in the world to be offended and worried about than dog fights. and i know people gonna say i'm not being sympathetic but i am. i don't think it should happen but there are worse things.



wolf  Tuesday Jan 10 03:12 AM

I'll put $10 on the gold ...



VinDurzle  Tuesday Jan 10 05:18 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sun_Sparkz
Boxers choose to fight. boxers wear big thick gloves and mouth guards and get paid lots of money. The dont get limbs torn off, repeatedly bitten, and often die.. for nothing. Worse than nothing.

Look at these men in the shot.. shadows of men. pathetic. I hope one day the dogs turn on them.

Hmmm Shadows of men - hardly surprising after Russian and subsequent Taliban cultural opression. Pathetic - an interesting way to describe one of the greatest warrior races on the face of the planet.


Trilby  Tuesday Jan 10 07:34 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by VinDurzle
Hmmm Shadows of men - hardly surprising after Russian and subsequent Taliban cultural opression. Pathetic - an interesting way to describe one of the greatest warrior races on the face of the planet.
Yeah, Sun Sparkz got it right. They are pathetic shadows of men. The world doesn't need warrior races. What was it Ghandi said..."The greatness of a nation and it's moral progress can be judged by the way it's animals are treated"...something like that.


smithgr  Tuesday Jan 10 08:18 AM

Are you sure this isn't Detroit, Michigan?



VinDurzle  Tuesday Jan 10 10:12 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brianna
Yeah, Sun Sparkz got it right. They are pathetic shadows of men. The world doesn't need warrior races. What was it Ghandi said..."The greatness of a nation and it's moral progress can be judged by the way it's animals are treated"...something like that.
Who said the world needed them - Im just suggesting that they deserve a little more respect than being written off for a pass time that is tradition.

The Afghan has many such traditions - beheaded calves are fought over on horse back and quails fight to the death.

I suggest your opinion of the men reflects only your personal feelings regarding their persuits not a true representation of the individuals portrayed.

Tradition alone is no justification for the acts in progress, however dogs fight, life goes on.

As for Judging a country by how it treats its animals, hats off to Ghandi - How can you judge a country by the actions of individuals at large within its boundaries? We are all responisble for our own actions.


mrnoodle  Tuesday Jan 10 10:51 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sun_Sparkz
Boxers choose to fight. boxers wear big thick gloves and mouth guards and get paid lots of money. The dont get limbs torn off, repeatedly bitten, and often die.. for nothing. Worse than nothing.

Look at these men in the shot.. shadows of men. pathetic. I hope one day the dogs turn on them.
Mike Tyson is a whole lot like one of those dogs -- he even bites parts off. And for what? Sure, he got a big paycheck, but his handlers got the lion's share. And he's a wreck of a human being. What does money mean to him now?

Take a look at the face of either boxer at the end of 12 rounds: Does it look like their soft cushy gloves and mouthguards saved them from harm?

The only difference in this spectacle and one at Caesar's Palace is the price of the ticket and the amount of money the bookies take in. Whether it's a dog, a quail, or a human being, a fighter serves only one purpose in today's society: to entertain people who like to watch fighting. Whether that's right or wrong is in the eye of the beholder, but let's not fool ourselves into thinking that we're somehow more "cultured" than these Afghani goons.


VinDurzle  Tuesday Jan 10 11:18 AM

nice mrnoodle nice....



Trilby  Tuesday Jan 10 11:51 AM

I don't think that *I* or *we* (meaning the US/UK or similar) is more cultured. I think the majority of us are more civilized (note I said 'majority'. I worked with a woman whose husband had fighting chickens. Gross.) Fighting for sport, whether man or beast, is not very civilized. It certainly can be part of the culture, though.



Wombat  Tuesday Jan 10 06:59 PM

Whenever I see two dogs meet they always wag their tails and sniff each other's butts. What makes these ones fight?



xoxoxoBruce  Tuesday Jan 10 07:26 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by gaidin
there are more important things in the world to be offended and worried about than dog fights. and i know people gonna say i'm not being sympathetic but i am. i don't think it should happen but there are worse things.
Welcome to the Cellar, gaiden. Of course your right, but we can't bitch about more than 1 or 2 a day. Stick around and we'll get to your pet peeve eventually. Better yet, submit your bitches in a forum thread and make the Cellar and the World a better place.


Sun_Sparkz  Wednesday Jan 11 01:24 AM

Boxers have one thing these dogs dont have: CHOICE. they can walk away and be a bricky, a builder, a pilot, a dole bludger. These dogs dont have that choice, they are mistreated animals, bred to be aggressive and forced to fight their peers whether they like it or not. The people who get financial gain from this firstly should be ashamed, and people who see this as entertainment should be equally ashamed.



joelnwil  Wednesday Jan 11 08:30 AM

I think that this just shows that there are parts of the world where civilization has been slow to come. Of course, there were some people in Virginia doing cock fights, but at least it was illegal.

What on earth is a dole bludger? Does it pay well? Should I come out of retirement to be one?



wolf  Wednesday Jan 11 11:17 AM

Australian slang gets a bit wacky sometimes, but I think it means a lazy person on welfare and/or unemployment.



fargon  Wednesday Jan 11 12:55 PM

I makes me sad, but we cant say any thing about thier culture. I am gonna cry now.



Troubleshooter  Wednesday Jan 11 01:55 PM

Why not?

If no one ever said anything we'd never actually get anything accomplished towards fixing things that are wrong.



xoxoxoBruce  Wednesday Jan 11 04:51 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wombat
Whenever I see two dogs meet they always wag their tails and sniff each other's butts. What makes these ones fight?
Maybe they feel they're defending their masters?


warch  Wednesday Jan 11 05:04 PM

Quien es mas macho?!
Pretty universal drive, it seems.



capnhowdy  Wednesday Jan 11 06:25 PM

For thousands of years we have endeavored to domesticate these animals, with the result of profound comradery.
Most of them will protect us with their lives. This is their reward? Come on.... this is just downright wrong.
Plus..... they have eyebrows.

For me to encourage my dog(s) .... I have three, to fight would be the same TO ME as allowing my kids to fight outside of self defense. But what do I know. We won't be having any dog fights at Capnhowdy's house. I won't be a spectator either. So there.

If folks want to ram a pineapple up their ass, then they may do so. I think I'll pass. Likewise w/ the dog fights.



keryx  Wednesday Jan 11 10:41 PM

Dog fighting. Repulsive. I think that a culture that condemns rather than condones animal fighting would have the edge on that moral question.

I don't like human fighting, either. But humans can and will make decisions that only hurt themselves. It's their life.

Fighting dogs are trained that way, by humans; it's stupid human decisions, not dog decisions, that bring about these situations, so ultimately the humans are at fault. It's abuse of an animal that we have over thousands of years bred to be a companion.



Sundae  Thursday Jan 12 04:31 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by wolf
Australian slang gets a bit wacky sometimes, but I think it means a lazy person on welfare and/or unemployment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by fargon
I makes me sad, but we cant say any thing about thier culture. I am gonna cry now.
Harsh words about Australia surely


Sun_Sparkz  Thursday Jan 12 05:17 AM

haha hey yeah!! screw you guys.. im goin home!



xoxoxoBruce  Thursday Jan 12 09:32 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by keryx
snip~~ It's abuse of an animal that we have over thousands of years bred to be a companion.
I'd take issue with that. Except for a tiny handfull of wealthy people, dogs were not bred to be companions.
They were bred to work, earn their keep or they didn't last long. Along with the obvious guard duties, they were bred to hunt, to haul packs, pull carts & sleds, herd livestock, etc.......and entertain people in blood sports.
Being a companion has always been secondary to their duties until the last 100 years or so, we've seen the evolution of the dog as a pet.


Quote:
haha hey yeah!! screw you guys.. im goin home!
In that order?


Kitsune  Friday Jan 13 09:15 AM

Interesting tradition, but I'd have to say that people being entertained by this set off the same alarm bells as when you find a child that finds enjoyment in pulling the legs off of frogs and the vivisection of squirrels. Along the lines of "future serial killer", etc.



kkevin989  Thursday Jan 4 06:20 PM

well theres differences



ok. well there are some things alike for all of these animals as well as people. Now im not saying that this is not depressing and that i dont have feelings for these dogs. But these dogs are trained to fight. thats what they were breaded/trained growing up to do. Boxers are trained to do this. So other then the fact that its not their choice, its not like they dont know how to do this. theyve done it their entire lives. altho i still think these people should go and get some therapy. this is also how THEY make THEIR living. its not their fault that some people just arnt smart enough for a real job. think about all those people. they could have had a LOT of proloms growing up. they could have a.d.d or a.d.h.d. over their they dont have nor can afford medication for those things. so some low life scum have to resort to un humanly things. hence dog fighting. thats all i have to say.



wolf  Thursday Jan 4 06:23 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by kkevin989 View Post
thats all i have to say
Uh ... okay.


capnhowdy  Thursday Jan 4 10:39 PM

..quite moving..



SPUCK  Friday Jan 5 05:19 AM

Quote:
thats what they were breaded/trained growing up to do
I (also) hate breaded dog.. Breaded chicken is much better.


DanaC  Friday Jan 5 05:34 AM

It does upset me to see dogs fight like this. Wild dogs would not fight to death, it goes against every instinct in them. Generally speaking, most mammalian species will not fight one of their own kind to the death (there are exceptions). It is unnatural. Fairly typical of man though, to breed/train animals into doing something unnatural.

I don't think we should dismiss those men as pathetic shadows of men though. We know nothing of them, we know nothing of what they have experienced, survived, or sacrficed in their lives. If they are pathetic shadows of men for watching and participating in such a sport, then we can dismiss most humans through most of history in the same way.

The men for whom we should reserve that revulsion are those who continue such sports in a country where people are fully aware of animal rights and where the sports have been banned and publicised as cruel for a long time. There are men in my own country (I am assuming it's mainly men) who breed and train dogs for such fighting. Now they are worth contempt.



Griff  Friday Jan 5 07:21 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by wolf View Post
Uh ... okay.
Are you laying odds on waiting period spam? It is going to be interesting watching them get caught in the screen.


wolf  Friday Jan 5 12:05 PM

That's pretty much what I was assuming.



monster  Friday Jan 5 10:07 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by smithgr View Post
Are you sure this isn't Detroit, Michigan?
Yup, we ain't got no snow.....


monster  Friday Jan 5 10:11 PM

(and they're not wearing their pants with their crotch around their knees)



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